1980's Topps humor...
downgoesfrazier
Posts: 1,515 ✭✭
Since completing my '77s, I needed a break and an opportunity to open some inexpensive product for a change. I have spent months breaking case after case of rack, wax, and vending from 86-88 Topps and have had the best time I've ever had collecting. The condition of the sets I'm building are the best of 20-30 examples of uncirculated product of each card. It's a labor of love. Along the way, I have learned odd things that few would know or care about. Among them would be the "finger-prints" on the surfaces (actually in the ink) of many 1987 topps cards. This is the most bizarre "pd" I've ever encountered. The occasional "pubic hair" on a negative always makes me chuckle, but the big 'ol fingerprint is hilarious! Further, the amount of print dots in 1987 is staggering. Just about every card of a guy wearing a dark jersey has orange debris and the cards are a virtual ocean of fish-eyes. If you find one that's clean, the strike is soft or the centering is outside of 55/45 (my minimum standard). 
Due to this printing issue, I have decided to also build an "all PD" set of '87s. Every card must have at least enough PD to warrant a qualifier and then some. The goal is for evry card to make the viewer laugh harder and harder. From the "bullet-wound" fish-eye to the face to the "orange measles", this set will be guaranteed to offend even the most unskilled eye.
The good news is, the cards are plentiful enough and inexpensive enough to just fire off another case to find the good stuff. I've gone into some detail about 86 topps in prior threads. I will post a complete set overview of 1987 and 1988 when the project is "complete". It won't be complete until almost every single card is virtually perfect with booming color and pristine surfaces and stock, but thank goodness topps produced enough of this stuff to sink a battleship...the stuff is plentiful, but not that easy to get just right. If you have some nice product (commons &/or stars) sitting around in 5000-ct boxes that is pack-fresh and you'd like to lighten your storage load, please consider frazier
"One man's trash is another man's treasure".
dgf
Due to this printing issue, I have decided to also build an "all PD" set of '87s. Every card must have at least enough PD to warrant a qualifier and then some. The goal is for evry card to make the viewer laugh harder and harder. From the "bullet-wound" fish-eye to the face to the "orange measles", this set will be guaranteed to offend even the most unskilled eye.
The good news is, the cards are plentiful enough and inexpensive enough to just fire off another case to find the good stuff. I've gone into some detail about 86 topps in prior threads. I will post a complete set overview of 1987 and 1988 when the project is "complete". It won't be complete until almost every single card is virtually perfect with booming color and pristine surfaces and stock, but thank goodness topps produced enough of this stuff to sink a battleship...the stuff is plentiful, but not that easy to get just right. If you have some nice product (commons &/or stars) sitting around in 5000-ct boxes that is pack-fresh and you'd like to lighten your storage load, please consider frazier
"One man's trash is another man's treasure".
dgf
0
Comments
<< <i>"One man's trash is another man's treasure".
dgf >>
Sorry my friend, nearly all of my 86-89 went into the trash a couple of years ago. Wish I knew they would be somebody's treasure....
Thanks so much for the write-up. I've gone through thousands of Schmidt cards from this era - and can understand some of the fun and frustration of going through such product.
I'm very much looking for a 1988 Topps Mike Schmidt card that will PSA 10. If you have an extra of such a card available (either in raw or even potentially in graded form), please let me know. It is one of the relatively few cards that I am still looking to upgrade in my basic set. Of all the Topps Schmidt cards from 1986 - 1989, it is weird that 1988 has proved to be difficult. I just never came across a lot of 2 or 3 thousand of those cards in the last few years. I think the especially wide borders on this issue have hurt me in finding the "perfect" example, but I'm still looking.
Cheers-
MS
It is only by accident that I still had my 5000 counts of this stuff. I actually started buying product this past year (a 6-box here, vending case there, etc) and then I realized that I had kept the 5000 counts for a specific purpose when I moved. I was coaching a junior travel team a few years ago as a summer project and I put together 86 & 87 topps sets for each player (all of the players were born in 86 or 87) and on their birthday, each player got a set. Had it not been for that, to the dumpster they would have gone.
MS,
I have only one strong copy that has a 10 shot. That card is my "set card" for now. The '88 card actually has black pepper print problems. It also is prone to streaking and OC issues (1988 is HORRIBLE for centering). I will come across a very nice copy, I'm sure, as I will be breaking three more rack cases from different sources over the coming couple of months. I will pull a nice copy and get one to you. If there are none I'll let you know that as well.
dgf
This is assuming that every card you submit is a 10, and your grader has no problem with staring at overproduced pieces of crap, for...
792 cards X 30 seconds a card = 23,760 seconds = 396 minutes = 6 hours and 36 minutes with no break.
