Is this really ebay's recommendation?

MorrellMan

I didn't do the research, but I hope it's not. This is from an auction I just noticed today:

"I appreciate your concerns about feedback. Let me explain my position.

eBay suggests that the buyer post feedback
first as a signal that the item has been received and that the transaction is over. The reason I ask the customer to post feedback first is that I do not consider the transaction complete until I know that the customer is satisfied. This is the only way I have of ensuring quality customer service."

I think what the guy is saying is that this is the only way I know I can retaliate with a neg if you hit me with one. What do you think?

baseballfanatic

Hate to say it, but thats the rule I go by, even though it isnt Ebays. Too may times its the buyers that hold the little guy seller hostage with feedback, and if the seller has already given a positive after receiving payment, he is held at the buyers mercy.........

Stone193

Mark
I think you nailed it. I can see it from everyone's point of view and there's no easy answer. I think that the seller should leave FB after the buyer pays since their requirement for rating has been satisfied - having said that, I can understand "holding out" - I don't sell and probably won't - life's too short to be aggrevated - you personally know what I go thru everyday - if I had ebay to deal with also?...just shoot me!

Go Spurs!
mike

TNP777

my .02 - I absolutely, totally disagree with anyone who thinks it is acceptable to make the buyer leave feedback first. I rarely sell, mostly buy. I feel that my obligation as the buyer is to pay quickly. When payment has been made (almost always with PayPal), I feel that my end of the transaction has been completed. I should now reasonably expect positive feedback to be left for me. If a buyer is negligent about sending the card(s) to me in a timely manner, or the cards arrive damaged, or not at all, I should not be at the mercy of the seller if I am displeased with the transaction. I have only had to leave a few negs, but a few others were deserved. I value my reputation on eBay, and I'm not willing to take a neg when the seller has been at fault and is holding my feedback hostage. When I do occasionally sell, I leave feedback as soon as payment is received. It's (IMO) the right thing to do.

baseballcardsonly

<< <i>my .02 - I absolutely, totally disagree with anyone who thinks it is acceptable to make the buyer leave feedback first. I rarely sell, mostly buy. I feel that my obligation as the buyer is to pay quickly. When payment has been made (almost always with PayPal), I feel that my end of the transaction has been completed. I should now reasonably expect positive feedback to be left for me. If a buyer is negligent about sending the card(s) to me in a timely manner, or the cards arrive damaged, or not at all, I should not be at the mercy of the seller if I am displeased with the transaction. I have only had to leave a few negs, but a few others were deserved. I value my reputation on eBay, and I'm not willing to take a neg when the seller has been at fault and is holding my feedback hostage. When I do occasionally sell, I leave feedback as soon as payment is received. It's (IMO) the right thing to do. >>



BINGO! we have a winner....

Once I get a little higher on the feedback scale, I'm going to stop giving feedback as a buyer until the seller leaves it. Ebay is entirely set up to protect the sellers and I'm tired of it. The sellers have ZERO risk and the buyers take it all. The seller doesn't ship until payment arrives (so no payment, no item). The seller takes no responsibility for items arriving to you (lost in the mail, sucks to be the buyer) once again no risk on the seller. The item arrives in less the stated condition (oh well! opinions vary) the seller has your money, you have junk. So please stop with this buyer holding the seller hostage crap, its the other way around. The worst thing that can happen as a seller is for a buyer not to pay, but you can file a claim with ebay and start over. Even if the buyer pays w/paypal, if you have delivery confirmation, no disputes, you keep your money. I wish I could get these guarantees as a buyer!

denwd1

fact: there are as many buyers who are scam artists as there as sellers who are scammers. just read these boards.as a buyer i always leave feedback when i recieve what i bought. i do not see any point in leaving a buyer immediate feedback for paying for an item he purchased. if you do,then you are set up for the buyer scammer. this is what the buyer scammer is waiting for,immediate feedback. most can see a seller scam,it's right there in the discription or in the sellers lousy feedback. but you don't know when a buyer scam will hit you.it's like a sucker punch and it's nasty.so as a seller you have to wait to see if buyer is legit. also you can get a negative from "THE CRYBABY BUYER" "took a week to get my card", "didn't email me that he sent my card" ," took 10 days to get here" "rip me off on shipping,paid $2.00 to ship card and it only cost him $1.37 to send it" and on and on.....

notowellint

I hate that last one...buyers complaining because they paid $1 more for shipping than what it cost for postage. I guess I shouldn't complain since the elves in my back room made the packaging material from recycled trash they found in the alley and then I had the fairies take it to the post office for me...and on the rare occasion I do have to take it myself, gas is essentially free right now so it's no big deal.

Stingray

What in everyone's opinion is a fiar price to charge for shipping. I see that $3.00 is about average for one PSA graded card, but I have paid anyweres from $2 to $5 for shipping, based on one PSA card. I see people selling high priced items asking $10 and $20 for shipping, is that fair? I have noticed a lot that people who sell high volume on Ebay even forget to give a feedback. I have still not, even after the guy emailed me back and said he would leave feedback because his computer was crashed for two week, have not received my feedback. Why as the buyer when my payment is received, get a feedback from the seller? I did my part in the transaction and if it was received as the transaction states then I should get my feedback then, not until after I leave mine.

My thoughts on things.

Stingray

jrdolan

<< <i>[The sellers have ZERO risk and the buyers take it all. >>


Respectfully, as both a seller and buyer, I don't think either side has it easy on a transaction that relies entirely on the integrity and competence of both parties in order to be successful. Either buyer or seller can screw the other, if precautions are not taken. Two of the most obvious examples:

The buyer is set up for a screwing if he pays by check or money order (and some sellers don't take PayPal). Then he is relying entirely on the honesty of the seller, who can choose NOT to send the merchandise without fear once he's cashed the check. The only weapon the buyer has is neg. feedback. But there are sellers who cheerfully take a neg in exchange for keeping both money and merchandise, if the amount is large enough. When the negs build up too high, they cheerfully dump that ID.

