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Update: 17th to Mid-19th Century European Crowns & Thalers Collection << 33 PCGS Grades P

StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
in World & Ancient Coins Forum
Here are the first 13 grades that I have just received for the 33 coin submission for my 17th to Mid-19th Century European Crowns & Thalers Collection submitted to PCGS on October 28th, as previously posted in This Thread.

I am very pleased that all coins were certified (no DNC's), with only one "AU-58" image for a beautiful coin that looks like a gorgeous lustrous MS-63 to me. image

I'd value any comments from some of the experienced World Crown Forum collectors, about this first submission, and about any of the coins which may have high value due to their grades, since I am not yet familiar with current market values for World Crowns. Most of these coins were purchased about 20 years ago, during the early to mid 1980's, during the early years of my coin collecting.

Thanks in advance for your replies and comments.
    1. 1857-A Thaler AUSTRIA MS64
    2. 1879 5 Din Type 1 SERBIA MS65
    3. 1883 Rouble Coronation RUSSIA AU58
    4. 1887 Crown Gr.Britain MS64
    5. 1887 Dbl Fl Arabic 1 Gr.Britain MS62
    6. 1892 Crown Gr.Britain MS64
    7. 1903 F 5 Mark WURTTEM MS63
    8. 1906 5 Lei ROMANIA MS63
    9. 1908 5 Cor AUSTRIA MS63
    10. 1913 D 5 Mark BAVARIA MS62
    11. 1914 BC Rouble RUSSIA MS63
    12. 1928 45 Pst CYPRUS MS64
    13. 1935 50 Fr Railway BELGIUM MS63
    Here are some of my favorites in the other group of 20 older coins remaining to be graded, submitted in a different batch at the same time.

    1633 Salzburg Taler (Ch AU/Unc) - Paris Graf v Lodron (DAV-3504) - Click Here for High Resolution Photo

    1633 Salzburg Taler (Ch AU/Unc) - Paris Graf v Lodron (DAV-3504)
    imageimage


    1653 Saxony Taler - Johann Georg I (Dav-7612) Choice Mint State - Click Here for High Resolution Photo

    1653 Saxony Taler - Johann Georg I (Dav-7612) - Appears Choice Mint State
    imageimage


    1780 Mexico Charles III 8 Reales in Choice Mint State - Click Here for High Resolution Images

    1780 Mexico Charles III 8 Reales in Choice Mint State
    imageimage

    Closeup of the Date
    image

    Stuart

    Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

    "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"

    Comments

    • 21Walker21Walker Posts: 1,762 ✭✭✭
      WOW, beautiful coins, I should be so lucky with the 5 I now have into PCGS for lightside coins.....21S walker (expecting fine)....12S liberty nickel (expecting a fine).....1951S Frankie half ( expecting a 64FBL)....a 52 Frankie (expecting a 65 FBL) and an 81S Morgan (expecting a 64).

      But Stuart, nice catch..............Rick
      If don't look like UNC, it probrably isn't UNC.....U.S. Coast Guard. Chief Petty Officer (Retired) (1970-1990)

      EBAY Items
      http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZrlamir
    • worldcoinguyworldcoinguy Posts: 3,033 ✭✭✭✭✭


      << <i>Thanks in advance for your replies and comments.
        1. 1883 Rouble Coronation RUSSIA AU58
        2. 1914 BC Rouble RUSSIA MS63
        >>



        Great start Stuart. I am interested to know how the 17th & 18th century coins turn out. I won't offer prices on the german talers, but I would wager you could find a buyer at $200 for the 1883 rouble and $500+ for the 1914 rouble. We'll see what gxseries and Nick (nicholasz219) would say.
        -Brent
      • trozautrozau Posts: 3,455 ✭✭✭
        2 Vicky Crowns both MS64! image You suck! imageimage
        trozau (troy ounce gold)
      • SYRACUSIANSYRACUSIAN Posts: 6,473 ✭✭✭✭
        12. 1928 45 Pst CYPRUS MS64