This set will be my baby one day I think, much as DGF is with the 1977's. If I stick with the graded card thing for any amount of time (Ive been here a year, and it's gotten exponentialy better), I don't care how stupid it is to pursue it. This is MY set that I remember as a kid, and I would love to have Gem copies of al the trash I used to have. Not to mention that 4 sharp and DSL most likely have forts made of these cards that they have secret meetings in.
I will post some images of my set (88's). It's been making a hell of a mess in my basement, but I'm 204 unique Gem Mint cards into it.
It's only taken 21 rack boxes, 27 wax boxes, and a vending case to pull those
Here's a thought: a "bulk same set submission deal". Wherein they simple put a hologrammed sticker on your card-saver or some other "cheaper" holder for the cost of $1.50 per card. This would make the 800 card submission doable and PSA would make a few bucks for their effort. Until then it's RAW baby, RAW!
dgf
Dave
Now collecting:
Topps Heritage
1957 Topps BB Ex+-NM
All Yaz Items 7+
Various Red Sox
Did I leave anything out?
I'm looking for a few cards from those years for an 1984 Tigers (World Champs) Master Set that I'm putting together in 9's and 10's:
1987T #483 Dwight Lowry
1987T # 196 Randy O'Neal
1987T #98 Bill Scherrer
1986T #121 Nelson Simmons
As well as a great copy of an 88 Trammell #320.
If you have any quality doubles, please let me know. I'll buy them in bulk if you have them. I can't seem to find decent copies of the cards...
Thanks,
Jim
I am looking for two Topps cards from those years. I have no intention of grading them, so I don't need PSA 9 or 10 quality, just a nice solid raw copy.
They are:
1986 Topps #481-Scott Bradley
1987 Topps #508-Scott Bankhead
I also need one card from 1987 Topps Traded if you happen to have any of them.
Thanks,
James
You pick the toughies. Anyway, my set cards of Scherrer & Lowry are NM/MT. I may have passes over a razor example when looking for GEMS, however when I rifled through the last case. I only pulled cards that exploded with eye-appeal and were perfect. I'll browse through some stacks and see. I do have a nice O'Neal...It's only mint however--no GEM. Four sharpies with clean surface and centering. It's within PSA's standards for a 10, but not special at all. Just a clean sharp card. I promise the next copy is yours. I just put my Tigers aside. I'm sleeving Angels for another guy as well. That's fun.
87 Randy O"Neal - MINT
I also nailed the '86 Simmons. I started going after it after you mentioned him. I've found only one awesome copy, but I'll be breaking an awful lot of stuff. I will keep all the simmons cards and ship them off to you as well. Wish us luck!
BTW, please put your favorite Tigers in the showcase so we can browse the images!!!
dgf
Can do on your requests. Both in NM/MT or better shape. I'll send you a handful and you can pull the one that has what you're looking for. Email me your address. I'll ship next Friday.
dgf
You're the guy I'm pulling Angels for. The '88 vending was an absolute BUST. I kept three cards TOTAL for my set out of the case. Chris James, Bryn Smith and Darnell Coles. 12000 cards and I pull three. Every card was too far OC or lacked color or had a semi-soft corner.
Vending is funny that way. The color and stock was generally strong, but small flaws on 88 Topps won't be tolerated
dgf
That's the best looking O'Neal that I have seen! That card always seems to have green print marks or a soft focus. I appreciate you looking for me. I'll post some Tigers in the showcase as soon as I wrap up my November submission.
Thanks!
Jim
With the 88's, are you seeing a lot of soft focus and blurred colors? It seems to be a given with this set...
Wally World, Angels (Scarlet, Dk. Blues)
Gene Nelson, A's (Greens & Purples)
Tim Crews, Dodgers (Pinks & Yellows)
Joe Magrane, Cardinals (Reds & Lt. Blues)
Candy Maldonado, Giants (Orange Tones)
These should give you some of the different colors represented. After seeing the actual scans come up, they really lack the flourescent impact that the actual cards have. The Pink on the Crews is actually "neon" in appearance. Too bad my scanner couldn't capture the "wet" look these cards actually have. They scream bright colors and razor-focused images. Any flecks you see on the scan would be scanner dust of debris on the card-saver. The cards are immaculate. I guess I should dig up some other color combos to show you later, ie: Tigers, Padres, Indians & Yankees.
Enjoy collecting!!!
dgf Another try at Joyner...
That Nelson card is a thing of beauty! I really appreciate that you have such high standards, and it shows in these cards. What the heck are you going to do with all of the "junk" cards sitting in your basement? Bonfire?
Cards that are in PSA NM 7 holders that are 75/25 and out of register of ANY PLAYER are completely undesirable to me.
