Should PCGS have a seperate registry set for RB and BN copper?

DickyBetz

There are separate registry sets for FS and FB coins, so shouldnt there be a registry for BN/RB copper and one for RD copper? I think so. RB and BN coins are penalized even though many are more beautiful than their red counterparts. What are your thoughts on this subject?

TomB

I don't believe you can give a blanket statement that BN and RB coins are more beautiful than their RD brethren. After all, there are superb pieces in every color designation as there are also dogs in every color designation. Additionally, the eye appeal of each of these coins will depend highly on personal preference, which is completely subjective. PCGS has chosen to weigh the coins in a manner consistent with how the market generally prices them. That is, RD coins generally will cost more than RB and those generally cost more for BN for any particular issue.

DickyBetz

I can understand them being penalized because of pricing structures, but I am mostly referring to color toned coins that are called RB and BN by TPG's. THESE coins are a lot of times more bbeautiful than red ones and I think they should have their own spot in the registry.

zkcoins

I like the idea...sounds fun as I am a toner aficionado.

STEWARTBLAYNUMIS

Dickie Betz - How many people do you think would register their Brown or Red Brown sets.If you think it is worthwhile then e mail David Hall dh@collectors.com

ps - I think it is a good idea

Stewart

centmaster

I think it's a great idea. I've already registered my Brown/RB set. I think I'm prouder of these than my red set because I bought most of them raw. It's tougher to get a 65 BN grade on an early Lincoln than it is to get a 67RD on a later date right now(and that's really saying something!)

saintguru

Stewart

I think there weould be quite a few register. there are many collectors who simply can't afford a RD but can afford a very nice RB. It would even the playing field from having to compete with an entirely higher class of coins.

I think it's a good idea.

I'm going through my change right now to start my set.

DickyBetz

<< <i>there are many collectors who simply can't afford a RD but can afford a very nice RB >>



Exactly! Me being one of them, I would like a chance to actually be competitive in the registry. The early date Lincolns would be a much cheaper task to achieve if they were done in BN and RB, but now the later dates would be a challenge to find graded RB and BN.

fcloud

Sure why not. It would level the playing field like they did without FB for Dimes.

saintguru

This SHOULD be asked in the Q & A forum by one of you Lincoln collectors.

jcping

Definitely, they should, IMO. There are simply too many "dipped" "re-colored" 19th century Red Coppers in the market. When these coins were sent to grade, then were "red" and right now, they are ugly "purple, green or other colors." Nevertheless, on holders, they are still called RED, and they are the winners in set registry.

WaterSport

Hey, you guys know I am R&B collector all the way, but, I think we need to get rid of a few unobtainable coins in the varieties sets first. Setting up new sets would definitely be in PCGS favor; however there are now a lot of Lincoln sets, where do you draw the line?

WS

jcping

How about start from two cent RB and BN sets. There are simply too many "problem" Red two cents.

tradedollarnut

Great idea!

STEWARTBLAYNUMIS

Dicky Betz - I hope that you don't expect a brown and red brown memorial set ? That would be toooo easy

Water sport - Which varieties are unobtainable

Imagine a 1909-1933 set done in GEM brown uncirculated ?

Saintguru - I triple dare you to collect Lincoln cents in any shade or variety.


Stewart

centmaster

<< <i> Imagine a 1909-1933 set done in GEM brown uncirculated ? >>



That would be pretty cool!

cohodk

I think people would only register their RB/BN sets because they want to share the pictures. Afterall isnt that what the registry is all about--sharing our passion. I think the reason so many "red" sets do not include pics is because most of the coins are not red and because red is boring.

DickyBetz

Stewart- No, I am mainly talking about Lincolns...and Indians too, I guess.

Dave- I agree with you about the sharing pictures part. I would love to see all of your PR Indians and Matte PR Lincolns in a registry set that I can look at anytime.

WaterSport

Stewart, when I say Unobtainable I am speaking of the 1969 S DDO. Sure, you can find one to buy now and then, but few here have the resources to procure one. So with that said, it would be safe to say that many who do have the resources to drop $10,000 on a key Lincoln, are NOT going to get a chance to be pedigreed because they will always be 99% complete, regardless of how awesome the rest of the set maybe.