The seller is set up for a screwing if he sends the merchandise without delivery confirmation (and most don't). All the buyer has to do, when he sees the valuable item arrived without the green or pink sticker, is claim it didn't arrive. PayPal will automatically pull the money back from the seller who can't prove D/C. The only weapon the seller has is neg. feedback. But there are buyers who cheerfully take a neg in exchange for getting a valuable item for free, if the amount is large enough. When the negs build up too high, they cheerfully dump that ID.

Somebody's gotta give feedback first. Or buyer and seller and look at each other warily and neither gives it. I think in general since the seller gets what he wants out of the transaction first, it should be him. With buyers who seem to be a risk, though, I can see why he would hesitate.

jrdolan

<< <i>I see people selling high priced items asking $10 and $20 for shipping, is that fair? >>


Yes, it is. I am selling a graded Mays rookie right now with $15 shipping. You'd better believe that Priority shipping with delivery confirmation and INSURANCE (the key word) will cost me more than that. Not even counting gas, time, materials and the other factors mentioned by dnwd1.

That said, as a buyer I have no tolerance for people who charge $5 for shipping and send the card in a bubble mailer with 87 cents postage and no other protection against the notorious USPS Sorting Machine, aka the Card Crusher. I have have even had people charge $5 and then send a toploader in a 37 cent envelope.

That's at the far end of the sleaze spectrum, of course. I don't mind paying $3 or $3.50 for a bubble envelope with some interior cardboard stiffeners, delivery confirmation and a FRAGILE stamp. It only takes a second to ask the clerk to mark it FRAGILE so it doesn't go through the Crushing Rollers of Death.

Stingray

<< <i>Yes, it is. I am selling a graded Mays rookie right now with $15 shipping. You'd better believe that Priority shipping with delivery confirmation and INSURANCE (the key word) will cost me more than that. Not even counting gas, time, materials and the other factors mentioned by dnwd1. >>



As a person who does not sell on Ebay, I did not realize that! I will have to keep an eye on how exactly people are shipping there items before I gripe about it. Thanks.

Stingray

helionaut

That's the rule I go by (in the first post). I mean, in addition to trading a card or whatever, you are also trading information. The give and take of a transaction doesn't end when payment is received. For me, it's when the buyer acknowledges receipt of the card. Otherwise, how do I know? That information has to be conveyed back to me somehow. It doesn't even have to be through feedback. He can just send an email saying,"I got the card, thanks." And that's that. After a month or so, I'll usually leave feedback for buyers even if they haven't left it for me just to clear up that screen and I figure if there's something wrong they'll have complained already. And if they do go psycho and neg me for no reason, I consider that to be an unsatisfactory transaction and will neg them.

pandrews

<< <i>Ebay is entirely set up to protect the sellers and I'm tired of it. The sellers have ZERO risk and the buyers take it all. >>


incorrect..


<< <i>The worst thing that can happen as a seller is for a buyer not to pay >>


incorrect..

pandrews

<< <i>fact: there are as many buyers who are scam artists as there as sellers who are scammers. just read these boards.as a buyer i always leave feedback when i recieve what i bought. i do not see any point in leaving a buyer immediate feedback for paying for an item he purchased. if you do,then you are set up for the buyer scammer. this is what the buyer scammer is waiting for,immediate feedback. most can see a seller scam,it's right there in the discription or in the sellers lousy feedback. but you don't know when a buyer scam will hit you.it's like a sucker punch and it's nasty.so as a seller you have to wait to see if buyer is legit. also you can get a negative from "THE CRYBABY BUYER" "took a week to get my card", "didn't email me that he sent my card" ," took 10 days to get here" "rip me off on shipping,paid $2.00 to ship card and it only cost him $1.37 to send it" and on and on..... >>



100% correct.

pandrews

<< <i> I see people selling high priced items asking $10 and $20 for shipping, is that fair? >>



depending on how high the auction ends, if the seller is including insurance with the $10 or $20 fee, it maybe a fair rate.. i think $1000 insurance costs $11.00+..

notowellint

I often offer a choice for shipping. If the buyer wants it shipped in a padded envelope (holder is sandwiched between two pieces of cardboard inside) then I'll charge $2 shipping. If they want it bubble wrapped in a box I charge $3. That feels fair to me. I always add delivery confirmation to my packages but I don't charge the seller for that as part of the shipping. I figure that's my expense but maybe that's not how most sellers do things so maybe I could afford to change that without upsetting buyers.

Axtell

The way I see it, as a buyer, my part of the contract is done when my paypal payment posts. At that point (to me, at least) the seller should post positive feedback and get my stuff in the mail.

After that, I leave positive feedback upon a timely shipment of the item, the item being as described, and it being packaged as I paid for.

If the seller communicates difficulties, and there's a slight delay, I understand that, and still give positive. To me, the seller should ALWAYS leave feedback first.

I have given a grand total of 2 negatives in my years on ebay...I think a bit of patience and communication goes a long, long way.

Stone193

Speaking of recommendations.

Chinese or Barbecue?

mike

pandrews

<< <i>Speaking of recommendations.

Chinese or Barbecue?

mike >>



BBQ

mudflap02

I recommend ASIAN food, Mike. Jeez, just when you think you know somebody, they bust out with a comment like that. These were not the people that built the railroads.

Stone193

<< <i>I recommend ASIAN food, Mike. Jeez, just when you think you know somebody, they bust out with a comment like that. These were not the people that built the railroads. >>


Mud
This is San Antonio, you call it "asian" and the price of the fried rice goes up a 1.50!