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How about this nice PSA 3 '52 Mantle?

detroitfan2detroitfan2 Posts: 3,335 ✭✭✭✭
in Trading Cards & Memorabilia Forum
Hi All,

This is my first post. Whatta yall think of this Mantle?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=73435&item=5141689257&rd=1

This answers something that's been bothering me for a while . . . hard top-loaders or semi-rigid holders for vintage cards? I guess I'll stick with the hard top-loaders. If they're good enough for PSA, they're good enough for me.

Seriously, this one really bothers me. Anyway to get ebay to shut this one down?

Comments

  • MorrellManMorrellMan Posts: 3,240 ✭✭✭
    Welcome to the fray - here's the link to the auction.
    Mark (amerbbcards)


    "All evil needs to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭
    A PSA flip digitally added to a toploader? imageimageimage

    OK, I shouldn't laugh. Somebody's going to get ripped off. The weird thing is, since he found a scan of a PSA 3 Mantle, why didn't he just use the whole scan?
  • Stone193Stone193 Posts: 24,407 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Hi detroitfan and welcome!
    First off, I can't make out the certification number (done purposely?)...the back of the card doesn't even look like it is in the holder and in general, I think the whole thing looks like a "photoshop" job.
    I have emailed the seller and asked for a better scan or the certification number. Best I can make out the number is 09649515 or 09849515? Neither number is a match on a cert. # check. But, also, it looks like a toploader and not a PSA holder also.
    I will hold final impression till I get an email from the seller.
    Happy Thanxgiving
    your friend
    Mike

    edit: spelling and to add: this guy has gone from selling buck cards to something worth thousands - so what is it? The big score or hijacked account?
    Mike
  • detroitfan2detroitfan2 Posts: 3,335 ✭✭✭✭
    Well, he does make a point to mention the certification number in the listing. It is 03649515.

    What's unusual for a "scam" auction is that he did not make it private. I emailed yesterday's leading bidder with my "opinion", but I have not heard back, and that person has since been outbid.

    Nice talking to all of you!
  • A761506A761506 Posts: 1,309 ✭✭✭
    I've seen this auction... no photoshop job was necessary... if you have a real 1952 Topps Mantle card, then you have access to a virtual limitless supply of PSA flips, all you have to do is break the card out of the holder and resubmit. When you're playing with PSA 3 quality to begin with, there's not much risk in doing so. Anyways, that's exactly what happened here, the seller has an authentic PSA flip that was removed from a holder, and that card is clearly a fake (no missing pixel in the blue background as that variation must have), and certainly much higher grade than PSA 3, but the seller gives the impression (and BS story) that the card was broken out of the holder for display purposes.

    Two of the higher bidders look like they are accustomed to being scammed and not knowing about it, as they have both recently purchased from private auctions. Anyways, it's a scam.

    Since I started tracking '52 Topps Mantle auctions, there has not been a raw authentic Mantle sold on eBay since May.
  • detroitfan2detroitfan2 Posts: 3,335 ✭✭✭✭
    OK, a few questions:

    (1) Do you think the seller's id was stolen, or is he the crook? Just wondering based on his pretty decent feedback.

    (2) What is the lucky buyer going to receive? Anything at all, or a fake Mantle in a top-loader?

    (3) Is there anyway to contact ebay about this auction to shut it down?

    -detroitfan2

    "You know it's been a long day when they come out after the 5th inning and drag the warning track." -Mike Flanagan, Orioles pitcher
  • detroitfan2detroitfan2 Posts: 3,335 ✭✭✭✭
    Here's a copy of the email reply that I received when I asked about the top-loader:

    "This card is not being passed off as in a holder. Read the description, look at the back scan of the card, obviously not in a graded holder. Read again that I broke all graded cards I own out for my display. I displayed the PSA script that WAS in a graded holder to show that the card had once been graded."

    I guess I can't read very good, because I didn't get that out of the description when I first read it.
    image
  • MorrellManMorrellMan Posts: 3,240 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Since I started tracking '52 Topps Mantle auctions, there has not been a raw authentic Mantle sold on eBay since May. >>



    Probably the single most important observation based on research to be found anywhere regarding Mantles on eBay. Think about what that statement says.image
    Mark (amerbbcards)


    "All evil needs to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭
    He broke his '52T Mantle out of its PSA holder for his display? You know, I just realized the solution to my space problem. It's not the cards that are eating up all the room ... it's the damn holders they're in.
  • damnyankeesdamnyankees Posts: 118
    It's pretty clear that the card is in a toploader with the PSA label sitting on top!!image
  • denwd1denwd1 Posts: 430
    MorrelMan that statement about raw 52 mantles on ebay says it all. not 1 legit!
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Since I started tracking '52 Topps Mantle auctions, there has not been a raw authentic Mantle sold on eBay since May. >>



    Probably the single most important observation based on research to be found anywhere regarding Mantles on eBay. Think about what that statement says.image >>



    It says that anyone who would sell their 52T Mantle raw on eBay instead of getting it graded and selling it for 10x more has something wrong with him. Or ... hey I just thought of this ... maybe it's not graded because it's not gradeable? Or even ... now this is far-fetched, I admit ... just possibly it's not a real 52T Mantle!
  • Stone193Stone193 Posts: 24,407 ✭✭✭✭✭
    John
    Here's one way that a lot of this stuff winds up back raw on ebay or into a "Pro" holder:

    image

    This and a T206 Matthewson is up for sale at B&E - IMO, there is nothing wrong with selling it in this manner - unfortunately it WON'T be resold in kind.
    your friend
    Mike
    Mike
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭
    Yeah Stone, I know. Maybe PSA should put a permanent "Evid. Trim" sticker directly on the card when they send it back ... or cut it in half like a terminated credit card.

    I know, I know. image But kinda fun to think about.
  • Stone193Stone193 Posts: 24,407 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Maybe PSA should put a permanent "Evid. Trim" sticker directly on the card when they send it back ... or cut it in half like a terminated credit card. >>


    image
    Mike
  • detroitfan2detroitfan2 Posts: 3,335 ✭✭✭✭
    Well, either the owner thinks the card was real or this guy is the greediest scam artist ever. Bidding reached over $4200 and didn't meet the reserve. I'm glad of that, means no one got taken. Of course, he's probably contacting the high bidder right now to sell the card outside of ebay, saving himself the fees and the negative feedback.

    image
  • MorrellManMorrellMan Posts: 3,240 ✭✭✭
    Maybe PSA should include a small rubberstamp that says "Not Authentic" in their membership packages.image
    Mark (amerbbcards)


    "All evil needs to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
  • jrdolanjrdolan Posts: 2,549 ✭✭
    The naiveté and gullibility to be found on eBay never fail to amaze me. I wonder what kind of bids I could get if I "borrowed" the flip from Marshall Fogel's '52T Mantle and used it with one of my reprints in a toploader? (Extra lettering added because I know at least a couple Mantle scammers read these posts)

    image
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    the bidders list includes teddysballgame he of the pro holdered selling ilk.
    Good for you.
  • JJmanJJman Posts: 14
    Exactly where do you look for this pixel variance in spotting a fake '52 Topps Mantle?
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