Well, Kiss his card values good bye. I never bought his cards except for some years ago for a few bucks on raw 1987 Donruss. No big loss to me. Some people will lose big time. Invest in Boggs and Mattingly and you cannot go wrong.
"So many of our DREAMS at first seem impossible, then they seem improbable, and then, when we SUMMON THE WILL they soon become INEVITABLE "- Christopher Reeve
<< <i>The San Francisco Chronicle reported on its website Thursday night that Bonds told a federal grand jury he used a clear substance and cream that he did not know were steroids. >>
How was the clear substance used? Who rubs a cream on their ass without reading the label to see what is in it? Is this guy that trusting?
Flax seed oil and arthritis cream? My mom takes that stuff and she can barely lift our cat, much less hit 450 foot home runs.
This is most unfair to quality pitchers who happen to allow a lot of home runs - the Brad Radkes, Freddy Garcias and Bartolo Colons of the world. They are the ones who, but for smaller stadiums and larger batters, would have low ERAs and be borderline Hall-of-Fame candidates.
I think this whole thing will cast a dark shadow over MLB, future entrants to the HOF, and any player who has a tremendous season that does not resemble their previous seasons' performances.
I can't imagine Bonds will continue to play after this. This is a crushing blow to his career, and I think people would be making death threats to him once he reached the point of passing Ruth's and Aaron's legitimate records, similar but much worse than what Aaron had to go through when passing Ruth, except for different reasons.
His cards should plummet in value after this. It will be interesting to see what unfolds out of this. I know some people think mandatory drug testing by MLB, but I think this issue can be solved without mandatory drug testing (only random is necessary) by simply making the punishment so steep that it would automatically stop anyone from even thinking about taking anything illegal. I'm talking about 162 game suspensions for a first offense, and a life-time ban for the second... I don't think there are too many players who would risk that. And they need a master chemist, someone like Conte, to test the samples, someone who can detect the newest concoctions that are currently undetectable because they don't know what they're looking for.
<< <i>``No way ... we don't trust the ball team,'' Bonds said. ``We don't trust baseball. ... Believe me, it's a business. I don't trust their doctors or nothing.'' >>
But he does trust a guy that sleeps in his car...
<< <i>Asked by a juror why he didn't buy ``a mansion'' for his trainer, Bonds answered: ``One, I'm black, and I'm keeping my money. And there's not too many rich black people in this world. There's more wealthy Asian people and Caucasian and white. And I ain't giving my money up.'' >>
This is the worst part of the whole thing. Bonds won't even pay the guy who helped him cheat his way to 73 homeruns (and millions of dollars) because he was WHITE??? What a scumbag.
Chris
P.S. Barry - Caucasian and white are the same race, moron.
I bet the guys who have been stocking up on Bonds Rookies and Autos for the past few years are highly upset. I look for Bonds cards to flood ebay tonight. Everyone will try to recoup some of their losses. I hate to think about MaCfarlane and his HR balls lol.
Steroids and all opinions on the matter of cheating, etc. aside...
<< <i>Asked by a juror why he didn't buy ``a mansion'' for his trainer, Bonds answered: ``One, I'm black, and I'm keeping my money. And there's not too many rich black people in this world. There's more wealthy Asian people and Caucasian and white. And I ain't giving my money up.'' >>
Oh, my goodness. How credible is this copy? This is about the dumbest and mean spirited thing I've ever heard an athlete say. I know a great deal about the functionality of many androgenic drugs as relates to enhancing athletic performance, I was unaware they made you a complete imbecile. I'd suspend him just for those remarks...indefinately. A$$hole!
calleocho, The "Babe" was hardly Mr. Clean. He would have been a prime candidate for steroid use had the drugs been available given his track record for cumpulsion and egomaniacal behavior. I understand your sentiment, but the "Babe"?
Downgoesfrazier....you are right, Babe was not exactly Mr. Clean. Lou Gehrig would be a better choice. Bonds's comments are idiotic in all of his statements. It really does make him look like a big time jerk(that most new already).
It will tarnish all of the gaudy numbers these guys have put up. Although there are many other factors that have a bigger impact on the current numbers than the steroids do. In fact, I have a great study I am undertaking now, that REALLY puts things into perspective on this modern era, AND early baseball.
Remember, it isn't just baseball players that are on drugs. I guarantee that plenty of football players are using the undectable stuff as well. Look at the bodies on some of those guys. Many of them are like Hulk Hogan "get plenty of rest, and eat your vitamins you Hulkamaniacs." And don't forget to juice up if you want to look like me.