        A very rare grade for this, my own is a PCGS 64 too, with a $333 buyprice (ebay), but I would have paid more if I had to.They usually come baggy and dipped. This was the first crown minted for a British Commonwealth country. Congratulations on these excellent grades,but I would have liked to see a Greek crown among your coins,you can always make up for this later. image
        Dimitri



        myEbay



        DPOTD 3
      • 1jester1jester Posts: 8,637 ✭✭✭
        Once again, congratulations on having such a desirable collection. I'd love to see the results of the second, older batch.

        imageimageimage
        .....GOD
        image

        "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you." -Luke 11:9

        "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might." -Deut. 6:4-5

        "For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; He will save us." -Isaiah 33:22
      • theboz11theboz11 Posts: 6,576 ✭✭✭
        WOW!image
        My Medals collection

        FOR SALE Items
      • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
        Thanks to all who have posted for your sharing your comments on the 13 coins which have so far been graded. I am quite anxious to see the grades for the remaining older 20 Crowns & Thalers which I have not yet received.

        Stuart

        Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

        "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
      • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
        I received this group of 13 coins back from PCGS today, and I agree on pretty much all of the grades except for the gorgeous 1883 Alexander III Coronation Rouble (shown below) which appears to me at least MS-64, which received an AU-58 grade.

        Click Here for High Resolution Images of 1883 Alexander III Coronation Rouble

        imageimage

        I'll update this thread when I receive the grades for the 20 older coins which range in date from 1633 to 1857. image

        Stuart

        Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

        "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
      • worldcoinguyworldcoinguy Posts: 3,033 ✭✭✭✭✭
        Nice rouble Stuart. I would have given it a MS-61, but I am far from an expert in the MS ranges. I am guessing that the graders felt there was too much chitter-chatter in the fields.
      • nicholasz219nicholasz219 Posts: 1,386 ✭✭✭
        Stuart and Worldcoinguy,

        Yeah, I would love to purchase those Rubles. Now if someone would only send me $750, I would be more than happy to take them off of Stuart's hands.

        Hey, those checks that credit cards pay you don't have to be paid back, right?

        image

        Nick
        My Collection
      • 1jester1jester Posts: 8,637 ✭✭✭


        << <i>Nice rouble Stuart. I would have given it a MS-61, but I am far from an expert in the MS ranges. I am guessing that the graders felt there was too much chitter-chatter in the fields. >>



        Chitter-chatter does not a circulated coin make. I like that proof-like coin too!

        imageimageimage
        .....GOD
        image

        "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you." -Luke 11:9

        "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might." -Deut. 6:4-5

        "For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; He will save us." -Isaiah 33:22
      • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
        worldcoinguy, nicholasz219 & 1jester: Thanks for your kind posts regarding this group of coins. The 1883 Alexander III Coronation Rouble looks much better in person than in the harshly lit photo below.

        It's got blindingly flashy Semi-PL surfaces dripping with mint luster.

        Stuart

        Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

        "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
      • wybritwybrit Posts: 6,990 ✭✭✭
        Do you have some pictures of the Victorian crowns?
        Former owner, Cambridge Gate collection.
      • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
        wybrit: Thanks for your post. I do have some photos of the 2 Victoria Crowns and will post them after the Holiday.

        Stuart

        Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

        "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
      • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
        As an update to this thread, I wanted to let you know that I received the remaining 20 (older) coins back graded today from PCGS, and have thus received all 33 coins submitted. I will post all grades when I have a chance, but for now am pleased to announce the grades for the following 3 of my favorite coins that were featured earlier in this thread.

