Coin Dealer Newsletter - Bid/Ask

skerke

I've been trying to get a broad feel of the market for coins. More to understand buying, but, also the business model as a whole. I check the PCGS price guide, Coin mgazines, Red/blue book and of course the auction ebay/Heritage/ etc to get a feeling for the worth of a coin. Now I know, any coin is worth what you want to spend and the whole philosphy of collecting/investing and the other less tangible aspects of value.

Let's say an 1898 Indian Head penny certified as ms63rb The raw coin 1898 lists in CDN as BID $65 ask $70
Coin Values Magazine has an ms63RB listed as $100
PCGS Lists it as $118
CDN blue sheet (graded) are listed $28 PCGS and $26 NGC

Would it be 'typical' for a dealer to buy the coin if it came across their shop for the bid price and resell for retail or slightly above retail?
Why would the blue sheet price be less than the grey sheet price for bid?

I have not scanned ebay for a certified (NGC/PCGS 1898 ms64rb yet) to get 'real market value'. I'd be interested in thoughts around CDN prices in gauging how to approach buying and selling coins from dealers (particularly selling). I know there is a lot of problems with ebay, but given the volume I see ontheir daily I had one last question, this one for the dealers out there, have you noticed a drop in the walk-in traffic of people sellign coins, given the rise of ebay, or is it more, the same and people , just want to sell there items and be done with it?


Thanks in advance for any random thoughts, insight or other comments on the topic of pricing CDN/Retail and sellig to dealers.
As a business owner I know you want to make as much as humanly possible, but, from these boards, I learned that an educated consumer is still the smartest way to apporach anything.

kranky

The CDN says they quote wholesale dealer-to-dealer prices, so I would expect buying from the public to be at a number less than bid, and selling to the public to be higher than ask. It's widely acknowledged that for many coins the CDN is completely out of touch, though.

The Bluesheet can be less than Graysheet because the Graysheet is for properly graded coins. The Bluesheet pricing, as I understand it, is for sight-unseen transactions, which means the worst possible coin that ever got into a particular slab.

Using a RB Indian Head cent as an example might not be your best choice, since RB can cover a lot of ground. A mostly-red RB is going to be worth more than a barely-red RB, and that could partially explain the difference between CDN and Bluesheet.

Steve

Inteeresting question. I guess we all don't want to overpay when buying and a seller wants to get as much as he can. Trying to over analyze this is really fruitless. So much depends on the makeup and motivations of the two people doing the transaction. Obviously, the coin itself plays into the equation too. That's why the price guides are just "guides" to current market and not the absolute answer.

As an example, I own a 1909VDB Matte Proof Lincoln cent graded as PR61RB by PCGS. It is the lowest grade they have given for that coin. It has a carbon spot above Lincoln's head and that it is reason for the low grade. Now, anyone collecting Lincoln cent wheat proofs knows that this coin is the key to the set. Only 420 were minted and less than 200 are remaining in existence. Only about 160 have been graded by all the grading services, probably some multiple times. So what is MY coin worth? The price guides say less than $1,000. I'm willing to bet that if someone really wants that coin for his collection he would be willing to pay much more. The reason is that a coin like this is very, very difficult to get, usually only in auction where prices are well into the thousands and some gems over $10,000.

Hope this helps. JMHO. Steve

skerke

All of the info and insight helps. I like taking the pulse of the numerous types of people this board has -; newbies, dealers, wannabees, serious and casual collectors etc. I typically use the coin mags for retail price ( reasonable market price) and only on occasion add a few bucks for certifying - yes it has value, but as few dealers told me recently a $5 coin in $15 plastic is still a $5 coin. I like the phrase "buy the coin not the plastic" I just purchased a 1938 raw shield nickel from Harlen Berk ( I live near the shop -very dangerous. )and am happy to have the coin, I think at $125 for ms 62, it was a fair deal, and I did get instant gratification, no shipping fees or waiting, I was able to examine the coin and take it home with me. That and the conversation with one of the dealers (Dennis),nice enough person-friendly and knowledgable, was better than an email from any seller on ebay.

Since I'm a PCGS platinum member I get to have the coin graded for free this quarter (they have a promo every quarter so I might as well do it) I'll be bale to see if there grade holds if I'm lucky they were conservative and it will bump up a grade. I'm working on figuring how to take better digipics to post.

Anyhow, as I move forward, I'm just trying to learn as much as humanly possible, maybe put me in a better negotiation position buying/ or selling. Thanks.

morgannut2

Your understading of the Bid/Ask relationship might be more pure if you look at widely traded coins with broad demand. Examples would include Morgan Dollars, SL Halves, etc. with the exception of all copper coins which are very idiosyncratic due to colors. While the idea that a $5 coin in a $15 holder worth $5 is true, in rarer coins the reverse is true. For example a non NGC/PCGS/ANACS (raw) 1916D Key date dime in G is a $50 to $200 coin but a $475-$1200 coin in a $15 holder. The rarer, more lightly traded, and more often counterfieted/altered an example might be, the greater the influence of both sight-seen prices over sight-unseen, and certification.

itsnotjustme

I think you mis-read the grey sheet. I show 38/42 for an MS63RB Indian Cent.

mirabela

A raw 16-D dime in Good for $50-200? Show me where!

Your larger point holds. A $5 coin in a $15 holder is a $5 coin, but a $150 coin *not* in the $15 holder may well be a $30 coin, especially if sold through online auction.