How does a slab get cracked inside a USPS Priority box?

jrdolan

I shipped a card in a USPS Priority box. Those things are pretty sturdy, and within the box was a bubble mailer (with foam around it to keep the mailer from sliding around in the box). The card was within the bubble mailer. Well-protected, I thought. Yet the buyer sent me this email:

Dear Mr Dolan;
I just received my 1965 koufax and my concern is that the case has a crack on the left upper corner I would like to show this to my friends. Can you please get back to me regarding this issue. I will also have an opportunity to be at the next show with Global i.e. Steve Rocchi and see what he thinks. Dan

The buyer didn't mention any damage to the card. I told him about PSA's $5.00 reholder service and even offered to reimburse that fee if he shows me the submission # and his zip code to verify that he did reholder it. He did pay a lot for the card and I want him to be happy, but I know I did NOT send him a cracked case. My scan shows no cracks. The Priority box would have to be crushed for any sort of impact to reach the card. So assuming he's telling the truth, how could this happen?

2323

did you ask him for a scan?

Stone193

JR
Cracked on the left upper corner? The box would have had to take a pretty good precision pin pointed blow...very interesting. He didn't say the card was damaged? As was said, a scan would be nice.
Doesn't UPS cover that? I have received boxes from UPS that have been mutilated but the contents was OK.
Do ya think...buyer regret to extent of self mutilation to get a refund?
Sorry to hear this...good luck and keep us posted.

Merry Christmas
Mike

easttexascardsandgames

Sounds like he is trying to accuse you of switching the cards in the holder, or it may be possible he attempted a similar thing and could not get the case carcked like he though he could. Or he could have suceeded and will submit the card himself and begin a similar WIGWAG scheme

Buyers remorse is another good possibility

MorrellMan

A scan would be helpful. I'm guessing it's a hairline somewhere in the slab composition based upon the fact that he wants to get other opinions. A crack is a crack; sounds like he's not certain this is a crack. Your offer to cover the reholdering cost is more than generous. Let us know how this plays out.

ctsoxfan

I am not certain what he thinks mentioning Rocchi's name is going to do - sounds like he is trying to imply there is something amiss with the slab. Not sure what, but it sounds like you packaged the card perfectly. Also, your offer was appropriate, I don't think you need to do anything else - let us know how it turns out.

A761506

Perhaps the case itself is not broken, but somehow suffered an impact (whether it was in the mail, or someone accidentally dropped it), which would give the appearance of a crack... a cloudy spot along the edge where the impact occured. I've received a couple cases in the mail like that, where they were definitely banged around somewhere along the line, and have a cloudy spot or two along an edge. It is obvious that they have not been tampered. Let's face it, the PSA holders are cheap quality plastic, and that seal is not a very strong one, as anyone who has ever cracked one along the seal can attest to.

I would ask what he thinks is wrong, as far as, what did the cracking cause? Does he think the case has been tampered? Is the container actually split open, or actually cracked, or is it just the perception of a crack due to clouding? And what would he like for you do to about it?

Fuzz

Clearly he seems concerned about whether the card inside is the card that PSA graded.
Maybe offering to pay for a "re-evaluation" where they examine the card and not just the re-holder will help. The safest thing to do is take it back becasue this appears to be spinning in a bad direction and the fallout could cost you a lot more in the end.
The answer to the magic question is ------ extreme temperature. Lord knows parts of the country are having that now. Kelloggs cards have been known to crack being shipped this time of year. Because of the sonic welding the two materials might not be properly matched for expansion/contraction. IF it was shipped in an unpressurized compartment of a plane (and it probably was being mail), it could have been exposed to -80 degrees or lower temps. Plastic could crack during contraction and the corner would be a high stress point. Cold gets in no matter how well you pack it and would show no signs of abuse.
Good Luck,
Fuzz

Stone193

<< <i>I will also have an opportunity to be at the next show with Global i.e. Steve Rocchi and see what he thinks. Dan >>


Fuzz
I think you are on to something. As I had said about "buyer regret" or perhaps, since he paid a good amount, fear that the item has been compromised.
He was concerned about a crack...why does he need to show that to Steve Rocchi...I can see it now:
"Mr Rocchi take a look at this crack..." Mr Rochi: "Yah...that's a crack!" There is a lot to infer from that statement and it's not just about a crack.

Merry Christmas
your friend
Mike

koby

I purchased a card that was damaged in transit in one of the priority boxes. The seller reimbursed me and insurance covered him.

ctsoxfan

I still find it hard to believe that the card could have been damaged in transit, however. If the card was in a bubble mailer, with foam around that, and in a Priority Mail box (very sturdy cardboard), you would think that's enough. But, the extreme cold point mentioned earlier is the only way I believe there could have been shipping damage.

koby

Priority boxes are pretty sturdy. However, on the cassette size priority box there are perforations for opening the box conveniently. The damaged box came to me with the box collapsed at the perforated point. There were a stack of cards and the card closest to the collapsed point was cracked. Card was damaged unfortunately. I think the solution is to reinforce the perforated point with some tape.

jrdolan

This was a VHS-size Priority box, 5.5x8.5 inches, rather than a casettle mailer. There was room inside for a 00-size bubble mailer and some foam for packing. He did not mention the box being crushed. The temperature theory is the only thing I can imagine that might have cracked the case. It only went from VT next door to NY, so it wasn't in transit very long.

