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why doesn't anyone use half dollars anymore?
secondrepublic
Posts: 2,619 ✭✭✭
While paying for lunch today, the cashier gave me back a '93 Kennedy half as change - but not before asking "is this okay?"
I can't remember the last time I got a half dollar in my change.
What happened to make the half dollar such an oddity? Looking on Ebay, a lot of the silver half dollars have seen a lot of circulation. So clearly at one time, people were using half dollars pretty regularly.
I can't remember the last time I got a half dollar in my change.
What happened to make the half dollar such an oddity? Looking on Ebay, a lot of the silver half dollars have seen a lot of circulation. So clearly at one time, people were using half dollars pretty regularly.
"Men who had never shown any ability to make or increase fortunes for themselves abounded in brilliant plans for creating and increasing wealth for the country at large." Fiat Money Inflation in France, Andrew Dickson White (1912)
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A cashless society, and the incovenience of having to carry a coin bigger than a quarter.
Russ, NCNE
In order for any coin to circulate the banks have to physically put them in circulation but
since they don't work in machines many customers would hand them back. It was about
1977 that banks rarely even tried to move these any more and the production was used
mostly in slot machines after this time. Since 2002 even this usage has evaporated and
the coin is no longer minted even for specialized circulation and is strictly a collector issue.
<< <i>The real question is why do they continue to make them? >>
Profit.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>About '64-65 is when i noticed that they started to vanish. >>
Because people knew they were silver and the Government was shafting us by changing our money to worthless common metal.
They were hoarded and most of them went the way of the smelter in the run up of '79-'80.
John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
<< <i>The real question is why do they continue to make them? >>
easy answear : how else can the government turn .035 in raw raw material into $.50?
( the .035 is just a guess)
I can just see giant piles of bags of 50 cent pieces in warehouses across the country since they rarely seem to get out into circulation.
<< <i>Profit is an interesting motive. Maybe they should just do away with the 50 cent piece and concentrate on the dollar coins, the profit would be even greater.
I can just see giant piles of bags of 50 cent pieces in warehouses across the country since they rarely seem to get out into circulation. >>
The one I got in my change had lots of marks, but not much in the way of wear. Possibly an exile from the slot machines.
Although I got about $1000 bucks worth, it is going to take some time to spend them all.
Golden Dollar 10.03 cents
Half Dollar 9.63 cents
Quarter 4.29 cents
Dime 1.88 cents
Nickel 3.13 cents
Penny .81
<< <i>
The one I got in my change had lots of marks, but not much in the way of wear. Possibly an exile from the slot machines. >>
This is typical of many of the '77 to '01 issues.
<< <i>They have to take them. They are legal tender. >>
Actually, no they don't have to take them. There is no law that says a business must accept any specific type of payment whether it be currency or coin.
Russ, NCNE
i am not sure if you are correct on that. i know they do not
have to accept odd payments of legal tender.. like a million
pennies..
but how could they refuse you to buy a candy bar for 65 cents..
and you pay with two half dollars. to refuse that transaction
seems almost against the law if they do not explain what they
want in return..
of course a store wont stay in business long with an attitude
like that. so i guess the point is a bit moot.
or barter,loan,credit, ET, debit, etc etc
<< <i>russ,
i am not sure if you are correct on that. >>
Of course I'm correct. It's a common misconception that a business is required to accept US money. The phrase "legal tender" simply means that it is legal to use as payment. It does not infer a legal obligation to accept it.
Russ, NCNE
If you refuse to take my legal tender, I consider the debt paid
in full.
so maybe there is a federal law saying if you owe someone
money and they refuse your legal tender, they are in the wrong.
hm there may not be a law, but you would have a great civil
suit against the person who you owe money to.
<< <i>so maybe there is a federal law saying if you owe someone
money and they refuse your legal tender, they are in the wrong. >>
There is no Federal law that says anyone, be they a business or an individual, is required to accept legal tender in payment. Nor are there any state laws stipulating such.
Russ, NCNE
goto civil court then.
thanks for the info.
FAQs: Currency
I thought that United States currency was legal tender for all debts. Some businesses or governmental agencies say that they will only accept checks, money orders or credit cards as payment, and others will only accept currency notes in denominations of $20 or smaller. Isn't this illegal?
The pertinent portion of law that applies to your question is the Coinage Act of 1965, specifically Section 31 U.S.C. 5103, entitled "Legal tender," which states: "United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues."
This statute means that all United States money as identified above are a valid and legal offer of payment for debts when tendered to a creditor. There is, however, no Federal statute mandating that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise. For example, a bus line may prohibit payment of fares in pennies or dollar bills. In addition, movie theaters, convenience stores and gas stations may refuse to accept large denomination currency (usually notes above $20) as a matter of policy.
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etc. etc. etc.
basically my interpretation is that you have to identify what means of payment your business etc. accepts and doesnt accept. Ive certainly seen signs "nothing higher than a $20 bill" but, if you sit down for a cup of coffee and pay with 1/2 dollars and they dont have a sign that says "we dont take change as payment" then they dont have a leg to stand on...IMHO
I still also use them when I tip the waitresses when we go to Reno....they never seem to mind either.
Hell, I don't need to exercise.....I get enough just pushing my luck.
