How About Some Input/Discussion From The Bust Half Folks On The 1807 Capped Bust Half?

stman

Hi folks, since there are many capped Bust enthusiasts on the board I thought perhaps I could get some opinions/discussion, on the mintage figures/known survivors etc. of the 1807. I do know for a fact this is a very tough date that seldom comes available. Add in, if it’s original looking and problem free IMO they are not only tough, but indeed rare. Find one with a very sharp strike (I did) and you have one heck of a jewel.

And, with a couple recent additions of this date (that happens to be my favorite) it doesn't bother me so much to stir up interest in this inaugural date, and type, since I have the ones I want for now.
Published mintages say around 750,500.
In Bust Half ever 2nd edition, Edgar Souders states by estimate it is more like 375, 250 (about half of the published numbers).

Furthermore, he mentions approximate survivors (all varieties) might be 2,000 with the majority being the “50 over inverted 5” variety. Which is commonly known as the “50 over 20.” So what say you? BTW, I apologize in advance for a "coin related" thread.

mgoodm3

Where's the pics? I need pics.

TahoeDale

The small stars is one of the rarest coins in the entire series. I have only seen 1 MS coin, and never come across a nice one. Almost the same with the large stars(non-50/20) in higher grade.

I believe the price guides are way behind on valuing these coins. Ought to be double what is indicated today.

stman

TahoeDale, I agree the small and large stars are tough. I have one of each, but not in mint-state.
mgoodm3, probably not this time. Besides, the color "hoes" wouldn't appreciate it.

mozin

No comment, I am actively looking to buy an AU 1807 CBH. So, don't stir up interest with a thread like this.

tradedollarnut

I like the eagle on the 1807/08 coins.

Myqqy

it doesn't bother me so much to stir up interest in this inaugural date, and type, since I have the ones I want for now.

But many of US haven't found the ones we want!!!

Cladiator

I'm wondering if the BHNC has done any research on this date. Perhaps a member could shed some valuable light on this subject? I'd love to know if there are any known examples of the '07 with a doubled or trippled profile....or any of the early Capped design for that matter.

slumlord98

I've never seen a double profile on an 1807. As for scarcity, O.112 is far and away the most common die marriage, far more common than the other three combined. It is also the last one struck that year. None of the other three is rare, per se, but very difficult to find nice, or in high grade. The small stars, O.113 was the first CBH struck. Unfortunately, both dies shattered, holding down mintage. For some reason, a number of these are found on significantly oversized planchets. I have no explanation. Next struck was the large stars, O.114. Again, both dies shattered and a very few are seen struck from these shattered dies. This one is very difficult to find in high grade. Next struck was O.111, this being the first use of the 5/inverted 5reverse die. This was erroneously referred to as 50/20 by many. Ed Souders did a computer overlay and proved that no 2 matched the curve, and that an inverted 5 matched perfectly. The obverse on almost all 111s features the well known "beard", a die crack running from chin to chest. Stacks just sold an exceedingly rare prime die state sans "beard". This is easily the rarest die marriage of the year. Finally came old reliable, O.112. These dies just wouldn't crack, explaining its ubiquitous status. In the 4th ed., Parsley lists a 112a with a reverse cud, and rated it R4. That has to be a joke. There are no known cuds on CBHs. Until I see one of these, it will be filed under "urban legends".

These apparently were all released into circulation, which would explain their rarity in high grade. Both services are generous in grading 1807s. To figure mintage, compare the reported mintage in other years to the number of die marriages from that year. Reported mintage for 1808 is 1.37 million with 10 DMs, for an average of 137,000 coins per die pairing. With 4 die pairings reported for 1807, that would imply a mintage of 548,000; however, the O.111 die pairing struck very few coins, and the other two (113 and 114) also likely produced fewer than average coins. I would personally guess that ~ 250-275k coins were struck from the four turban die pairings. Everyone who collects early half dollars wants this first year of issue, and they tend to hold onto their coins. Most will have to settle for an O.112, and many will never even see a 113 on the bourse.

JRocco

Let me just throw into this thread the fact that the 07's just DO NOT come with good strikes (I know-- never say never). Pick up one of these babies with a nice bird head and left wing and you have a prize. If the hair on the obverse looks good too----WOW.
I have an eye out- as I am sure many others do also- for an 07 with a better than weak strike.

stman

<< <i>Let me just throw into this thread the fact that the 07's just DO NOT come with good strikes >>



Really? Very tough to find, and you're gonna pay for one as I did, but not impossible to find. Well, it seems impossible, but if ya find one you better be ready to snap it up quick.

stman

<< <i> I'd love to know if there are any known examples of the '07 with a doubled or trippled profile....or any of the early Capped design for that matter. >>



Clad, you know darn well if there was indeed a double or triple profile on an 1807..... somehow, someway it would be mine. As far as some of the other early dates.... yes there are some. I don't have the info in front of me. And of course you know I have the 1813 with a bold double profile.
Thanks for the input folks!

Edit to correct I have an 1813 with a DP not an 1811.

Cladiator

ST. I look forward to the day that somebody discovers a doubled profile '07 and I get to see you jumping up and down, screaming like a little school girl