        Please advise me if these are anywhere near condition census coins for their respective type, because I have not yet had a chance to research these specific coin grades. Thanks! image


        1633 Salzburg Taler PCGS MS-63 - Paris Graf v Lodron (DAV-3504) - Click Here for High Resolution Photo

        1633 Salzburg Taler PCGS MS-63 (SBG Grade Ch AU/Unc) - Paris Graf v Lodron (DAV-3504)
        imageimage


        1653 Saxony Taler PCGS MS-63 - Johann Georg I (Dav-7612) - Click Here for High Resolution Photo

        1653 Saxony Taler - Johann Georg I (Dav-7612) - PCGS MS-63 (SBG Grade Appears Choice Mint State)
        imageimage


        1780 Mexico Charles III 8 Reales PCGS MS-62 - Click Here for High Resolution Images

        1780 Mexico Charles III 8 Reales PCGS MS-62 (SBG Grade Choice Mint State)
        imageimage

        Closeup of the Date
        image

        Stuart

        Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

        "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
      • gxseriesgxseries Posts: 423


        << <i>

        << <i>Thanks in advance for your replies and comments.
          1. 1883 Rouble Coronation RUSSIA AU58
          2. 1914 BC Rouble RUSSIA MS63
          >>



          Great start Stuart. I am interested to know how the 17th & 18th century coins turn out. I won't offer prices on the german talers, but I would wager you could find a buyer at $200 for the 1883 rouble and $500+ for the 1914 rouble. We'll see what gxseries and Nick (nicholasz219) would say.
          -Brent >>



          Brent is on the spot. 200 dollars for the 1883 ruble is indeed reasonable. I am not going to suprised if someone offers 700 dollars for such high quality 1914 ruble - those are excessive scarce in such grades.

          *Just a note, there are not too many genuine proof of 1883 corononation ruble. Most commemorative rubles were minted in BU or strictly Proof. I am not too sure if there are Proof-like condition. The last proof 1883 coronation ruble I have seen was two years ago, going over 2000+ dollars as it was NOT described in most catalogue books. I myself was shocked over the grade. The only proof Imperial commemorative coin I have yet to see is the Kolyvan, Romanov, Gangut and Marriage Rubles. Most of the rest had proof version minted as well.

          *Edited to add more material.
          List of my partial coin list: My Coin List
        • MacCrimmonMacCrimmon Posts: 7,058 ✭✭✭
          Stuart, just a note to say that IMO, PCGS is presently quite brutal in handing out anything above a "64", so I'm betting those two crowns are quite choice indeed.image
        • worldcoinguyworldcoinguy Posts: 3,033 ✭✭✭✭✭
          Well done Stuart. The detail on the talers is wonderful, and I would be thrilled with the grades.
        • laurentyvanlaurentyvan Posts: 4,243 ✭✭✭
          Now, that my friend, is the way to present coins and grades. Congratulations!image




          Ed for punc.
          One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics
          is that you end up being governed by inferiors. – Plato
        • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
          Here are the remaining 20 grades (see 1-20 below) that I have just received for the 33 coin submission for my 17th to Mid-19th Century European Crowns & Thalers Collection submitted to PCGS on October 28th, as previously posted (see 21-33 below) in This Thread.

          I am very pleased that out of the entire 33 coin submission, only four (4) of the coins were not certified. I am especially pleased with the three (3) coins pictured below which all graded in choice mint state condition.

          I'd value any comments from some of the experienced World Crown Forum collectors, about this first submission, and about any of the coins which may have high value due to their grades, since I am not yet familiar with current market values for World Crowns. Most of these coins were purchased about 20 years ago, during the early to mid 1980's, during the early years of my coin collecting.

          Thanks in advance for your replies and comments.
            1. 1633 Thaler D-3504 AU-SALZ MS63
            2. 1653 Thaler D-7612 SAXONY MS63
            3. 1754 Thaler D-1248 AU-SALZ MS62
            4. 1764 3 G NETH-WFL MS64
            5. 1780-Mo FF 8 R MEXICO MS62
            6. 1796-IEC Thaler D-2701 SAXONY (Cleaning)
            7. 1804 P Rbl KM-Pn65 RUSSIA PR65BN
            8. 1808-L JP 8 R PERU MS61
            9. 1822-SP PD Rouble RUSSIA MS63
            10. 1823-K 5 Fr FRANCE (Cleaning)
            11. 1831-SP NG Rouble RUSSIA PR63
            12. 1841-A 5 Fr FRANCE MS64
            13. 1850-A 5 Fr FRANCE (Cleaning)
            14. 1852-A 5 Fr FRANCE MS64
            15. NO. # (World Refund - No Service)
            16. 1854-A Thaler AUSTRIA MS63
            17. 1856 2 Gul WURTTEM MS62
            18. 1855 2 Guld Madonna BAVARIA MS64
            19. 1855 B Thaler HANNOVER MS64
            20. 1857 Thaler BAVARIA MS63

