BATTLE CREEK COLLECTION

COINCLTR

How much premium is realistic on a BATTLE CREEK collection Morgan Dollar. Many are with the NGC star designation for great toning.
My question would be how much for a

BATTLE CREEK NGC MS 63 STAR-
BATTLE CREEK NGC MS 64 STAR-
BATTLE CREEK NGC MS 65 STAR-

The pedigree is worth how much and the toning is worth how much?

Thanks.

poorguy

Many are with the NGC star designation for great toning.

Make sure you evaluate each coin independently. Don't rely on a star on a battle creek coin to identify it as attractively toned. NGC handed out stars on the battle creek coins like tic tacs at a halitosis convention.

kryptonitecomics

You can't look at it that cut and dry......the quality of the toning, Eye appeal and grade all go together to make up the final price. Some of the Battle Creek MS64* went for a few hundred and some went for $8,000 to $10,000 so each coin must be looked at on an individual basis. The color is thr driver of the price on these more that the grade or the Pedigree.

I would think that the addition of the Pedigree and Star designation is driving prices higher......but the percentage of lift can not be calculated across all of the coins. If you are wanting to buy toned coins there is no price guide so you have to determine what a fair price is for yourself.......what price are you comfortable paying

jamesfsm

Incorrect. The Battle Creek coins were purchased for the most part already NGC Starred** and then they were reholdered with the existing grade but with the "Battle Creek" pedigree added.

COINCLTR

Thanks for the reply, and you are correct that the star seems to be on almost all Battle Creek Morgans with even the smallest sliver of toning. Just wondered what premium Battle Creek carries- if any.

XpipedreamR

<< <i>Incorrect. The Battle Creek coins were purchased for the most part already NGC Starred** and then they were reholdered with the existing grade but with the "Battle Creek" pedigree added. >>






I thought the BC coins came out of bags, submitted to NGC that way, and the ones that got the * were labeled BC

CarlWohlforth

For me the pedigree is interesting, but not worth anything. I don't collect coins by pedigree.

So, for me, %100 of the value is in the coin itself.

RYK

A couple years from now, I doubt that more than a few will remember what the Battle Creek Collection was.

Connecticoin

<< <i>A couple years from now, I doubt that more than a few will remember what the Battle Creek Collection was. >>



Morgan collectors, especially toned Morgan collectors will likely remember the Battle Creek hoard for at least a decade or two.

CalGold

There was no Battle Creek "collection." They weren't graded and then reholdered so far as we know. A dealer acquired several bags of dollars that contained a sizable number of toned coins. It is generally thought that there were nine bags. The coins are dated 1886, 1887 and 1904-o. The dealer cut a deal wtih NGC for bulk grading of the toners and NGC agreed to put the Battle Creek moniker on the slabs. NGC handed out star ratings like the star was going out of style, so coins with small crescent got the same star as the incredible monster toners.

There is a lot of info about this on the TCCS website at tonedcoins.org.

CG

JrGMan2004

Like someone once told me, the value of the pedigree is only how much that pedigree is worth to you... a lot of dealers aren't going to give two flips if this Morgan came from Joe Schmoes Shoe Box of Morgans Collector, or the Battle Creek Collection... pedigrees generally only matter to specialists... like I don't expect a type collector to put much value to a Logan or Reiver bust coin, b/c they were bust specialists, but might put some value in an Eliasburg piece... so it just boils down to how much the pedigree is worth to you...

kryptonitecomics

<< <i>

<< <i>A couple years from now, I doubt that more than a few will remember what the Battle Creek Collection was. >>



Morgan collectors, especially toned Morgan collectors will likely remember the Battle Creek hoard for at least a decade or two. >>



Or longer.........

The Continental Bank Hoard is still very much on the minds of Toned Morgan collectors and that happened back in 1982


The Continental-Illinois National Bank Hoard


The Continental-Illinois National Bank Hoard.

The grand-daddy of all coin hoards, and the leading example of a successful hoard dispersal in all senses of the term, must be the Continental-Illinois National Bank hoard of silver dollars in the early 1980s.

Banks are required by federal law to keep a certain percentage of their “deposits” in cash at all times as one of their federal reserve requirements. For more than a century, it seems, the Continental-Illinois National Bank in Chicago kept a portion of its reserves in original mint bags of silver dollars.

Because of the bank’s financial difficulties in the early 1980s, the Board of Directors of the bank decided to sell the bags for the significant profit that they were worth over their face value, to help soften the financial crisis that so many banks were facing at the time.