I guarantee that the 90's Cowboys, the current Patriots and any other team has had many guys on their roster who were using performance enhancers. And in football it helps to an even greater degree than it does in baseball. If records are to be given astericks, then you have to scrutinize EVERY team and EVERY sport and tarnish their records as well.
It would be impossible to asterick, or take away records that are done already. You just have to put them into the proper perspective when talking about them, and ranking their place in history.
It just shows again that baseball is still the true american game, as many fans are really stung by this. Many fans are are stung that the records that were broken are tarnished. Only from the true love of the game can that feeling emerge.
Football's love affair comes strictly with point spreads. People weren't devastated when football had player strikes, like they were in baseball, because people don't truly love football as they do baseball. They aren't devastated when Lyle Alzado was found to be on steroids. Football doesn't have the same connect to history either. Football's alligience comes mainly from point spreads, the violence, and because when you are hung over on Sunday, it is convenient to watch football as you roll out of bed at noon.
Steroids have been around for a very long time. I am in now way defending bonds i cant stand him. Though whos to say for sure that these legends of the past never took anything to help them? How would anyone know back then no way of detecting stuff back then.
well for one they were not huge. Heck most of them never lifted weights or worked out. Look at maris, he was just a great hitter with power, he wasn't a mound of muscles. Mantle was a well built guy but his was from genetics and working in the mines as a kid and smashing rocks with a sledge hammer for years. I don't think Hank Aaron or Willie Mays have to much in common with Bonds and Giambi in terms of physique.
I agrre with what your saying about how they looked. but not all people that take roids are 250 pounds. I worked in gyms most of my life till i was 26 and the number of roid takers was huge. and a lot werent your wwe looking roid boys. Look at ted kluszewski not saying he took them but hes pretty big guy for way back then.
Where's BKAH screaming that we're all jealous of Bonds' 'ability' and these allegations are false?
Hiding away with the thoughts that Bonds is still innocent?
BONDS=CHEATER.
Rick Riley of SI made a funny point today. Asked if Bonds' MVP and HR stats should have asterisks by them, he said 'no, they should put little syringes next to them instead.'
I agree that there were some pretty big guys in those days but I don't think any used anything. I mean they didn't really make enough money risk their health. Plus I think players tend to be bothered and come fowards about it when they cheat. I would say that some of those all time greats would have come foward by now.
I posted these on another thread - just look at this guy and look at the others - it looks mysteriously similar - I am fearful that Bonds, McGwire and Sosa are going to take a big hit - Sosa's and Bonds' numbers are already down - just wondering if these guys saw the light and are weening themselves from the "stuff?"
I am still undecided about Mcgwire. I mean he was a big guy to start with he did get much bigger, but I really think he only used Creatine, which is legal and widely avalable. McGwire had big HR power all through his career. I don't know about Sosa, after the corked bat nothing would be a suprise. I am not sure about these guys, they may have, but for some reason I don't think Mac used, but I would not be suprised if it came out that he did. There is just so much evidence on Bonds, Schefield and Giambi.
Was just listening to Bill O'Reilly, he was goin nutz over this Bonds thing. He says cheaters are idolized in America especially if they get away with it. Just heard that not too much more.
Mcgwire is a fan favorite, I think he retired at the right time but maybe not soon enough. He knew this dark cloud was on its way, and this would all tail back in time to him. he was the biggest thing going size wise back then maybe frank thomas was bigger. Another guy that comes to mind is frank thomas he was a tight end at auburn i believe and he is a monster also. Pujols is huge. The list will go on now if more then 50% come in 20 pounds lighter this year. avg's drop home run leaders are in the low 40's again. then the last 15 years or so have been complete bull sh$t!! then again roids have been around since the 20's i believe.
Comments
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
<< <i>The San Francisco Chronicle reported on its website Thursday night that Bonds told a federal grand jury he used a clear substance and cream that he did not know were steroids. >>
How was the clear substance used? Who rubs a cream on their ass without reading the label to see what is in it? Is this guy that trusting?
And we were all born yesterday Barry.
If the players union does not step up and make testing mandatory this next year for ALL players it will be an embarassment to MLB in my opinion.
Collector of Vintage Golf cards! Let me know what you might have.
The players have to stand up or it will be a huge embarrassment to the game.
This is most unfair to quality pitchers who happen to allow a lot of home runs - the Brad Radkes, Freddy Garcias and Bartolo Colons of the world. They are the ones who, but for smaller stadiums and larger batters, would have low ERAs and be borderline Hall-of-Fame candidates.
POTD = 09/03/2003
I can't imagine Bonds will continue to play after this. This is a crushing blow to his career, and I think people would be making death threats to him once he reached the point of passing Ruth's and Aaron's legitimate records, similar but much worse than what Aaron had to go through when passing Ruth, except for different reasons.