            21. 1857-A Thaler AUSTRIA MS64
            22. 1879 5 Din Type 1 SERBIA MS65
            23. 1883 Rouble Coronation RUSSIA AU58
            24. 1887 Crown Gr.Britain MS64
            25. 1887 Dbl Fl Arabic 1 Gr.Britain MS62
            26. 1892 Crown Gr.Britain MS64
            27. 1903 F 5 Mark WURTTEM MS63
            28. 1906 5 Lei ROMANIA MS63
            29. 1908 5 Cor AUSTRIA MS63
            30. 1913 D 5 Mark BAVARIA MS62
            31. 1914 BC Rouble RUSSIA MS63
            32. 1928 45 Pst CYPRUS MS64
            33. 1935 50 Fr Railway BELGIUM MS63

            Stuart

            Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

            "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
          • worldcoinguyworldcoinguy Posts: 3,033 ✭✭✭✭✭
            Stuart,
            Nice submissions. How about some pictures of the 1804, 1822, and 1831 roubles? The 1804 in MS65? 1831 proof? These 2 roubles have the potential to bring a significant price if you were sell them.


            Of course I would be more than willing to give it a nice home also. image
          • rwhiterwhite Posts: 326 ✭
            Wow. Great grades! What are your plans with them? Any plans to sell?
            -Ryan-
          • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
            Ryan: In answer to your question, I plan to keep them and to learn more about their relative rarity.

            WordCoinGuy: It will be probably at least a week until I can find the time to post pictures. I've got a lot on my plate right now, and will be busy throughout the weekend with the upcoming big Houston Southwest Money Coin Show.

            Thanks for your posts and for your kind words about these coins! image

            Stuart

            Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

            "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
          • 1960NYGiants1960NYGiants Posts: 3,536 ✭✭✭✭
            I'm curious about line 15. [NO. # (World Refund - No Service)] What happened? Do you have a pic of it?

            Gene

            edit to add: nice eye for quality. Congrats on the great grades.
            Gene

            Life member #369 of the Royal Canadian Numismatic Association
            Member of Canadian Association of Token Collectors

            Collector of:
            Canadian coins and pre-confederation tokens
            Darkside proof/mint sets dated 1960
            My Ebay
          • TheKidCollector1991TheKidCollector1991 Posts: 722 ✭
            The 1600's coins are amazing!!
            and in that condition!!
            BRILLIANT!!
            Want List
            Proud member of the CUFYNA
            Need a Banner Made? PM ME!
            image
          • gxseriesgxseries Posts: 423


            << <i>Stuart,
            Nice submissions. How about some pictures of the 1804, 1822, and 1831 roubles? The 1804 in MS65? 1831 proof? These 2 roubles have the potential to bring a significant price if you were sell them.


            Of course I would be more than willing to give it a nice home also. image >>



            I am awed over the grades - those are almost impossible to obtain in such grades!!!! It would be nice to see some pictures too, like what worldcoinguy said image Those coins right now are extreme hot sellers - I don't stand a chance to own such coins yet.

            .
            .
            .
            .
            .

