What would you pay for this "buffed"1909-s VDB?

JoesMaName

I've always wanted one of these but the condition of the coin for the price always seemed way out of whack.
Basically I hate to pay real money for an ugly coin.


This one has good detail and eye appeal but it's in a PCI "buffed" AU50 slab.
With list price on an AU50 about $1300 there's a lot of wiggle room on a coin like this.
Of course I know nothing is worth more then what people are willing to pay - so that's why I'm asking for your opinions.
Currently this coin is at 560 and that seems like a reasonable price to me - but I have a feeling it will go higher...

lordmarcovan

It doesn't look that horrible to me. Might make a nice filler, if the price is right, and if it's genuine. (I would trust the "old" PCI for authentication, but I'm not totally sure about the "new" PCI).

I wonder if the scratch over the N in ONE is in the plastic or on the coin.

JoesMaName

<< <i>It doesn't look that horrible to me. Might make a nice filler, if the price is right, and if it's genuine. (I would trust the "old" PCI for authentication, but I'm not totally sure about the "new" PCI).

I wonder if the scratch over the N in ONE is in the plastic or on the coin. >>



Thanks M'lord - How can you tell if it's in an old or new slab?

JoesMaName

This is a picture of the slab.

clw54

I recommend avoiding that one, unless you aren't bothered by the "buffing." If it will bother you even one little bit, it's not worth paying $500 for. Just my opinion, of course.

PTVETTER

It will sell for about $1000.00
Just my guess

zzzz

It does looked cleaned
AU Details XF/40 - XF/45
That scratch does look like it is in the coin
It looks like a fairly new scratch which can happen when the stapples in the holder it was in previously weren't removed but just loosened and the person trying to remove the coin and .. "AW Chucks" ... The coins rubs against the staple .. .
IMHO

Really the coin does look nice .. not $1,000 nice ... maybe $800 nice .. LOL ... without the scratch .. $1,000 nice ...

braddick

I would think if you're in the market for one of these, I'd not spend $1,000. on a buffed one (wth a scratch).
This one's probably a better value.

Here's the Buffed one

Just in case you want it. It does have less than 12 hours on the clock and if it sits under $600.00, might be a value. The Seller also didn't use the proper Key Words in his header, so it might go kind of cheap.
I wonder how ANACS would Net this one?

JoesMaName

$1000 is way out of my range I was thinking 600-650 tops.
But my idea of value seems in line with the replies, maybe a bit on the low side.
So if I get it great, at least I didn't pay way too much.
Though I probably won't win it as it never ceases to amaze me how I'm consistently the person willing to pay the second highest amount for a coin. I'll inevitably high bid 650 and it'll go for 655

Thanks for your replies!

ldhair

>>

Thanks M'lord - How can you tell if it's in an old or new slab? >>


Link to PCI pics

rhedden

I doubt its authenticity. The PCI slab does nothing to convince me that it's real. Cleaning or buffing is a popular way to hide the subtle diagnostics of fake coin, and the 1909-S VDB is one of the most faked of all time.

coppercoins

I might be convinced to pay $5 for it without seeing it in person.

Once I see it in person, and if it's genuine to my liking, I would pay an additional $245 for it and stick to $250.

It's a problem coin that will be hard to get rid of to anyone serious, and likely has been ruined beyond the point of being collectible.

JoesMaName

<< <i>I might be convinced to pay $5 for it without seeing it in person.

Once I see it in person, and if it's genuine to my liking, I would pay an additional $245 for it and stick to $250.

It's a problem coin that will be hard to get rid of to anyone serious, and likely has been ruined beyond the point of being collectible. >>



Hummm.... you wouldn't happen to have a nice looking cleaned AU 1909 s VDB in an ANACS slab you'd be willing to sell me for $250 would ya? Heck I'm feeling crazy - I'll give ya $300!

ziggy29

IF I were convinced of its authenticity, I might hit it for as much as $400. I have a raw XF/AU Lincoln album and I'd not want to crack out a very nice, more original looking XF/AU '09-S VDB. This one I'd have no qualms about cracking out. I might even make it a pocket piece until it's VF and looks at least somewhat like it has normal wear and surfaces.

But first I want someone to convince me that the solder isn't going to fail and the "S" isn't going to fall off!

Hedger

$0.00 What a shame.