So, I am buying the products I can afford and seeking perfection and loving every minute of it. I also like keeping my cards raw so I can hold them and tilt them to watch the gloss roll and see the way the surface "stands up". Also, there is no "man, this is the best copy I've ever seen--if only it didn't have that whisper of a touch!" I can remove the technical aspect and just enjoy the cards...it's liberating! You can go to eBay and buy an ugly 9 or keep your gorgeous card raw. Now, I don't have many cards in the 80's sets that would fall into the NM/MT range, but it's nice to know that I could if I wanted to and it wouldn't "kill my GPA".
As for the cards that are left over? Who knows? I'll just keep filling want-lists when I get a chance. I also like to trade 800 count boxes with other collectors who have opened product and pulled the best example they could find. I like doing that because the collation is different from box to box and you can see some of the cards you missed out on. I have landed many gem-mint cards that way. I also send many gem-mint examples to people in those trades. Who really needs 6 '82 topps Dave Goltz cards???
dgf
Have you tried your luck with full sets? I purchased a full case of '89 Topps Sets from a local seller for DIRT CHEAP. I went through it and got 19 PSA 10s out of the 30 cards I submitted. I recently picked up a case of 1990 Topps Rack Packs and submitted 20 cards. I'm still waiting for the results. When I went through them, it seemed like the sets had better cards. As you mentioned, it could have just been the cases.
Here are some examples of 1988 PSA 10s if you need comparisons (which came from full sets):
EDITED TO ADD: To answer your question, "Who really needs 6 '82 topps Dave Goltz cards???". I will take 1 '83 Dave Goltz
THAT'S what I'm talking about! 88 Topps are my bread and butter - I'm really warming to your idea of digging through piles of junk. I bought a 6 box rack case of 86 Topps about a year ago, and I still have a box and a half left. Now, I mainly use them to impress my friends when they come over and know knothing about cards.
Me: See these unopened cards? They're almost 20 years old.
Friend: Wow, they must be worth a fortune.
Me: Yeah, I found them in my grandpa's attic when he died. You want to open a pack?
Friend: No way! Yeah let's bust a couple. Wow - I got a Jim Rice! He was good, right?
Me: Yeah, he might make the Hall of Fame. Now watch this (I burn the card in front of him). That's how f###ing rich I am.
Friend: Wow, Jeff, you're the coolest guy ever.
Seriously though, I did get a few awesome cards out of the case - seems like a few of them could meet your standards. I'll scan a few and send you pics - if you want 'em, they're yours in exchange for good karma. I'm pretty sure most of the A's cards have some of the deepest black I've seen on 86 cards - I pulled a couple of incredible Curt Youngs. I also got some great Pete Rose manager cards, one of which I submitted and should get back any day.
By the way - reread your post, and replace "cards" with "gold", and you sound exactly like Goldmember from Austin Powers.
<< <i>I also like keeping my cards raw so I can hold them and tilt them to watch the gloss roll and see the way the surface "stands up". >>
Smoke and a pancake? Cigarette and a waffle? Pipe and a crepe? Bong and a blintz?
There is no pleasing you then.
Creeper, the color on your cards is just incredible. Maybe you have a better scanner than most, but the cards are just amazing. Thanks for sharing.
DGF, can I ask to see some more scans from you? Maybe some side by sides of the same player with your explanation of why you're choosing one Gem over another Gem?
Finally, is it out of line to ask how much you spent busting cases of 1986, 87 and 88 Topps? On average, how many of each card does it take you to find perfection?
I'll try my best to answer your questions.
Here are two random 1987 Topps cards; Hal McRae #573 & Gary Redus #42.
The "Runner-Up" McRae
Current "Set" McRae
The differences can be subtle, of course, and even the scanner can distort things. First, both of these cards would likely grade GEM 10 based on any reputable companies standards. The centering, corners, reverse and surfaces are all there in excess. The subtle difference lies in the red plate on this particular card. The runner up looks focused (until you compare it to the "Set" card) and the color looks accurate and clean. Upon further inspection the breaks in Hal's skin tone are emanating a red hue. When you look at his right eye, you can see where the red plate slipped a touch and the card is now a touch out of register as it has bled into the white of his eye. Just a hint, but it's there if you're looking for it. Further, the red hue clash with the border color creating a more uneven appearance. If you look at the "runner-up" you may be able to see some pink tinted smear of pixels inside the white "KC" on Hal's uniform. The "Set" card has none of this. The "Set" card is absolutely perfectly registered. The card appears brighter and evenly toned and presents more complete.
EXAMPLE #2:
Color-strikes: Strength's vary...
Let me start by saying that the upper right corner of the first card is razor sharp and has caught some reflection in the scan.
