Detroit Tiger Fans - What do you think about Bonderman and Verlander rookie cards?

ndleo

I was thinking about making a huge bet on Bonderman and Verlander autograph rookie cards. I think the Tigers should be able to score more and Leyland will develop the young pitchers.

Bonderman's 2005 ended badly last year, but he still had a winning record (14-13) and had an All-Star quality first half.

What do you guys think?

bsfastball

Bonderman is a great sleeper pick considering his age (just a couple months older than verlander). I think he was among the league leaders in K's.

Boopotts

Buying cards of pitchers is a sure money burner. Look back on the past forty years. In that time you have to following pitchers whose RC's are worth anything.

1) Steve Carlton
2) Tom Seaver
3) Nolan Ryan
4) Roger Clemens
5) Greg Maddux
6) Randy Johnson

So basically you need 300 wins (or close to it) and a HOF career to get any hobby love whatsoever. I know this doesn't include guys like Blyleven, Eckersley, Fingers, etc., who all had fairly distinguished careers, but their RC's are not worth a huge premium (say, 100x what a common is worth). The market for pitchers trends sharply downward after they hit the majors, and rarely spikes back up. Look at Mark Prior, Kerry Wood, etc. I would hate to have a pile of high end RC's of any of these guys.

You live in Det, so maybe you could move some of these at Gibraltar if either got hot. That's definitely a factor to consider. But as far as a long term investment goes, is it fair to ask either of these guys to have a better career then Jack Morris, Frank Viola or Dave Steib?

royalbrett

I bought a lot of Andy Van Hekken rookie cards a couple of years ago.

After pitching a shutout his first start, I thought, how could I go wrong?

ndleo

I was planning to buy 100 or so of their autographed rookie cards. I've been able to get 2003 Bonderman autographs numbered between 50-125 for $15-$20, or about 25-30% book. Verlander goes for a little more.

IMHO that is a cheap price for a certified autograph of a young pitcher. My bet is that the Tigers have a good season and Bonderman becomes an ace. Everyone in Detroit knows that a competitive baseball team would draw huge interest.

detroitfan2

I like Bonderman a lot, too early for me to form an opinion yet on Verlander. That being said, I think Boopotts was right on the money with his post. It's hard to consider any pitcher an "investment" these days.

I'm just thankful there's other Tiger fans on this planet.

Stone193

I gotta say - I don't like what happens to RC pitchers over time.

The vintage pitchers especially - just look at cards like Carlton and Ryan RCs.

I definitely think the sluggers outdistance them in demand and price.

Very confusing? Ya need the pitchers.

In fact, don't they say good pitching will....

mike

ndleo

I don't plan to hold on the card forever. If Bonderman has another good first half and Verlander makes the roster, their cards will be hot in Detroit. It all depends on how the team does, hopefully Leyland can turn it around.

mudflap02

Verlander has already peaked I think. 70+ different rookie cards will not make any one a particularly desirable commodity. I say sink money into Bonderman, but expect to get back 25% of what you spent.

helionaut

Bonderman cards have always sold, despite his stats. The closer he got to 20 losses, the more they sold. I guess his age or something attracts people to him. On that basis, I think if the Tigers ever get good again, there is room for growth. With Verlander, his high draft pick number and large hobby profile has made his cards valuable out of the box, but he was out part of the year and it's hard to find a product he didn't have an auto RC in. But he did reach the majors already, and he does strike people out. One of my prime speculation rules is avoid pitchers, but if you like them, go for it.

ndleo

So far:

(9) 2003 Bonderman autos for $198 ($22 each), (6) are #'d to 50, (3) #'d to 100.

(6) 2005 Verlander autos for $137 ($22.83 each), (1) is #'d to 10 - cost $55. Without the low number RC, the average Verlander cost is $16.40.

I will probably try to get 50 of each. To me this is cheaper than gambling in the casino. There are many more Verlander autos out there, so I expect prices to fall going into Spring Training. Bonderman autos are popular, there seems to be a few other big buyers out there.

bri2327

If you absolutely have to have pitchers, then forget those 2 guys and spend however much you were planning on picking up PSA 10's of 85 donruss Clemens cards.

Stone193

To add to this talk - I guess we can call this speculation.

Does anyone remember when Beachbum was trying to corner the market on Cole Hamel cards?

Boy did the fur fly here one day!
mike

edit: BTW, I miss the Beachman!

Darin

<< <i>I was thinking about making a huge bet on Bonderman and Verlander autograph rookie cards. I think the Tigers should be able to score more and Leyland will develop the young pitchers.

Bonderman's 2005 ended badly last year, but he still had a winning record (14-13) and had an All-Star quality first half.

What do you guys think? >>



I've come from the future to tell you: By all means, go ahead and make that bet on Verlander. Forget about Bonderman though.
I'm bad at the internet, so I hope this message reaches you in your current year of 2006.
It is 2012 here and still no flying cars.

Boopotts

<< <i>If you absolutely have to have pitchers, then forget those 2 guys and spend however much you were planning on picking up PSA 10's of 85 donruss Clemens cards. >>




It's posts like this that make thread revivals so entertaining.

jeffcbay

A few guys I work with went to Detroit last Thursday night and ran into Max Scherzer and Justin Verlander at Bouzouki's (strip club). Verlander was with his girlfriend. For some reason they wouldn't let anyone take their pictures... lol.

ndleo

To complete the story, I ended up with a little less than 50 of each. I sold the Bonderman's at the start of the season for a small profit. He started strong that year. I kept the Verlanders until the end of the season and sold the entire stash during the World Series run.

I should have reloaded on Verlander again after his 11-17 season. I guess my feeling about the team was spot on.

Darin

<< <i>To complete the story, I ended up with a little less than 50 of each. I sold the Bonderman's at the start of the season for a small profit. He started strong that year. I kept the Verlanders until the end of the season and sold the entire stash during the World Series run.

I should have reloaded on Verlander again after his 11-17 season. I guess my feeling about the team was spot on. >>



Thanks for the update, it would be cool if you still had those Verlanders'. I started a basic Verlander set and did a search of his name on this board and found this thread.

ndleo

<< <i>

<< <i>To complete the story, I ended up with a little less than 50 of each. I sold the Bonderman's at the start of the season for a small profit. He started strong that year. I kept the Verlanders until the end of the season and sold the entire stash during the World Series run.

I should have reloaded on Verlander again after his 11-17 season. I guess my feeling about the team was spot on. >>



Thanks for the update, it would be cool if you still had those Verlanders'. I started a basic Verlander set and did a search of his name on this board and found this thread. >>



I wish I had them too!

I was more sure about Bonderman than Verlander. Bonderman was a big country boy who I thought would develop into a Jack Morris type. He lost 19 games in his first year. I thought he was much more mature than Verlander even though he was only a few years older.

There were a couple of others buying up Bonderman's when I was chasing them, that is why I didn't make that much, my cost started climbing and I just bailed. I wonder if they sold before his shoulder gave out.