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SGC board is bashing the SMR

Okay, we all know that many of the folks over on the SGC board don't particularly like PSA. I for one really don't care as that board is a graveyard the majority of the time anyway. However, they now have a thread up stating that PSA is desperate to improve the SMR and that is why Joe O. is soliciting new contributers/writers. I think this is a good idea on PSA's part. Numerous guys on this board have a ton of insight and experience to offer.

Long story short: a couple of guys over there are basically opining that the SMR is a piece of garbage, etc. Question: Does SGC even offer a monthly price guide/magazine? Do these guys not have anything better to do than take every opportunity possible to bash PSA? It amazes me how jealous many over on that board seem. To be honest, I am embarrassed for some of them sometimes. image

Comments

  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    nope, they have nothing better to do. do we? lol at times though they can be found right here among us.

    sd
    Good for you.
  • an alarm just went off in dabighurt's house...
  • bobbybakerivbobbybakeriv Posts: 2,186 ✭✭✭✭
    I hear ya and you are right about many of them posting over here (they are welcome to do so as far as I'm concerned). I just don't see PSA loyal folks over here bashing SGC at every opportunity. The guys over there would throw stones from the biggest glass house if they thought they could remotely bruise PSA. It is laughable at times.
  • Anybody who will bash a company for trying to improve needs to examine their way of thinking.
    Collecting
    Minnie Minoso Master and Basic
    1967 Topps PSA 8+
    1960's Topps run Mega Set image
    "For me, playing baseball has been like a war and I was defending the uniform I wore, Every time I put on the uniform I respected it like the American flag. I wore it like I was representing every Latin country."--Minnie Minoso
    image
  • The SMR is a joke. Just check SMR values against ended Ebay auctions. That said I hope PSA does a better job with NonSports SMR values. If they would just track the Ebay results - their data would be much more accurate.
    30's R Want List:

    R73 1933 Goudey Indian Gum - Series 288 - Nos. 118
    Also looking for 1953 Parkhurst & 1953 Quaker Oats Ripley's BION.

    If you have any available for sale PM me
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    That said I hope PSA does a better job with NonSports SMR values


    war if i remm joe came on the non sports card forum asking for input. i sent him my input regarding mars attacks...............that was months ago. was there any change? not to my knowledge.


    sd
    Good for you.
  • Stone193Stone193 Posts: 24,407 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>SGC board is bashing the SMR >>


    We don't need SGC people to do that...we can do it ourselves!

    image
    Mike
  • pandrewspandrews Posts: 7,598 ✭✭✭


    << <i>The guys over there would throw stone from the biggest glass house if they thought they could remotely bruise PSA. >>



    well if they go tryin' to mess with Stone, then they're gonna have trouble on their hands..
    ·p_A·
  • pandrewspandrews Posts: 7,598 ✭✭✭


    << <i>We don't need SGC people to do that...we can do it ourselves!
    >>



    heh
    ·p_A·
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    give em hell perry
    Good for you.
  • Stone193Stone193 Posts: 24,407 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>The guys over there would throw stone from the biggest glass house if they thought they could remotely bruise PSA. >>



    well if they go tryin' to mess with Stone, then they're gonna have trouble on their hands.. >>


    That right!

    I had a tough winter with my head thing - with the weight I put on - if you can throw "me"? You be the baddest guy in the county!

    image
    Mike


  • << <i>The SMR is a joke. Just check SMR values against ended Ebay auctions. That said I hope PSA does a better job with NonSports SMR values. If they would just track the Ebay results - their data would be much more accurate. >>



    Yeah well I can agree with this for the most part the prices in the SMR are too high or too low. Example a 1957 Topps Minoso PSA 8 sold a day or so ago for $140.50 and the SMR is $80 but guess what the SMR is close on alot of stuff more than I can say about Beckett and on top of that when was the last time you saw a price guide list an item for $60 less than it sold for? I think the SMR is on track it just needs to be updated more regularily.
    Collecting
    Minnie Minoso Master and Basic
    1967 Topps PSA 8+
    1960's Topps run Mega Set image
    "For me, playing baseball has been like a war and I was defending the uniform I wore, Every time I put on the uniform I respected it like the American flag. I wore it like I was representing every Latin country."--Minnie Minoso
    image
  • zef204zef204 Posts: 4,742 ✭✭


    Everytime I e-mail PSA about wrong prices they say "We can't adjust our prices because of one sale." I gave up trying to inform them after getting that 20-30 times.