Both of these are high-end MINT examples with startling clarity and color. The dugout behind Gary is a virtual nesting ground for the pd's that plague this and other 80's sets. This card exhibits none of this. There are two very small print dots (one is pink along the blue dugout roof, the other is green just in front of the plate above the letter "A" in Gary's name) neither is a distraction for me as the image and stock quality here is exceptional. In fact, I'm not sure you'll be able to see them in the scan. They're are only visible when you scrutinize every square inch of the surface. The cards came out of a middle box in a rack case and was flat as a pancake. The way I like 'em. FRESH!!!
Anyway, the card on the left has a touch tighter registration. This can be seen by staring at the name. The white has an almost imperceptible yellow bleed in it. This can also be noticed when you look for the actual pixels and their separation in the background. You can't see that on a scan, of course. I like the card on the right because it presents more square and has more ink in the strike, but the copy on the left is a touch cleaner. This is where you go with what you value most. I opted to keep both cards as I felt this was a push. Both virtually unimprovable and both have traits I like. I hope this is what you were looking for. I typically go through anywhere from as few as 3 or 4 mint examples of a card to as many as 200 when I select one for the sets. On occasion, the first one I pull does the trick, that's pretty rare though. The fact is it will vary depending on the quality of your product and how discriminating you are.
Who said these cards were ugly!?!?! These 87's are gorgeous when they're fresh and clean. I will post some images of some other 87's that I pulled this weekend in an almost unbelievable run of racks. The borders are milk-chocolate with the most pristine surfaces I've ever seen on these. The centering was dead-on. They came in waves of 4-6 cards and usually were pulled from the portion that houses the "ALL-Star" card common to 80's rack product. I must've yanked 25 unique cards out of the box. That's roughly 8 times my average as I usually pull 3-5 set-worthy contestants from a rack box and these were not contestants--but dead locks! The best experience a collector can have.
I hope you enjoyed the comparisons.
dgf
how do the nolan ryans look?if there are any extras in 88 lmk. i did dig up a couple of 88's in my collection. the schmidt i guess is tough?
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
A Schmidt that didn't make the set
The upper right has a hint of extra stock, but is looking "chewed" in the scan--not the way it really looks.
I'll keep looking. The Ryan's are also somewhat difficult. At this point I would actually call the Ryan a short-print. I've pulled a very small number of Ryans at all in all the cases I've broken.
dgf
Nick
marc
there you are
marc in Hawaii
A sharp, deep 87 or 88 Topps card is a thing of beauty!
Creeper - great scans! Are you doing anything to tweak your pics, or are those cards really that eye-popping good?
<< <i>Smoke and a pancake? Cigarette and a waffle? Pipe and a crepe? Bong and a blintz?
There is no pleasing you then.
>>
What does this mean? I want to understand but, sadly, alas, I am a dufus. Please explain as it sounds witty--it just sailed right over frazier's lowly head.
dgf
dgf
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
dgf
______________________________________
The best presents in life are the ones you give yourself!
I think these kind of postings are what makes this board so special. Sharing real information with fellow collectors is what this all about! Are we a little whacked? Well sure, I thought that was implied! Posts are like TV, if you don't like what you see, turn it off.
Jim
I meant no disrespect to you. My post was primarily directed at that sick puppy DGF. That guy needs help in the worst way. Maybe another child would do. I'm almost thinking about starting a charity in his honor since I am so rich, tough, and good looking. Where are you boy? I'm calling you out!
Sincerely,
The guy that got a piece of the 94 MPH fastball
Frank
______________________________________
The best presents in life are the ones you give yourself!
Isn't this stuff great! Now try returning a phone call!!!
dgf
The aqua and orange really jump!
The dot on Joe's hat is just dust on the card saver...there, it's gone now.
Awesome card...one of my favorites!
This color is just stupid! Good pitcher!
I recently unearthed this one with no tilt! I'll scan that one up...I actually grabbed the wrong card...woops!
let's see some more guys!
dgf
Since when did you start collecting the 1988 Topps 3-D set?! GEEZ!
frank i think some plastic phsychology might be right up your ally mister i have 14 billion psa graded cards with another 47,000 at psa right now
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
I just got back a 68,000 card submission (mostly commons). I have to send 57,349 back for review...I HATE it when that happens. I'll just send them to Joe's attention... also, Frank and I got together on a post-holiday bulk deal with Orlando at 4.50 per card. Value must be under 10.00 raw & submission minimum is 3.6 million cards, so we're gonna have to break another few thousand rack cases of something. Wish us luck!!!
Marc,
I spoke with Frank and he remembers a little of both GAI & PSA and remembers they were real nice. The dealer was set-up next to Bill Goodwin (to HIS right, we believe). I would call Bill and ask who that was. The sad thing is, it's a dealer I've done business with and I just went blank. The shows sometimes mess up my head...it doesn't take much. Glad you dig the 88's. I'm still lookin' for the damn Schmidt!!!
dgf