Honus Wagner T206 PSA 2 on Mastronet
eadams24
Posts: 139
Did this go for only $205,000 on Mastronet's recent auction? I though Honus Wagners went for a lot more.
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Comments
T206's are always being bought.
aloof1003@comcast.net
<< <i>only $205,000 >>
Stingray
Brian Seigle owns the card right now - he bought it in 2000. Gretsky and McNall bought it in 1991 for about 500 grand. As was said, Pat Gibbs, a postal worker won the card and put up for auction at Christies in 1996 when Mike Gidwitz bought the card for like 650 grand. The rest is history.
Seigle paid about 1.3 million!
mike
Let me preface with - I am a PSA collector - I just wanted opinions on the "corner" wear on this card. The general shape of the corners is not consistent with honest wear IMO - some corners almost appear to be trimmed? Especially the upper right corner?
I would like some opinions?
mike
T206 Wagner PSA 1
It's a pretty rough card, but still 1/2 the price of the PSA 2.
mike
Thanks for the scan, I was too lazy to find the site myself.
Looking at that one, the Leland's PSA 1 (see a few posts earlier) looks like a great deal.
A few comments: I am also a PSA collector. I own 12 PSA 2 cards (all 1952 Topps), and NONE of them have corners have even 1 corner that looks like those 4 (trimmed or not).
In regards to the corners, I can't tell for sure if they're "trimmed" or not. Maybe I was dreaming, but I swear that I've seen PSA graded cards that clearly had the corners cut on a 45 degree angle (these were PSA 1's).
Admittedly, I struggle with this a little bit. Obviously, I think trimming a card to make it "Mint" is wrong. But for some reason, when it comes to low grade cards, it doesn't seem to matter to me if the corners are clipped. I wouldn't consider this a "doctored" card, especially if it was from someone who did not know any better. I know, how can you tell the "trimmer's" intent?
Finally, one of my biggest (and one of my few) issues with PSA is the wide range of conditions that comprise a PSA 1 (and even a PSA 2) card. Basically, anything that's authentic is going to get a 1, whether it's been on the bicycle spokes or not. I think SGC (with their "1.5" or SGC 20 grade) and even BVG (with their 1/2 grades and 4 sub-grades) have the advantage on the super low grade cards.
Lelands Wagner PSA 1
Groucho Marx
GG
Yes he does, although the red lipstick reduces some of Ty's fear factor.
<< <i>Let me preface with - I am a PSA collector - I just wanted opinions on the "corner" wear on this card. The general shape of the corners is not consistent with honest wear IMO - some corners almost appear to be trimmed? Especially the upper right corner? >>
That was my first though when I saw the card as well. Perhaps given the standard card-handling practices in the 1910s (gluing or taping cards into albums was common), corner trimming from that era is still considered "honest" wear?
Edited to add: That is one kick-ass Cobb!
I would rather have this card than the one in lelands. They both have significant corner wear but the PSA 2 doesnt have those horrible creases across his face.
Groucho Marx
<< <i>I dont think it was trimmed, at least in the modern way that we look at trimming, it does look maybe clipped at some time, but it could have been 50 years ago for all we know.
I would rather have this card than the one in lelands. They both have significant corner wear but the PSA 2 doesnt have those horrible creases across his face. >>
Agreed, but of course couldn't afford either. I can see the surface condition of the PSA 1 entering into the price difference.
Maybe I would buy the Cracker Jack instead of the T206 PSA 1.
As for the corners - clipped long ago and worn since then, hopefully. We all hate to think that someone would trim and then purposely create "vintage" wear.
<< <i>The "Gretzky" Wagner
Trimmed, also.
<< <i>
<< <i>The "Gretzky" Wagner
Trimmed, also. >>
Davino
That was the prevailing thought by a lot of people on the floor in 1992 at the National when it was on display if memory serves. I did see the card in person but wasn't thinking about trimmed cards back then. I only heard about it later.
Who knows?
mike
That one sold in 2001 on MastroNet for $86,730
<< <i>Trimmed, also.
>>
Entire chat boards have been shut down on the threats to those that dared say that.
Where is Elliot Spitzer when we need him?
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
PSA says the card is real, Mastro bought it and they thought it was good, every single owner who has actually held the card in the PSA and outside of it says its unaltered.
SGC and GAI would say its real as well if they had the opportunity have this card slabed by them.
At this point its meaningless to say otherwise, the card might as well always been real, nobody that matters will say that this card was trimmed.
A lot of network54 guys simply can not go one day without saying something just hateful against PSA and this card represents the holy grail of slabed cards, they just love to whine about. Except for a few posters that site its just a "bash PSA" forum when it comes to intelligent discussions about the grading industry.
Groucho Marx
sure seem bleached or whitened to me.
My 1934 Goudey Set
<< <i>Ty Cobb, WAS, IS, and ALWAYS, will be "The Greatest"! "Your'e the man, Ty ! >>
WTF?
Your'e the man, Ty ?????
Honus ??????
T206's are always being bought.
aloof1003@comcast.net
That said, I don't understand how anything looking like either the 1 or 2 can be deemed anything other than "authentic". I think when you get into cards with bites taken (trimmed!) from them, all bets are off as far as relative grades. How can you compare? It's literally less of a card. What if the corners were still there and they were stained and full of pin holes and tape marks. Would that make it ungradable? It just doesn't seem to make sense. 1-10 has to be a relative scale, and relative's got to be relative to something...and to me, it's got to start with a complete and full card.