MTG: Roller Marks
tmmoose
Posts: 253 ✭✭
There was some discussion a while ago about roller marks on unlimited cards. (Example attached).
I noticed when looking at my cards (as you do) that this seems to be unique to Black cards, and is actually quite common. It also doesn't appear to be a valid reason for PSA not to grade a card a 10.
The particularly interesting thing that I spotted was that it only appears below the black mana symbol, and doesn't just appear under the casting cost. For example, I have a Badlands that has this 'roller mark' below the black mana symbol in the card text. This tends to suggest that this isn't a roller mark per se, but more something which is actually printed on the card at the same time as the black mana symbol itself.
Does this only appear on unlimted cards?
I was thinking it would be interesting to know if was a particular set of cards that were affected, or all cards printed on a particular machine etc. Has anyone else noticed any particular patterns on the occurance of this?
I noticed when looking at my cards (as you do) that this seems to be unique to Black cards, and is actually quite common. It also doesn't appear to be a valid reason for PSA not to grade a card a 10.
The particularly interesting thing that I spotted was that it only appears below the black mana symbol, and doesn't just appear under the casting cost. For example, I have a Badlands that has this 'roller mark' below the black mana symbol in the card text. This tends to suggest that this isn't a roller mark per se, but more something which is actually printed on the card at the same time as the black mana symbol itself.
Does this only appear on unlimted cards?
I was thinking it would be interesting to know if was a particular set of cards that were affected, or all cards printed on a particular machine etc. Has anyone else noticed any particular patterns on the occurance of this?
0
Comments
I know the printing flaw you are talking about and my black cards have them too; especially sinkholes. I also agree that it shouldn't prevent a 10 because that is how the cards were printed. There aren't splotches or physical lines, but instead an error with the actual print run.
Unopened 1975 material
UL Magic the Gathering
Bastien
If you look close enough, you'll notice that the black mana symbol from the A/B/U printings was changed for all other sets. A problem occured when ink apparently tended to pool up in the "teeth" of the skull and ran down the card as the sheet was fed through the printing machine. The skull was altered in later sets to remove this problem.
I don't think I have any MTG cards that aren't A/B/U to be able to make the comparison on the mana symbol, it's nice to know why it exists at least!
There are two relief lines on the card. In "roller1.jpg" you can faintly see the two lines and in "roller2.jpg" the top imprint is very clear.
I hope this helps!
-Tony
I can say with certainty now that I've not had the misfortune to come accross any cards like this!
Michael
I like pic #2 Tony - good job of showing the problem. I was chatting with a couple of experienced sheetfed press operators at work and they said that the problem we have here is referred to as "mill lines". When the paper is made it is in big rolls; these rolls are then unwound and cut down to make sheets, like the ones MtG cards are printed on. As they are cut a coating is put on the paper and a large blade is used to keep it even on the sheets. Occasionally some debris or other impurity sticks to a part of the blade and then "etches" the paper with these lines - a common mill defect that isn't always caught by them or the press operators. Additionally, the problem might instead result in the bindery process. Once the sheets are printed they go to be cut - first into strips, then squares, then through a diecutter to round the corners. In the first 2 steps big cutters are used; these cutters have guards that come down and press on the lifts of sheets and hold them in place - it is possible they got scored by these guards. The consensus from everyone I spoke to was that it was most likely the former, but they couldn't rule out the latter.
OK, I apologize - this is probably more than any of you ever wanted to know about the printing industry
On a final note, I have a question for everyone. Have you noticed these mill lines on any cards besides rares? I have gone back through my cards and don't have any on cards that aren't rare. However, to be fair, this could be due to me not keeping commons/uncommons with them. After all this time I can't remember if I weeded them out, but I would have thought I'd still at least have a couple. Anyone with info?
Take it easy,
Jared
Caught between the Scylla and Charibdes,
Hypnotized by you if I should linger,
Staring at the ring around your finger" - Sting
Ray Thiel (1964-2007) - the man who showed me more wonderful games & gaming sessions than I ever dreamed possible... you ran out of hit points too young, my friend.
I'll look closer tomorrow to see if I can find anything other than rare.
And for someone like me who isn't familiar with the details of the printing process, your different scenarios were actually interesting for me to read and understand at least a couple possibilities for how these things happen.
Edit: Nope -- I am not seeing the roller mark on any of my uncommon or common unlimited cards.
My questions would be: Any suspeptible rares to the roller mark defect?
What percentage of UL rares have this?
Do the roller marks appear in all booster pack rares?
I rarely have found this defect in UL starters except for one that had the metalic strip on the wrapper. the other type of UL starter has a clear strip and I have not seen roller marks on these.
Unopened 1975 material
UL Magic the Gathering