Tiffany & Co. is suing eBay for facilitating the sale of counterfeit items. Ooh!

... as reported in today's New York Times:
http://nytimes.com/2006/01/29/technology/29ebay.html?hp&ex=1138510800&en=ddaf3038d2c2ed82&ei=5094&partner=homepage
http://nytimes.com/2006/01/29/technology/29ebay.html?hp&ex=1138510800&en=ddaf3038d2c2ed82&ei=5094&partner=homepage

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But what is interesting is that they want to punch a hole in eBay's "just a venue" defense.
A lot of manufacturer's have staff searching eBay to protect their copyrights, brand names and products. They work with eBay to get the listings pulled, but it costs them money to hire people who search for knock-offs so they're tired of paying for it.
If they win the suit, eBay will have to take responsibility for auctions that sell fakes. From Tiffany's to coins.
eBay not gonna like that
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No, as much as we may dislike the fraud we see on eBay I would not like to see eBay lose the suit and lose the "Just a venue" argument.
And they are right this is old news, the Tiffany's suit has been going on for over a year.
<< <i>ebay uses the excuse that they are just a newspaper classified and not responsible >>
I mean really, if you think about it, this is all eBay truly is. If you buy something through mail order in CoinWorld & it turns out to be a fake, would you be suing CoinWorld? No.
If you bought a diamond at a flea market & it was actually a CZ, would you hold the property owner responsible? No. So I don't see what's different about eBay. Just because
it's the internet really shouldn't make them more liable.
Should they help combat the problem? I think so & I wish they would do a better job. BUT....... By trying to combat the problem is eBay screwing themselves legally by inferring
it's their responsibility? That's some legal food for thought. I would not want to see the end of eBay. My collection would not be as big or as nice without the opportunities that
I have found there. I ask plenty of questions & never buy raw as far as coins go. As far as other stuff? It's buyer beware & I have to accept the risk of my own actions. If I'm
not sure about something I just don't buy it.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
<< <i>
<< <i>ebay uses the excuse that they are just a newspaper classified and not responsible >>
I mean really, if you think about it, this is all eBay truly is. If you buy something through mail order in CoinWorld & it turns out to be a fake, would you be suing CoinWorld? No. If you bought a diamond at a flea market & it was actually a CZ, would you hold the property owner responsible? No. So I don't see what's different about eBay. Just because it's the internet really shouldn't make them more liable. Should they help combat the problem? I think so & I wish they would do a better job. BUT....... By trying to combat the problem is eBay screwing themselves legally by inferring it's their responsibility? That's some legal food for thought. I would not want to see the end of eBay. My collection would not be as big or as nice without the opportunities that I have found there. I ask plenty of questions & never buy raw as far as coins go. As far as other stuff? It's buyer beware & I have to accept the risk of my own actions. If I'm not sure about something I just don't buy it. >>
I buy and sell on EBay fairly frequently.
The most poignant phrase is where it says "If you buy something through mail order in CoinWorld & it turns out to be a fake, would you be suing CoinWorld?"
I tend to shy away from the hype loaded offerings I sometimes see on EBay because I don't trust sales offerings where quality gets replaced with hype.
"Buyer beware" is about all you can achieve by promoting more care and awareness on the part of the buying public..
Possibly EBay could add panels of experts to which people such as the members of this message board can appeal when an obviously bogus 1804 dollar gets offered.
But then who will control what those experts are doing?
Will an "expert" excuse him/herself if somehow connected with a disputed offering?
And how will EBay recruit them?
I think the Tiffany suit is more interesting and important because it draws attention to the problem of fakes and counterfeits.
Such bogus offerings are known about by some but frequently ignored buy the bargain hunting public.
More than the monetary compensation that Tiffany & Co will probably be awarded if they win, the public should have more defenders and promoters of a fair market place than exists today.
Free market should not mean free to cheat.
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I would also like to see them get rid of "Grab Bag", "Mystery" lots, shipping scams, anything from China (Until they get their act together), private feedback, dealers with feedback below 99%, and more.