    I understand where they are coming from, and a guide is exactly that,a guide. I don't think SMR has sucked because of the pricing issues. I think that the content has not been so great and I am happy to see that they are looking to improve that part.
    EAMUS CATULI!

    My Auctions
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭
    I guess the SGC folks are really happy with their own price guide. What's that you say? They don't have one and they use SMR?

    I bet they think our registry is pretty bad, too.
  • I subscribe to the online SMR & pop report... they come bundled together, but the pop report is worth much more than the SMR.

    I've always thought of it as this: The SMR is an attempt to list the "demand" for the card. The pop report lists the "supply". The real price is obviously a bit of both... if only they could figure out how to combine the two...

    Brian
  • DaBigHurtDaBigHurt Posts: 1,066 ✭✭
    The SMR is fine. People are just too critical sometimes. PSA is the unquestioned leader of the industry and are doing a great job, as evidenced by the PSA Set Registry, the NINE MILLION cards they've graded and the record prices their slabs bring. Think about that for a second. PSA has graded more cards than SGC, GAI and BGS combined. Sounds like people are just jealous of PSA. image
    image

    GO MARLINS! Home of the best fans in baseball!!
  • I've sent in updated prices on Horror of War Cards. #240 in Raw regullarly sells for 300 to 400. A PSA5 #283 (Hitler Card) recentlyy went for over $1.000.00. I'm bidding on a PSA5 #277 (Hitler Card) haven't met the reseve at $208.00. Compare those prices to SMR. A G/VG Raw # 286 (Hitler Card) has an opening bid of $49.99 (It will sell - I'll buy it at that price). I'm a fan & supporter of PSA but they could do a better job of establishing more accurate SMR price guide values. Just some effort on PSA's part.
    30's R Want List:

    R73 1933 Goudey Indian Gum - Series 288 - Nos. 118
    Also looking for 1953 Parkhurst & 1953 Quaker Oats Ripley's BION.

    If you have any available for sale PM me
  • joestalinjoestalin Posts: 12,473 ✭✭
    I think any printed guide can't keep up with the daily madness that goes on on ebay. The price of a card can shift daily and there are
    many other factors invloved with a card on ebay than people think.

    I personally think that graded card collectors think too much of themselves. Does anyone outside vintage set builder get cards graded
    anymore?? I figure if PSA and BGS can't figure out which is the real Pujols bowman chrome autograph rookie card 5/500, then everything
    else is a chance anyways!



    JS
  • stevekstevek Posts: 29,038 ✭✭✭✭✭
    <<< The SMR is a joke. >>>

    Actually considering the dynamics of the baseball card market, in my opinion the SMR is quite well done. Remember, it's a guide, it is not definitive prices - that would probably be impossible or close to impossible. Can it be improved...of course...any price guide such as this can always have room for improvement.
  • Carew29Carew29 Posts: 4,025 ✭✭

    The pop report is probably the bigger joke as tons of cards have been cracked open and resubmitted. I know my 68 PSA 8 Mantle has been sent in on 3 different occasions hoping for a 9 over the last 3 years. Which means 2 of those in the pop don't exist. And who knows i may send it in again this year.
  • (Sounds like people are just jealous of PSA.)

    There is some of that.

    On the SMR prices, it is important to realize/accept that ebay sales are really just
    a very good "indicator" of what the market is doing on a particular day or hour.
    Ebay prices do NOT equal the retail market and are weighted at - in my view -
    about 85% toward wholesale. In other words, as someone else said: "Ebay is
    kind of wholesale for everybody."