Beginning in 1982 and lasting for several years, as many as 1,000 original bags of brilliant uncirculated Morgan silver dollars, and another 500 bags of circulated silver dollar, came out of this hoard. That means more than 1.5 million coins! The majority were common dates: 1879-S, 1880-S, 1881-S, 1882-S, 1883-O, 1884-O, 1885-O, 1886-P and 1887-P. There were a dozen or so bags each of 1883-P and 1884-P and a few more single bags of some other dates. Beyond the sheer numbers, the condition of the coins was remarkable. Many from this hoard were absolutely breathtaking gems, exhibiting incredible cartwheel luster, magnificent rainbow toning, and outstanding proof-like strikes.

Marketing of the Continental-Illinois National Bank hoard was handled in model fashion. From the very start, the two or three major retailers who were charged with organizing the dispersal understood that the greatest benefit to all would be obtained by utilizing the abilities of the entire industry, wholesalers and retailers alike. By establishing an extremely wide distribution channel, they could rely upon the grass-roots marketing efforts of mail order and storefront dealers, and millions of customers would be reached directly. The combination of product, story, and price was a perfect fit for them. Extraordinary demand was created, and because so much of the industry was involved, the after-market support was firmly in place and demand for the hoard coins continued to build.

As a result of this successful dispersal strategy, the entire silver dollar market grew for the next five years. From 1982 to 1985, for example, Morgan Silver Dollars in MS 65 increased in average value by 450%! Collectors and investors alike were happy, and the hobby enjoyed a wonderful resurgence.

CalGold

<< <i>By establishing an extremely wide distribution channel, they could rely upon the grass-roots marketing efforts of mail order and storefront dealers, and millions of customers would be reached directly. The combination of product, story, and price was a perfect fit for them. Extraordinary demand was created, and because so much of the industry was involved, the after-market support was firmly in place and demand for the hoard coins continued to build.

As a result of this successful dispersal strategy, the entire silver dollar market grew for the next five years. From 1982 to 1985, for example, Morgan Silver Dollars in MS 65 increased in average value by 450%! Collectors and investors alike were happy, and the hobby enjoyed a wonderful resurgence. >>



Does anyone recall what prices these common coins were sold for? These two paragraphs makes me think of a telemarketing ripoff of the public selling common coins to non-collectors and would be "investors" at inflated prices.

CG

airplanenut

<< <i>There was no Battle Creek "collection." They weren't graded and then reholdered so far as we know. A dealer acquired several bags of dollars that contained a sizable number of toned coins. It is generally thought that there were nine bags. The coins are dated 1886, 1887 and 1904-o. The dealer cut a deal wtih NGC for bulk grading of the toners and NGC agreed to put the Battle Creek moniker on the slabs. NGC handed out star ratings like the star was going out of style, so coins with small crescent got the same star as the incredible monster toners.

There is a lot of info about this on the TCCS website at tonedcoins.org.

CG >>

Actually, the only coins to receive the BC designation on the holder were the ones that starred... sadly, many of those pieces deserve no special mention.

COINCLTR

Thanks for all of the opinions. It justified my thought that many of these do not rate a star. So some dealer cut a deal with NGC and then NGC whored out the coveted star-nice.

New to forum and like what I see, thank you.

morgannut2

To answer your question I paid:
-----
MS63* $210
MS64* $1,150
MS65* $160
--------
So, I would say it's totally depends on the eye appeal of each coin. The one thing you do get is
certainty the toning is no questions natural bag toning, which I guess is worth something. But as far
as price, the star and holder means very little.

kryptonitecomics

<< <i>To answer your question I paid:
-----
MS63* $210
MS64* $1,150
MS65* $160
--------
So, I would say it's totally depends on the eye appeal of each coin. The one thing you do get is
certainty the toning is no questions natural bag toning, which I guess is worth something. But as far
as price, the star and holder means very little. >>



In the case of the BC....I would have to agree with you.....way too liberal handing out the star so the star means a lot less on BC coins then on other toned coins.

Longacre

<< <i>A couple years from now, I doubt that more than a few will remember what the Battle Creek Collection was. >>



I agree

bestclser1

<< <i>How much premium is realistic on a BATTLE CREEK collection Morgan Dollar. Many are with the NGC star designation for great toning.
My question would be how much for a

BATTLE CREEK NGC MS 63 STAR-
BATTLE CREEK NGC MS 64 STAR-
BATTLE CREEK NGC MS 65 STAR-

The pedigree is worth how much and the toning is worth how much?

Thanks. >>

Record prices for the best 63*3750 64*$5125 65*$7850 AND 66* $12,150.These record prices were brought in 4 sessions by Superior last year.Aftermarket prices brought subsequent record prices.These numbers were for the best of the best.

pontiacinf

<< <i>Many are with the NGC star designation for great toning.

Make sure you evaluate each coin independently. Don't rely on a star on a battle creek coin to identify it as attractively toned. NGC handed out stars on the battle creek coins like tic tacs at a halitosis convention. >>



very well said brandon