Andy
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http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/20071113/tiffany-tif-and-ebay-ebay-face-off-in-court-over-counterfeit-items.htm
link
...if they came from eBay in recent years, there's a 95% chance they're fakes. According to a recent BloggingStocks posting by Zac Bissonnette, an investigation several years ago showed that just 5% of all merchandise billed on the auction site as "Tiffany and Co." items were legitimate.
>>>
Will coins get to that same day, when counterfeits are more common than the real thing? Another ten or twenty years of tech advancements and virtually perfect fakes are going to be here. Is the coin market ready for perfect fakes in perfectly faked old time slabs? Will it be a return of the 1960s when a huge percentage of the key date coins in certain coin shops were fakes?
<< <i>The case is back in the news as their court date approaches
http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/20071113/tiffany-tif-and-ebay-ebay-face-off-in-court-over-counterfeit-items.htm
link
...if they came from eBay in recent years, there's a 95% chance they're fakes. According to a recent BloggingStocks posting by Zac Bissonnette, an investigation several years ago showed that just 5% of all merchandise billed on the auction site as "Tiffany and Co." items were legitimate.
>>>
q]
Wow! That's quite a statement to make.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
<< <i>Good. It's about time. I hope Tiffany wins big time. >>
Old thread, but, I don't. I would hope it scares ebay enough to work on things but I hate lawsuits and think 90%+ are stupid and should be thrown out.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
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<< <i>old news....ebay uses the excuse that they are just a newspaper classifed and not responsible.....hmmmmm >>
I don't think this excuse would stand up in court especially since they have a counterfeit coin policy which they enforce vigorously!
Of course, I'm certain that the Tiffany Attorney's have a handle on that one!
The name is LEE!
that may be the fine line....
kinfd of like saying, the big drug lords are just a venue because they never actually handle the drugs.
<< <i>At some point, "venues" must take some responsibility for their sellers ads. Would Coin World be allowed to accept ads for child porn, stolen items, body parts, bombs, etc. Of course not, well why is there no responsibilty to weed out these other items. I think better controls on their sellers is a good place to start. I think they should also do more to educate buyers, making them aware of some of the potentials for fraud on Ebay. You can rest assured that if you were running a Flea Market and it was brought to your attention that some one was selling beer to minors, and you took no action to stop this, that you would be held liable in a court of law. >>
Are you saying eBay allows traffic in body parts?
<< <i>I hope Tiffany wins by way of a huge settlement. If a competing entity decided to develop and to start selling a software program that ultimately was a duplicate of eBay, just WTF do you think eBay would do? Tiffany has a fiduciary duty to protect their trademarked product in the same manner that eBay would protect their proprietary software. >>
Umm, if a competing entity decided to develop and start selling a software program that ultimately was a duplicate of eBay, as long as proprietary information wasn't used, I think there's nothing eBay could do except compete in the marketplace.
You really cannot compare eBay to Tiffany because eBay is a SaaS company, they don't sell their software. A better comparison is with Microsoft and the counterfeit versions of Windows out there.
<< <i>This lawsuit isn't going anywhere. Ebay shuts down any auction Tiffany has objections to. Sellers can be kicked off for repeatedly posting fake items, and they give buyers recourse via the "item not as described" process. I don't see what else ebay can do. >>
So this is like Tiffany wanting to shut down public streets because someone is selling counterfeit Tiffany merchandise on the streets even though the policy stop everyone Tiffany finds and compensates the victims? If this is a valid analogy, good luck.
Where will the multitudes of buyers go? They will go to different ones.
If you list one on site you cannot (should not) ethically list on another site at the same time (auction style), so, do you really think that customers will go to each and every site all the time? If so, you are on something!
You may not like ebay, you may not like the fees, but just take it out of the picture and look at everyone trying their own auction site. Now, go see how much you actually sell, or can find to buy there.
Too many people just want to gangrape ebay on this one.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment