% of coins still raw and unslabbed
jpkinla
Posts: 822 ✭✭✭
Do you really believe that only half of the total coin population has been slabbed to date? We see coins from Stacks all the time that are raw and I have seen a few really rare dates come out of the blue but what percentage of the rare coin population is still raw?
One would think that PCGS and NGC would need to do something (like change to a 100 point grading system) to keep up the revenues....
One would think that PCGS and NGC would need to do something (like change to a 100 point grading system) to keep up the revenues....
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are not slabbed is simply silly... of course a small fraction
of modern crap is slabbed.
but coins before 1838? i would say the majority may well be.
> 50%
edited to add: for the older stuff, i mean the slabbable coins.
not problem examples.
<< <i>can you at least fragment the dates? to say half the moderns
are not slabbed is simply silly... of course a small fraction
of modern crap is slabbed.
but coins before 1838? i would say the majority may well be.
> 50%
edited to add: for the older stuff, i mean the slabbable coins.
not problem examples. >>
No Way......
The vast vast majority of pre-1900 coins are still raw and beautiful.
but you added 60 more years to the range of dates. i would
also agree with you after that slight change.
but what about before 1838 only?
<< <i>jrocco,
but you added 60 more years to the range of dates. i would
also agree with you after that slight change.
but what about before 1838 only? >>
Done unintentionally fc.
But- I still think that the vast majority of coins---even pre-1838 are still raw.
If you poll people on these PCGS boards that may not be true, but these boards are just a little itty bitty example of coin collectors.
I think most coins period are out there and raw as hell.
<< <i>not even 1% of pre 1950 coins have been slabbed. >>
I think it is even a lot less than that darktone
edited to add- I alone have well over 25 thousand pre 50 Lincoln cents and out of them, I have maybe---5 slabbed.
that is why i think it is important to go back in time, until
one can estimate the percentage of slabbed versus unslabbed
problem free coins.
what if we pick a date of 1799? are half slabbed?
<< <i>I think it is even a lot less than that darktone >>
I agree it's just a drop in the bucket. If someone wanted to you could count the mintages of all coins made by the mint and figure out how many have been slabbed and then make guess on how many have been destroyed- then you could get an approximation.
David
when a coin for a certain date has varying prices for each
incremental grade, the majority may very well have been slabbed?
as in, if a MS60 is worth 10,000 and a MS61 is worth 18,000.
if a common date sneaks in, it blows off the percentages bigtime.
My Web Sites
<< <i>
<< <i>I think it is even a lot less than that darktone >>
I agree it's just a drop in the bucket. If someone wanted to you could count the mintages of all coins made by the mint and figure out how many have been slabbed and then make guess on how many have been destroyed- then you could get an approximation. >>
I tried to do this here with a thread about the '16-D dime. It seemed to imply that
about one third of the +$400 examples have been slabbed. I got no agreement and
most people believed almost all were slabbed.
It's tough to say but I thought figuring 40% of the mintage surviving for this long sought
after coin would be conservative.
edited to add link for the '16-D thread.
<< <i>I would tend to think that old time collectors, who bought most of their coins before slabs were invented, would leave the coins raw unless they wanted to sell them. A few may have wanted some of them authenticated or preserved by slabbing, but they would have had little reason to slab the majority of them. >>
I'm one of those 'ol timers, and long ago slabbed my better coins. Joel Rettew made a simple statement that convinced me "they are worth more in the holders".
<< <i>There are probably more unslabbed older coins than you might suspect. They are held in collections that have been formed over many years, beginning well before the slabbed era. Many of these collectors are very wealthy and are known only to the high end dealers they work with. They probably never attend shows. >>
True, but if they bought anything in the last decade, it's probably slabbed.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>How many coins have been slabbed by PCGS? Wasn't it something like 11 milion not too long ago? Maybe the same for NGC? Maybe close for ANACS? and then dropping off to much less by everyone else? Then subtract out crackouts/regrades/crossovers, etc. It doesn't sound like a huge number of the total number of collectible coins out there but I imagine in certain series or past a certain price level, it is probably a higher percentage. >>
Don't forget most of these are moderns. They slabbed over 40,000 Silver eagles last year alone.
Bust Series - 10% (A lot of serious Bustie collectors collect raw, and keep them for a long time.)