JoesMaName

<< <i>...
But first I want someone to convince me that the solder isn't going to fail and the "S" isn't going to fall off! >>



Ya - this is my bigest concern too, I wish it were in an ANACS holder.

ldhair

<< <i>But first I want someone to convince me that the solder isn't going to fail and the "S" isn't going to fall off! >>

JoesMaName

ldhair - thanks for posting the PCI web link, the diagnostic seemed inconclusive as the dash is long like the old style but the type setting is crisp and dark like the new. I know this seller he's a good seller and I've bought much stuff from him in the past but he's lately taken to using PCI, so it probably is a newly graded coin. On a coin like this I think it was a bad move - at least for him.

ziggy29

<< <i>I know this seller he's a good seller and I've bought much stuff from him in the past but he's lately taken to using PCI, so it probably is a newly graded coin. On a coin like this I think it was a bad move - at least for him. >>

Agreed. ANACS would have graded it, too, assuming it's authentic. And on a coin like this, which is obviously damaged goods, it's mostly the authenticity that's in question -- not the grade. Why someone would use today's PCI instead of ANACS for this is, IMO, a mystery if you really think you have a genuine coin.

ldhair

No way this is a newly graded coin.
It's an old PCI slab. IMHO
I would think in this time frame, PCI would have caught a fake.
Being polished makes it a problem for most to tell the difference.

coppercoins

<< <i>Hummm.... you wouldn't happen to have a nice looking cleaned AU 1909 s VDB in an ANACS slab you'd be willing to sell me for $250 would ya? Heck I'm feeling crazy - I'll give ya $300! >>



No, I have this thing against owning completely ruined high-sheen polished coins that are very far overpriced.

mr1931S

This is a coin that needs to be virtually perfect for the grade before one should purchase. CD is right on. This is one serious money variety. Don't get stuck with a problem coin for your money. There are over 50 SVDB's on ebay right now, as we speak. I cannot recommend that you buy this variety raw on faceless ebay, however.

SVDB is not a rare coin and all are way overpriced, in my opinion. But, if you absolutely "gotta have one" and are uncomfortable with spending $1000 or more, then I suggest you settle for a problem free VF or EF and buy only from someone who will allow you to return for money back if, for whatever your reason, you are finding the coin doesn't measure up.

Proceed cautiously if you see and are considering buying what appears to you to be a nice raw one. Raw in these, is a coin that is NOT in an ANACS, PCGS, NGC or ICG holder, in my opinion. Know what to look for to establish genuineness. NO raw SVDB should be purchased without ability to do a detailed examination. Read that to say, extremely detailed examination. Furthermore, the coin needs to come out of its holder to do such an examination.

Food for thought. My understanding is that it is possible for a skilled machinist to easily do work to 1/1000 inch. Average human hair width is about 1/1000 inch. Are you prepared to detect the 1/1000 inch or less width seam on a hollowed out 1909 plain VDB obverse where a cut down 1909 S has been inserted UNDER the rim of the hollowed out plain VDB?

If you buy raw SVDB make certain the seller will work with you AFTER you've spent your money. If you buy already holdered by one of the four services listed above you are definitely buying your SVDB smart. I say this without regard of the fact of how much you had to pay and regardless of condition of the SVDB.

If at least one of the true experts say your SVDB is real, that, my friend, is as good as it gets.

JoesMaName

Thank you all for your input, the coin ended about $100.00 over my intended max bid of $650 - and I really only liked it at the price I found it at ($560) as soon as it exceeded $600 I feel out-a like with it....

Thanks MR1874 for the description of a fake that hollows out the obverse of an Phili 09 VDB and has the cut down face of an 1909-s inserted into the hollow - I had never hear of that method and I bet it's convincing if done right.

And I do agree - damaged goods is painful to look at when you've spent a lot of cash on them....

fivecents

I know a dealer that paid $330.00 for a gold plated 1909-S VDB.

Keyrock

The coin is the coin and the holder is an opinion. If you don't like the coin don't buy it. 1909 S VDBs although key coins are easy to find in inventory. Key coins never go out of style and generally hold decent value over time. Buy the right coin for the right reasons, don't buy inferior items if you don't have to.

Rich

vega1

I think your very lucky you didn't win that coin. As others have said before me here, spending that kind of money on a problem coin is just a very bad idea IMO. Especially for a coin as easy to find as the 1909-s vdb. For the same money a problem free lower grade coin could be had without the "baggage", and would be a much better purchase.