Non-numismatic provenance for coins: what of it?

RYK

Would you be interested in owning coins with a connection to an important non-collector, providing of course that such connection could be established beyond doubt? An 1818 large cent once owned by Thomas Jefferson? A seated quarter owned by Civil War General James Longstreet? A common date Indian cent owned by Thomas Edison? A BTW commem owned by MLK? Is there such a niche in numismatics?

nankraut

er....no

morgannut2

Hopefully I'm the whole niche!! I have an General Eisenhower (cents), a Rockefeller (dimes), a President Johnson (clad quarter)--all documented-- with a few others.

CalGold

I would like to own the dollar George Washington threw across the Potomoc. I'd also would like to own the axe he used to chop down the cherry tree.

CG

morgannut2

<< <i>I would like to own the dollar George Washington threw across the Potomoc. I'd also would like to own the axe he used to chop down the cherry tree.

CG >>



The Potomac is a mile wide at Mt. Vernon, but they do sell a few dozen of Washinton's axes every year on Ebay!!

Mercury

If it could be documented, I would think it would be desirable to people outside the collector community. I would personally find it desirable, however, I would think people intrested in Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, etc. would also find the item intresting, even if they had no intrest in coins. Therefore, the price could be higher that the regular ? coin being sold.

Mercury

morgannut2

I don't think there's much dispute that al of the 1792 1/2 dimses were the property of George Washington at some point. They are very neat coins on their own, but part of the interest-- at least in small part-- might be also their ex: owner. What did the holed, bent, etc. one bring this weekend at Heritage, $15000?

lkenefic

Good question...there's a huge markup in firearms that can be definitively linked to a famous [or infamous] owner. Bat Mastersons' Colt SAA is up for bid at 75K. Most other Colt' with out the same pedigree wouldn't fetch 1/10 that price tag. One of Theodore Roosevelts' safari guns [aWinchester rifle in .405 cal] went for over 100K...not bad for a $1000 rifle.

Leo

Coinosaurus

Absolutely. Remember those Jackie Onassis halves (circulated Kennedys) that sold for several hundred bucks each?

coindeuce

Isn't that like asking someone "would you rather own an Elvis Presley guitar or a Jimi Hendrix guitar?". They're both iconic figures to the rock'n roll world, but each item could be considered more important for their own set of reasons to each individual. If I know a coin is nearly unique by issue or by survival, I would consider that much more intriguing than who was the caretaker or user of it previously.

morgannut2

Coindeuce is sure correct--last time I checked those nice pre-1965 Fenders that Hendrix used were starting at $30,000 - Who cares about a plain-jane acoustic that Elvis used for a day?

StrikeOutXXX

I think inevitably, there would be premiums on the coins based on the "Status" of the past owner. Like you said though, provided the connection could be authenticated.

Although not quite like Jefferson, Longstreet, or Edison, look at the celebrity (past) owners of vehicles on the Barrett Jackson auctions. When vehicles that sell for $100,000 any day of the week, go for multiples of 2x to 10x that but because Elvis, Sammy Hagar, Tim Allen, Randy Jackson, or any of the other celebrities that own/owned the vehicle in the past.

Imagine if they add more pedigree info on the slabs and added a line/block/space for "Previously Owned By" POB: Elvis Presley
Geez, think of the Registry games that would be played with all of those combinations.

bhartman35

<< <i>

<< <i>I would like to own the dollar George Washington threw across the Potomoc. I'd also would like to own the axe he used to chop down the cherry tree.

CG >>



The Potomac is a mile wide at Mt. Vernon, but they do sell a few dozen of Washinton's axes every year on Ebay!! >>



Out of curiosity, exactly why did ol' George supposedly throw a dollar across the river? Was he trying to bean a Readcoat in the head? That never made sense to me, even as a legend.

ms70

I'd rather have a coin pedigreed to people who made history than people who simply had enough money to put together a great collection.

PerryHall

<< <i>I'd rather have a coin pedigreed to people who made history than people who simply had enough money to put together a great collection. >>



I absolutely agree. I'd rather own the saint double eagle owned by Teddy Rosevelt than the one owned by Eliasberg.

Gemini

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>I would like to own the dollar George Washington threw across the Potomoc. I'd also would like to own the axe he used to chop down the cherry tree.

CG >>



The Potomac is a mile wide at Mt. Vernon, but they do sell a few dozen of Washinton's axes every year on Ebay!! >>



Out of curiosity, exactly why did ol' George supposedly throw a dollar across the river? Was he trying to bean a Readcoat in the head? That never made sense to me, even as a legend. >>

Actually in the original tale the river was the Rappahannock and not the Potomic and if George did throw a silver dollar across the river it wasn't a U.S. dollar thats for sure.

DNADave

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>I would like to own the dollar George Washington threw across the Potomoc. I'd also would like to own the axe he used to chop down the cherry tree.

CG >>



The Potomac is a mile wide at Mt. Vernon, but they do sell a few dozen of Washinton's axes every year on Ebay!! >>



Out of curiosity, exactly why did ol' George supposedly throw a dollar across the river? Was he trying to bean a Readcoat in the head? That never made sense to me, even as a legend. >>

Actually in the original tale the river was the Rappahannock and not the Patomic and if George did throw a silver dollar across it wasn't a U.S. dollar that's for sure. >>




An 1818 history book I have calls it the "Potow'mack" river. Thats what it was known as back then.

FWIW. I like to think that all of my early halves had the chance of being owened and spent by Jefferson.

TorinoCobra71

Nope!


TC71

messydesk

You mean like coins that were used to pay the designer of the coin?

Shamika

How about a State Quarter owned by Britney Spears or a Bison nickel owned by Ben Affleck.

RYK

How about a State Quarter owned by Britney Spears or a Bison nickel owned by Ben Affleck.

Nah, I do not care much for those coins OR pedigrees.

But, from the famous actors pedigree file, I would be interested in the seated half (preferably New Orleans mint) that John Wilkes Booth used to buy a round of coffee at Starbucks the day that he shot Lincoln.

Shamika

<< <i>But, from the famous actors pedigree file, I would be interested in the seated half (preferably New Orleans mint) that John Wilkes Booth used to buy a round of coffee at Starbucks the day that he shot Lincoln. >>


You got me.

Baley

depends on the "proof"

an authenticated letter or actual text reference "in the literature" presenting a coin or medal to (or from) a famous person might mean something.

some "story" about where the coin's been, told by the seller?

not much value there

StrikeOutXXX

Short of digging up those who have passed and plucking coins from their pockets they may have been buried with, I seriously doubt you will be able to go back very far into these "Famous" pedigrees with much authentication.

Maybe spouses/heirs who still have collections could authenticate for recently departed people. Maybe somewhere out there are pieces donated to museums or whatnot that still have a traceable line.

To answer RYK, yes, I would love to own a piece of history directly related to "Substantial" contributors of the past. Sadly though, short of eBay hucksters, if this idea came to fruition, I think all we'd end up with is the Brittney Spears state quarter situations with few exceptions. A hundred years from now, there could be "Substantial" contributors from today though.

Would definitely put a monkey wrench in the "buy the coin not the holder".

fc

good post ryk, i really enjoyed reading it. thank you!

RYK

Or how about a coin that has been in a family for 130+ years with such documentation, like this one.