            I am still awed over the proof grade... image
            List of my partial coin list: My Coin List
          • 1jester1jester Posts: 8,637 ✭✭✭
            Stuart, is there any way to post pictures of these coins again; I can't seem to find the images of any but a few. Thanks!

            imageimageimage
            .....GOD
            image

            "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you." -Luke 11:9

            "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might." -Deut. 6:4-5

            "For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; He will save us." -Isaiah 33:22
          • FilamCoinsFilamCoins Posts: 1,900 ✭✭✭

            Awesome!!! image
          • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
            1Jester: As I mentioned in an earlier post on this thread, it will be probably at least a week until I can find the time to post pictures. I've got a lot on my plate right now at work, and will be busy throughout the weekend with the upcoming big Houston Southwest Money Coin Show.

            Thanks to all who posted for your kind words about these coins! I agree that the 17th Century (1600's) coins are beautiful and are very special to me in Mint State condition. The 18th Century (1700's) coins are very pretty and special also! image


            WorldCoinGuy: In reply to your previous post, please note that my 1804 Rouble is a Copper Pattern in Proof 65 (not MS), and I would assume as such it may be quire rare, and perhaps valuable to a pattern collector.

            Stuart

            Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

            "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
          • gxseriesgxseries Posts: 423


            << <i>WorldCoinGuy: In reply to your previous post, please note that my 1804 Rouble is a Copper Pattern in Proof 65 (not MS), and I would assume as such it may be quire rare, and perhaps valuable to a pattern collector. >>



            I most definately want to see a picture of it!!! Please help us end our misery!!! image
            List of my partial coin list: My Coin List
          • 1jester1jester Posts: 8,637 ✭✭✭
            Thanks for your reply, Stuart; I missed where you said you'd post pix later.

            imageimageimage
            .....GOD
            image

            "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you." -Luke 11:9

            "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might." -Deut. 6:4-5

            "For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; He will save us." -Isaiah 33:22
          • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
            GXSeries and 1Jester: Thanks for your posts and for your kind words about my World Crowns collection! image

            Stuart

            Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

            "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
          • ibzman350ibzman350 Posts: 5,315 ✭
            Myself, I'm partial to the German coins and I'm always amazed at how well these 17th century coins are preserved.


            Nice collection Stuart, I like.image







            Herb
            Remember it's not how you pick your nose that matters, it's where you put the boogers.
            imageimageimage
          • dorkkarldorkkarl Posts: 12,691 ✭✭✭
            when you gonna post digi-pics of the rest???

            K S
          • StuartStuart Posts: 9,831 ✭✭✭✭✭
            Karl: In reply to your kind request a couple of months ago -- Here are some of my favorite Austrian & German Talers from my collection. image


            1606 Saxony Taler NGC-62 (DAV-7566)
            image

            image
            image


            1813 IGS Saxony Thaler (German States) DAV-854 -- ANACS MS-61
            image

            image
            image


            1705 NGC AU55 Austria Olmutz Charles III Josef Broad Thaler (Dav-1209)
            image

            image
            image


            1778B SK-PD Kremnitz Austria Taler (DAV-1133)
            image

            image
            image

            Stuart

            Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

            "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
          • TheKidCollector1991TheKidCollector1991 Posts: 722 ✭
            Absolutely SPECTACULAR Saxony Taler.
            Beautiful coin!
            Great Detail.
            Want List
            Proud member of the CUFYNA
            Need a Banner Made? PM ME!
            image
          • wildjagwildjag Posts: 1,335 ✭✭✭
            Nice coins. Do you have any pics of number 19 - 1855 B Thaler HANNOVER MS64?
          • ZoharZohar Posts: 6,678 ✭✭✭✭✭
            A few of mine:

            Rudolf II (1576-1612) Taler NGC MS-61
            image

            Archduke Ferdinand (1564-1595) Taler NGC MS-63
            image

            Vienna Mint Charles VI (1711-1740) Taler NGC MS-63
            image

            Rudolf II (1576-1612) Taler AU
            image

            Graz Ferdinand II (1617-1637) Taler NGC AU-50
            image

            Charles VI (1711-1740) ND 2 Taler AU-58 NGC 834 Minted.
            image

            Habsburg Talers
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