The card sold for $100 more than SMR, so buyer's remorse might be a factor. He might have bought the same card elsewhere for less. The card was delivered with signature confirmation, so I don't believe he can force a refund through PayPal. If there is just a tiny crack caused by temperature or his own actions, but the card is safe, he should reholder it and accept my offer.

If he comes out and says he wants his money back, I will ask for a scan. Of course that doesn't prove he didn't whack the case himself just because he regrets the price he paid.

For what it's worth, his feedback is 17 with only 2 since 2002. He's just getting back in the game, it seems.

Stone193

JR
The thing I don't like is the fact that he is going to show it to GAI...for what? Hey Mr. Rocchi...look at my ass...yah, that's a crack! There is an inference in that remark.

Whoa...I'm being very cynical! Merry Christmas!

your friend
Mike

yankeeno7

I would also be weary that he wasnt trying to crack the case himself...and when he wasnt successful on a clean break, he wants to blame it on you. Maybe HE was trying to do a card switch himself. You sent the card in the scan...no crack...shows its PSA ID number, etc....you are pretty gernerous offering anything to him as far as I'm concerned.

Billa

I tend to agree with expert collector Mike:

What prevents the purchaser who has buyer remorse to whack the case and claim damaged goods? This puts you in a predicament to save your good name? Any way this goes, it puts you in a no win position. 1) You take the card back, you have a damaged holder and then take the riisk of having the card switched before you get it; 2) you tell him to get it reviewed or heholdered, you take the same risk. Of course, if it was insured, I'd start now to have the entire value insured, but, of course the buyer will have to come up with the box to show it was damaged.

It's interesting to read all the views on this.

Bill

jrdolan

The statement that he'll get an opinion from "friends" and from Steve Rocchi makes me suspicious. I think he was fishing for a refund offer, without flat-out asking for one. He must have hoped I would offer to give his money back rather than have the card examined by the Great Mr. Rocchi. Despite Steve's history, what does GAI have to do with a PSA holder?

I hope this isn't a case where he took out the Koufax 8 and slipped in a 7 or worse. Is this still a problem in our hobby? I had hoped that went out with a certain unmentionable "W" company.

He still hasn't responded to my reply. I'll post developments, because I think we can learn from these eBay experiences.

Stone193

<< <i>The statement that he'll get an opinion from "friends" and from Steve Rocchi makes me suspicious. I think he was fishing for a refund offer, without flat-out asking for one. He must have hoped I would offer to give his money back rather than have the card examined by the Great Mr. Rocchi. Despite Steve's history, what does GAI have to do with a PSA holder?

I hope this isn't a case where he took out the Koufax 8 and slipped in a 7 or worse. Is this still a problem in our hobby? I had hoped that went out with a certain unmentionable "W" company.

He still hasn't responded to my reply. I'll post developments, because I think we can learn from these eBay experiences. >>


I agree JR
And I don't even sell! Good luck
your friend
Mike

pc

ban him from your future auctions.
you fulfilled delivery and if insured
he can claim a damaged holder.that and
5 bucks gets him a new one.
ps,the fergie's holder is 100% all there.
should any cracks occur it would definitely
be from the cold in VT

Stone193

My own private test:

I took this holder and put on the window sill outside my house - it was below freezing last night and we had some sleet. The cracked area on the right side was always there. So, I'm believing that the crack was caused by something other than delivery.



Now, if you live in 20 below weather...heck even my balls couldn't stand that!

Hope everyone is having as great a day as I am!!
your friend
Mike

jrdolan

Mike, you volunteered Dale to test the temperature theory? What a guy! (You, not Dale)

What kind of flip is that, anyway? Is that a rare collector's item from the birth of PSA?

Stone193

<< <i>What kind of flip is that, anyway? Is that a rare collector's item from the birth of PSA? >>


John
Mike Baker gave this to me as a "sample" when PSA was just a small company and growin'.

Hope you had a good Christmas - I did!

your friend
Mike

wallst32

The card in question is still pictured in the registry. The upper left corner of the case does look a little "cloudy" especially on the left edge; maybe that's what he means by "crack"?

jrdolan

<< <i>The card in question is still pictured in the registry. The upper left corner of the case does look a little "cloudy" especially on the left edge; maybe that's what he means by "crack"? >>


Maybe that's what he means by "crack." Against a black background the "cloudy" area is much more evident than just holding it in your hand. This was the same scan used in the auction. I still swear there was no crack in the case or chipping along the seal, and the card was clearly an 8, not 7 or lower. Get PSA to reholder it and I'll pay for it.

metsfan

Maybe he can't tell if its a crack,or something else. Thats why he is looking to ask someone else. If he provides a scan,you could let him know what it is. I think after making a big purchase,he just wants to know that everything is fine. Thats just my guess. Hope it works out.