<< <i>BTW, here are the numbers to make coins, although it's from the 2000 USMint Annual report so it's a bit out of date >>
You can get current annual reports from the US Mint's web site.
There being no other federal law prohibiting private businesses, persons or organizations from other methods of payment they choose to accept or refuse, such entitites therefore are free to insist on payment by credit card, for example, or to refuse larger denomination banknotes. Some small stores in the United States have a policy of not accepting large notes, typically above $20, either at all or at certain times of day; this allows them to keep fairly small quantities of money in the register and deter robbery. Presumably, there is no federal law precluding businesses from choosing to reject altogether U.S. dollars as payment for goods and services. The occasional practice of offering large quantities of small denomination coins to pay resented debts is restricted by regulations limiting the use of "subsidiary" and "minor" coins (those with denominations of less than one dollar) similar to the Canadian ones listed above.
This quote was from the free dictionary by Farlex..........
Rus is being stubron..............
<< <i>if you sit down for a cup of coffee and pay with 1/2 dollars and they dont have a sign that says "we dont take change as payment" then they dont have a leg to stand on... >>
Also not correct. No sign or any other indication is required. Again, the term "legal tender" does not infer any requirement to accept it as payment.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Rus is being stubron.............. >>
Huh? You just posted a confirmation that I'm correct. Did you not read it?
<< <i>Presumably, there is no federal law precluding businesses from choosing to reject altogether U.S. dollars as payment for goods and services. >>
Russ, NCNE
If Joe sixpack offers tries to pay for his cup of coffee with an accented hair Kennedy half... and they wont take it (the fools!) what should the poor gentlemen do? Offer to do the dishes? Offer to "do" the waitress
The reason they still make them is tradition... can you imagine the outcry if someone suggested we stop...
"What, you don't like Kennedy?!?"
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
It applies some common sense.........................
This is why I accept Liberty Currency...Its backed by silver, and guess what!,...they really have it !!!!!, in metal, and in hand
easy upon request
I can accept or deny and currency for goods sold, of course however when I am paying debt, I must honor the recipiants requirement for payment...if its FRN so be it,...if its chopsticks so be it
<< <i>My 16 year old daughter works as a cashier at a supermarket on weekends. Recently I asked her if she's ever received a 50 cent or dollar coin, or $2 bill. She said no. She's been working there for a year now. >>
Between me and my sister working at a local ice cream/food join for a combined total of 7 years, we may have seen two $2 bills and only a handful of 50 cent pieces.
Being the manager I had to count all the money and deposit it. So all the money made went through me and I still only saw one $2 bill. People save them as "collectors items".
When I withdraw money I normally get a roll of 50 cent pieces just to check them out and spend. The look on cashier's faces when you hand them one can be priceless at times.
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<< <i>BTW, the Liberty Currency coins are well struck and top quality >>
But $20 for an ounce of silver is kind of a rip-off...
<< <i>Joe sixpack offers tries to pay for his cup of coffee with an accented hair Kennedy half... and they wont take it (the fools!) what should the poor gentlemen do? Offer to do the dishes? Offer to "do" the waitress or call Johnny Cochrane (yes, I know that he is dead, but he would STILL prevail in court) Does it not make sense to stipulate that you a. dont accept change b. only accept xyx or c. please, the coffee is on us.
>>
You say "sue me" and walk out.
If I understand correct, the FRNs are good for all "debt' and must be accepted for all dollar denominated debt because all debt written in dollars will specify "dollars", if it specifies "gold" then they don't need to accept dollars. this is not federal law, this is contract law.
As far as a purchase goes, the merchant can specify any type of payment they will or won't accept or even refuse to sell at all.
Those Liberty Dollars we know are not.........
<< <i>If Joe sixpack offers tries to pay for his cup of coffee with an accented hair Kennedy half... and they wont take it (the fools!) what should the poor gentlemen do? >>
He can go to the next coffee joint. That's his right, just as it is the right of the business to refuse to accept his payment. Of course a business that does refuse is being stupid, even though they are within their rights.
<< <i>Does it not make sense to stipulate that you a. dont accept change b. only accept xyx or c. please, the coffee is on us. >>
Of course it makes sense. But, we're not discussing what makes sense. We're discussing the law - or, in this case, the lack of a law.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>By law he has to accept US exchange........... >>
No, he does not.
<< <i>There is, however, no Federal statute mandating that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. >>
That's from the US Treasury web site. It cannot be any clearer than that.
Russ, NCNE
But $20 for an ounce of silver is kind of a rip-off...
when the FRN crash's see what you can get for that 20 spot in your pocket....at least I have the ability to have the bouillion that could be worth $25 per oz in a year, no?
I must be missing something Russ ........When I was employed ,if my boss paid me in sheep or goats I don't think I would have stayed
there.
I am not familiar with any bartar system.
So.........what else is there..............................................
time he states his side of the case. But he is being very careful
not to be too broad with his case.
Take for example, I go into a restaurant and eat a meal.
Most people pay after the meal is eaten and finished.
They do not have a sign saying they do not accept two dollar
bills, so I use my wad of twos and try to pay. They refuse to take
it and I have nothing else left to pay with.
I consider that a free meal then. What will they do to get their
money from me after i just tried to pay with legal tender?
the reason there is not a law, is because no business really
abuses the right to deny payments in "normal" sized bills and
amounts of change.
fun topic to debate.