    On the issue of that "everybody" group: I did a large "collectibles" show last
    week. I likely talked to at least 200 people about ebay. The breakdown was
    about like this. "Everybody" has heard of ebay. 20% of folks "claim" to have
    used ebay. 85 % of folks have a negative or somewhat negative opinion of
    ebay (for reasons that they usually cannot articulate or support with personal
    anecdotes.)............ The FACT is that most people do NOT buy their stuff on ebay
    MOST people buy their collectibles from "dealers" that are ACTUALLY just "medium-
    sized collectors." Cards can be found, today, in just about every type of "collectible
    shop." Such stores carry ALL collectibles and do not specialize in cards.

    (In my market - top ten population - a store that "specializes" in ONLY cards would not
    be able to pay the rent.)

    SMR is a useful magazine, but it is another example of how little material is available
    to card dealers - compared to say, stamps and coins. Last month's SMR was better
    than the previous one; it will get better as more effort is expended to make it better.

    I know that I am a "cheerleader" for PSA, in part, because I have a very substantial
    investment in products that bear their name. Graded cards, in many markets, are
    still in their infancy; I realized that at last week's collectible show. 90% of almost
    every PSA sale was "educating" folks about why graded is better. (It was not PSA v.
    some-other grader.)

    Cher
  • Ok, I know the vast majority of the posters here collect sports cards. My point was to point out how inaccurate & absurd the SMR is for NonSports cards. Now I'll go crawl back into my comffy Hobbit hole.
    30's R Want List:

    R73 1933 Goudey Indian Gum - Series 288 - Nos. 118
    Also looking for 1953 Parkhurst & 1953 Quaker Oats Ripley's BION.

    If you have any available for sale PM me
  • Non-sports cards are VERY cool, I think.
    Civil War News, the TV-series stuff, all of the other war cards
    are very appealing to me. They all look a lot better in a PSA holder,
    too. SMR should give them appropriate space in both prices and
    feature stories.

    Cher
  • Thanks cdchanger, glad someone agrees with me
    30's R Want List:

    R73 1933 Goudey Indian Gum - Series 288 - Nos. 118
    Also looking for 1953 Parkhurst & 1953 Quaker Oats Ripley's BION.

    If you have any available for sale PM me
  • SoutherncardsSoutherncards Posts: 1,384 ✭✭
    ok I'm sure that I'm going to get bashed, but here goes it....

    SGC does, for those interested, have a price guide online. Been in place for a long time. Let me also add that there are exactly 2 posts about this subject on the SGC board consisting of one sentence each. If that is the widespread PSA bashing that you are worried about, I guess you scare easily.

    With that said, price guides, book values etc are what's killing this hobby. Cards should be fun, not for profit.
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭


    << <i>I personally think that graded card collectors think too much of themselves. >>


    This is probably true. I consider myself a solid 8, but my wife likely regards me as a 7 with a qualifier.
  • srs1asrs1a Posts: 398
    bobbybakeriv, get a clue. You don't have to go to the SGC board to see SMR bashing....just do a simple search here. My post wasn't bashing -- read it again. I said that Joe O. was out looking for a writer for SMR the week of the national simply because most of the people that could help would be there. duh.

    I think that SMR could use some significant improvements, and, based on discussion on this board, many people agree. As it stands now, I get one every year or so and use it as a price reference. The one I have on my desk now is October 2004. Two of the articles in this issue are mildly interesting, but certainly not enough for me to be a regular subscriber.

    I thought that the vintage hockey articles written by Tom Papa were a breath of fresh air -- although breaking the article in half and delaying publication of the second half for an extended period of time left something to be desired. I hope Joe can pick up a skilled hobbyist to strenghten SMR. I hope SMR becomes something that I would like to read on a regular basis, but today it is not.
    Dr S. of the Dead Donkeys MC
  • StingrayStingray Posts: 8,843 ✭✭✭
    Heck I don't need a priceguide, a card is only worth what I am willing to pay for it. If I see a card I want, if SMR is $5 for it and I want it bad enough, then I will have to overpay to get it if that is necessary. If it is not something I need or desperate for then I wait for the next one to come around. Heck sometimes you get a few real good deals, $2.00 for PSA 8 1975 that list at $12 SMR (not sure if the is the correct SMR), but anyway I think with all that I buy over or under SMR it is a wash. Anyways Price Guides do not take into account shipping costs.image

    Stingray
  • I think it is a lot of wasted energy for them to argue over something as petty as graded baseball cards. With that said, I am an SGC guy myself for the majority of my collection. I like their holder better, and really can't stand PSA's holder. Other than that, who cares what grading service you use...
  • aconteaconte Posts: 2,053 ✭✭✭
    bobbybakeriv = image

    aconte
  • bobbybakerivbobbybakeriv Posts: 2,186 ✭✭✭✭
    aconte = richard (sorry, I can't seem to find the appropriate emoticon).