His cards should plummet in value after this. It will be interesting to see what unfolds out of this. I know some people think mandatory drug testing by MLB, but I think this issue can be solved without mandatory drug testing (only random is necessary) by simply making the punishment so steep that it would automatically stop anyone from even thinking about taking anything illegal. I'm talking about 162 game suspensions for a first offense, and a life-time ban for the second... I don't think there are too many players who would risk that. And they need a master chemist, someone like Conte, to test the samples, someone who can detect the newest concoctions that are currently undetectable because they don't know what they're looking for.
<< <i>``No way ... we don't trust the ball team,'' Bonds said. ``We don't trust baseball. ... Believe me, it's a business. I don't trust their doctors or nothing.'' >>
But he does trust a guy that sleeps in his car...
<< <i>Asked by a juror why he didn't buy ``a mansion'' for his trainer, Bonds answered: ``One, I'm black, and I'm keeping my money. And there's not too many rich black people in this world. There's more wealthy Asian people and Caucasian and white. And I ain't giving my money up.'' >>
This is the worst part of the whole thing. Bonds won't even pay the guy who helped him cheat his way to 73 homeruns (and millions of dollars) because he was WHITE??? What a scumbag.
Chris
P.S. Barry - Caucasian and white are the same race, moron.
<< <i>Asked by a juror why he didn't buy ``a mansion'' for his trainer, Bonds answered: ``One, I'm black, and I'm keeping my money. And there's not too many rich black people in this world. There's more wealthy Asian people and Caucasian and white. And I ain't giving my money up.'' >>
Oh, my goodness. How credible is this copy? This is about the dumbest and mean spirited thing I've ever heard an athlete say. I know a great deal about the functionality of many androgenic drugs as relates to enhancing athletic performance, I was unaware they made you a complete imbecile. I'd suspend him just for those remarks...indefinately. A$$hole!
James
Groucho Marx
The "Babe" was hardly Mr. Clean. He would have been a prime candidate for steroid use had the drugs been available given his track record for cumpulsion and egomaniacal behavior. I understand your sentiment, but the "Babe"?
dgf
It will tarnish all of the gaudy numbers these guys have put up. Although there are many other factors that have a bigger impact on the current numbers than the steroids do. In fact, I have a great study I am undertaking now, that REALLY puts things into perspective on this modern era, AND early baseball.
Remember, it isn't just baseball players that are on drugs. I guarantee that plenty of football players are using the undectable stuff as well. Look at the bodies on some of those guys. Many of them are like Hulk Hogan "get plenty of rest, and eat your vitamins you Hulkamaniacs." And don't forget to juice up if you want to look like me.
I guarantee that the 90's Cowboys, the current Patriots and any other team has had many guys on their roster who were using performance enhancers. And in football it helps to an even greater degree than it does in baseball. If records are to be given astericks, then you have to scrutinize EVERY team and EVERY sport and tarnish their records as well.
It would be impossible to asterick, or take away records that are done already. You just have to put them into the proper perspective when talking about them, and ranking their place in history.
It just shows again that baseball is still the true american game, as many fans are really stung by this. Many fans are are stung that the records that were broken are tarnished. Only from the true love of the game can that feeling emerge.
Football's love affair comes strictly with point spreads. People weren't devastated when football had player strikes, like they were in baseball, because people don't truly love football as they do baseball. They aren't devastated when Lyle Alzado was found to be on steroids. Football doesn't have the same connect to history either. Football's alligience comes mainly from point spreads, the violence, and because when you are hung over on Sunday, it is convenient to watch football as you roll out of bed at noon.
<< <i>Asked by a juror why he didn't buy "a mansion'' for his trainer, ....... >>
I find this question just about as disturbing as the answer.
<< <i>This is about the dumbest and mean spirited thing I've ever heard an athlete say. >>
This is vintage Bonds'-speak. Nothing new here in principle. He's as awkward in conversation as the AFLAC duck is walking out of the barbershop.
He studied this critical thinking and prose from the Master - Rickey Henderson
BOTR
Hiding away with the thoughts that Bonds is still innocent?
BONDS=CHEATER.
Rick Riley of SI made a funny point today. Asked if Bonds' MVP and HR stats should have asterisks by them, he said 'no, they should put little syringes next to them instead.'
your friend
Mike
PS: Hi Chris!!!
I stand by my original statement: Bonds is a disgrace to the sport.
4000000 displaced Iraqi refugees * 655000 Iraqi deaths *
4047 dead servicemen * 27104 wounded servicemen *
Billions of dollars wasted ....