Classic Commemoratives - 5%
____________________________________________________________________________________
Percent of raw coins worth at least $300 each NOT ACCEPTABLE for PCGS/NGC grading:
Bust series - 90%
Classic Commemoratives - 95%
<< <i>
<< <i>can you at least fragment the dates? to say half the moderns
are not slabbed is simply silly... of course a small fraction
of modern crap is slabbed.
but coins before 1838? i would say the majority may well be.
> 50%
edited to add: for the older stuff, i mean the slabbable coins.
not problem examples. >>
No Way......
The vast vast majority of pre-1900 coins are still raw and beautiful. >>
Can we not think about that a moment? Do you want to cause people sleepless nights when they're sitting on a pop 4/0 piece of bust coinage?!
That's in addition to the plenty of serious coins that still change hands w/o plastic now. Just this afternoon, I handled the nicest AU58 (make that AU59.9, with the freedom from marks of a strong 64) Walking Liberty half dollar I have ever viewed. It was a 1917-S with obverse mintmark, a significantly 4-figure coin, and it was in dealer inventory raw. The price was ambitious, but I bet someone will pay it. Also present were several incredible FH gem SLQ's, also raw. And a beautiful XF45 draped bust cent, and a number of other truly difficult coins, all of which looked like they could slab.
Bottom line -- lots of raw coins out there. Lots and lots and lots.
Too many circs will never be slabbed no matter how much they are worth. And no one cares about the billions of wheat cents out there for slabbing either. How many 5c wheat pennies will get slabbed?
Out of the coins listed above I'm sure we are in the 50-70% range of all higher grade type coins slabbed. I can't speak to common morgans, classic commems, later gold, etc. Just major type coins in MS/PF 64 and higher grades from 1793 to 1916.
roadrunner
For example, David Akers stated he knew of a dozen 1927-d Saints that were all different yet the slabbed totals are not there.....Maybe only 7....
Interesting to guess....
$20 Saint Gaudens Registry Set
<< <i>This is a tough question that I feel only really makes sense for pre-1916 coinage in MS64/PF64 grades or higher......and typically highly sought after coins (ie no 80-s/81-s Morgans for example). But PF65 Barber Quarters or MS64 bust halves would fit the bill. The high grade also sort of requires reasonable protection in a slab as well.
Too many circs will never be slabbed no matter how much they are worth. And no one cares about the billions of wheat cents out there for slabbing either. How many 5c wheat pennies will get slabbed?
Out of the coins listed above I'm sure we are in the 50-70% range of all higher grade type coins slabbed. I can't speak to common morgans, classic commems, later gold, etc. Just major type coins in MS/PF 64 and higher grades from 1793 to 1916.
roadrunner >>
As to Morgans which Roadrunner doesn't speak: The GSA issues in MS grades range from 5% (1884CC, most common) on up perhaps to 35% of the 79CC's issued as a high estimate. That's a good ballpark as a example of all MS63+/MS64 unc Morgans worth more than $175 today. In my collection >$150 in both circ/unc. it's approximately 300 raw vs. 75 graded.
99.9999%
<< <i>I was referring specifically to rare coins whether they are circ or unc but I suppose we are talking coins worth $500 at a minimum......Interesting to see some say 2% have been slabbed and others feel it is MUCH higher......There are some old time collections out there with MAJOR coins that are still raw.....
For example, David Akers stated he knew of a dozen 1927-d Saints that were all different yet the slabbed totals are not there.....Maybe only 7....
Interesting to guess.... >>
Now you just need to locate some of these owners to see if they are willing to sell thier 27D Saints at a small profit.
<< <i>I would tend to think that old time collectors, who bought most of their coins before slabs were invented, would leave the coins raw unless they wanted to sell them. A few may have wanted some of them authenticated or preserved by slabbing, but they would have had little reason to slab the majority of them. >>
Wouldn't that help them get their collection insured?
Robert A. Heinlein
<< <i>I have over 5000 coins and not one is slabbed 200 are before 1838. So 0% of mine are slabbed
You are my hero, Busco.
I don't have over 5000 coins, but I do have over 200 from before 1838. None of mine are slabbed either--at least any more (probably 20% were in slabs when bought). I also have another 400 or so later than 1838. All of them are raw as well.
How does this fit into the original question??? Not even a drop in the bucket as far as available coins are concerned...but, representative of many collectors such as myself who really don't care whether or not a coin is encased in plastic. I think that there are many more of us than most people on these boards realize.