WS

STEWARTBLAYNUMIS

WaterSport

A 1969 s DDO in AU 58 will cost about $20,000.Since the Set Registry rules state there should be at least 5 examples of a variety graded the 69 s DDO is in the Set Registry.
Most people in the Proof Memorial Variety Set Registry have a 1990 No S which will cost at least $8,000.
I personally think that if you get the opportunity to obtain a nice 69 s DDO you should go for it even if you have to borrow the money.

Dicky Betz - I will get in touch with David Hall and present your idea for a Brown and Red/Brown Registry Set

Stewart

DickyBetz

<< <i>Dicky Betz - I will get in touch with David Hall and present your idea for a Brown and Red/Brown Registry Set >>



Thanks Stewart!

Touchdown

Brown and Red Brown Lincoln's are very undervalued in my opinion. I have seen and handled many RB coins that look completely Red and have seen Red labeled coins look less Red than some RB's.

Some Red Brown coins are more rare as far as existing than Red coins. Like the 14S there are only 15 in 65 RB none higherbut there are 33 in 65Red with 2 higher.

Red coins tend to bring higher prices because they were intended to be Redish looking planchets before they were struck. So, they sell for more because of there originality. But, what if there was a possibility of the planchet stip actually being Red Brown before the coin was struck. That would make the coin original in color even though it is RB.

Another example is Modern Coinage. Collectors are paying big premiums for white looking coins that have traces of other colors or toning. Same case with RB coins, in a way they are toned and might command a premium. But, this is not the case since this is the way coin collecting goes, demand is what sets prices.

Another thing I have brought up before is to designate RB coins with a percentage on the insert. Many dealers out there dealing in RB coinage have different opinions as far as how much Red a coin has. The more Red the more of a premium with knowledgeable dealers. I beleive it would be very easy for the TPG's to build standards as far as how much percentage of Red a coin has. Say 70% Red or 80% Red. This way dealers and collectors can have some sort of guide rather that giving there opinion and being way off since they don't specialize in the series.

Pushkin

<< <i>Should PCGS have a seperate registry set for RB and BN copper. >>



An excellent idea. I might start collecting MS Indians again if there were such a registry.

cohodk

Another thing I have brought up before is to designate RB coins with a percentage on the insert. Many dealers out there dealing in RB coinage have different opinions as far as how much Red a coin has. The more Red the more of a premium with knowledgeable dealers. I beleive it would be very easy for the TPG's to build standards as far as how much percentage of Red a coin has. Say 70% Red or 80% Red. This way dealers and collectors can have some sort of guide rather that giving there opinion and being way off since they don't specialize in the series.

A problem I see here is that some coins with a RB designation have neither red nor brown. This coin is in a RB holder. How would the percentages be broken down?



And this coin has a BN designation. Is it brown?

DickyBetz

Dave- Thats what I meant when I said that some "RB" or "BN" coins will be penalized when they are not even RB or BN. In the new RB/BN registry they wont.

BTW, show me more of those!

Touchdown

<< <i>A problem I see here is that some coins with a RB designation have neither red nor brown. This coin is in a RB holder. How would the percentages be broken down? >>



I am glad you asked that, Here is another idea I beleive should be implemented. Coins that are different color for example Toned Green, Purple, Red, Yellow, Blue etc. Should be labeled that color in my opinion. It makes no sense to label a coin Brown when it is obviously a different color. For example cohodk's gorgeous Blue Lincoln. How can someone call this coin Brown when it is obviously Blue.

I think the TPG's should label all copper coins there actual color rather than Brown when it is not Red or Red Brown. It is difficult for new collectors trying to understand everything involved in this hobby. This even makes it more comp[icated to understand for them. IMO

MikeJessie1

can understand them being penalized because of pricing structures, but I am mostly referring to color toned coins that are called RB and BN by TPG's. THESE coins are a lot of times more bbeautiful than red ones and I think they should have their own spot in the registry.


Greg, How about one better. Lets have a Toned Pattern collection. of course then, who would judge the grade on the colors. Just one of the things I think about when my wife talks to me and my eyes glaze over

BWRC

Red/Browns and Browns can be quite colorful in both mintstate and proof!! Good idea for separate sets!

centmaster

Nice pics, but that last post should have been on the BST forum as it's simply advertising.

cohodk