    SRS1 - your quote, "Perhaps realization that SMR sucks and that may of the folks that might help repair it are at the National. Just a thought ." I guess you were just offering sincere and positive coaching by eloquently pointing out that the "SMR sucks." Thanks.

    SouthernCards, your point is understood and noted. I guess "bashing" is too strong of a word. My point was really meant to be this: how can anyone criticize others for lackluster performance on something that your company doesn't even offer?
  • jackstrawjackstraw Posts: 3,764 ✭✭✭
    I think PSA wants something for free and they are not going to get it here! Lets see write an article for our magazine(that we sell) to make better so more people buy it? Then we can make more money and I get a bonus and credit for all the hard work I did finding someone to write articles for our magazine(for free) thus improving sales and our profit?
    Collector Focus

    ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
  • KnucklesKnuckles Posts: 2,512 ✭✭✭
    The hockey section I've found to be way off but sort of expect hockey to be neglected.. especially their hockey autographs section some vintage autographs are listed for $400.00 that go for $2,000 minimum... $125 that go for $400ish and so on.
    image
  • zef204zef204 Posts: 4,742 ✭✭


    << <i>Heck I don't need a priceguide, a card is only worth what I am willing to pay for it. >>

    Right on Stingray!

    And on the flip side if you go to sell a card, it is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. It's much simpler looking at it this way.
    EAMUS CATULI!

    My Auctions
  • SoutherncardsSoutherncards Posts: 1,384 ✭✭
    bobbybakeriv - if you are refering to a priceguide as something that SGC doesnt offer, refer back to my post...better yet, here.........

    http://popreport.sgccard.com/pricelist.asp
  • bobbybakerivbobbybakeriv Posts: 2,186 ✭✭✭✭
    Nope. Referring to the printed magazine with articles, etc. Not online pricing.
  • RipublicaninMassRipublicaninMass Posts: 10,051 ✭✭✭


    << <i>The guys over there would throw stone from the biggest glass house if they thought they could remotely bruise PSA.

    well if they go tryin' to mess with Stone, then they're gonna have trouble on their hands.
    That right!

    I had a tough winter with my head thing - with the weight I put on - if you can throw "me"? You be the baddest guy in the county!

    image >>



    Stone, do you mean a "Judo throw", or a "bartender grab by the collar and seat of the pants" throw?
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭
    I like (SGC's) holder better, and really can't stand PSA's holder. Other than that, who cares what grading service you use.

    Brooksie, I strongly recommend that you stay away from PRO or GEM or AAA even if they change to a nice-looking holder. It matters! Point is well taken about PSA's holder needing an update, but I don't use PSA for the cosmetics of the holder.

    I think PSA wants something for free and they are not going to get it here!

    jackstaw, I don't think Joe was soliciting free stories but, speaking for myself, I would do it. That is, I would if I was able to commit to a feature-length story every month such as David Laurel writes. I have proposed something shorter and more flexible, and time will tell if Joe thinks it's a good idea or it sucks. Anyway, I think SMR could be improved in editorial content and I am willing to contribute something that I think it needs. I hope there is some compensation, if only grading vouchers or a free membership, but like Shoeless Joe said in Eight Men Out:

    I'd play this game for meal money. Hell, I'd play this game for nuthin'.
  • StingrayStingray Posts: 8,843 ✭✭✭
    I have only had a couple of SMRs, but do they have a letter to the editor type of column? I think that would be cool to be able to write in a question or voice an opinion on an issue.

    Stingray
  • SoutherncardsSoutherncards Posts: 1,384 ✭✭
    SGC did do a short newsletter type publication at one time but they are supposed to have a magazine coming out soon.
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