1952 Topps GAI 9 Red Schoendist

skyliner

New to the message boards. I have a simple question. I am currently selling a 1952 Topps Schoendist GAI 9 card in Mastro's current sale. Will I get hurt on the final value because it wasn't graded by PSA. It is a very nice card, sharp corners and well centered. Any help would be appreciated, Bob.

mikeschmidt

<< <i>New to the message boards. I have a simple question. I am currently selling a 1952 Topps Schoendist GAI 9 card in Mastro's current sale. Will I get hurt on the final value because it wasn't graded by PSA. It is a very nice card, sharp corners and well centered. Any help would be appreciated, Bob. >>



Bob-

Short answer is it depends. If the card was formerly in a PSA 9 holder - yes, it will hurt the final value. Also - if the card could successfully cross to a PSA 9 - yes, it will hurt the final value.

It's a beautiful card - but right now most of the money is following vintage, post-war cards in PSA holders. There are sometimes premiums paid for the GAI half-grades, but, largely, there will be a perception by rich PSA collectors that the card has a small chance of crossing over to PSA 9 - and there frankly are not enough dedicated GAI collectors to help it achieve what a PSA 9 would.

~ms

Griffins

I'll agree with Marc, and add that for commons and lesser HOFers (sorry, but Red ain't no Mantle, Mays or Robinson) a lot of the high grade prices are driven by the registry and registry competition, and GAI's still isn't up and running.
On the other hand, Mastro bidding defines the term "irrational exuberance". I suspect you'll be very happy with the end result.
BTW, did you consign it in the GAI holder, or did the auction house have it graded?

skyliner

skyliner

Hi, Thanks for the insight. I guess I should have taken the card out and had PSA grade it before submitting to Mastro. Live and Learn. I guess I can only keep my fingers crossed. Bob

skyliner

Thanks for the response. The card was allready graded by GAI when I received it. Bob

The53Kid

For me, GAI 9's are very scary, especially if they are high dollar cards and your desire is to cross them. The reason? I think GAI's standards are a little easier than PSA's(at least currently). Thus many people are taking nice PSA 8's and getting them bumped to GAI 9's(or GAI 8.5's). Thus trying to reverse the process and get in into a PSA 9 holder isn't likely. Granted, this card could be dynamite, and will be a 9 in any holder. If that's the case, the PSA holder will bring more money.

And why did I mention High dollar cards specifically? It's because, if you have a $2000 card in a GAI9 holder, would you crack it out and submit it to PSA if you had a chance of getting an 8 worth maybe $200? And then, could you get it back into a GAI9 holder again? Once again, depends on your gut feeling about how truly nice the card really is. But that can be a big gamble.

But I'm with Griffins on the Mastro theory...they always get you good money!

Best of luck

psa10fan

This card in question has an interesting history. I was with a friend of mine at the Hollywood Park show when he bought it in a GAI 8 holder. He purchased it with the hope of getting it in a PSA 8 holder to fill the want list of a mutual friend of ours who is putting together a PSA 8 set of 1952 Topps. Incidentally, he paid $400 for it in the GAI 8. We decided, based on our poor luck in getting PSA to cross very few GAI cards, to break it out and submit it to PSA raw.

I was with my friend when he broke it out at the show and when he showed it to a well-known and reputable dealer at the same show who immediately thought it had the look of a PSA 9. This dealer offered to submit it on behalf of my friend, assuring us that he could get a PSA 9.

Several months later, the card had been submitted, raw, to PSA and had come back a PSA 5, a PSA 6, and a PSA 6. We decided to go back to GAI at that point to try to salvage our $400, so we asked the dealer to submit it to GAI. The first time it came back a GAI 6, and, lo and behold, the second time it came back a PSA 9, and it resides in that holder today in the Mastro auction. We know it is the same card, as it is clearly marked, "First Graded," which is what it was labeled when we finally got it back from GAI the last time and sold it on ebay for about $1300 (the total grading fees ran to about $400).

This reveals several things. Skyliner, you definitely made the right decision auctioning it in the GAI 9 holder. Secondly, the inconsistency of grading both between companies and within the same company is illustrated by this case in point.

The main point in question was PSA's claim (we showed them the card in person at the show) that it had a barely perceptible, minute paper crease on the back of the card. So, essentially, if the grader sees this crease (not even definitive on 7 times magnification), then it is a 5 or 6. If you miss the crease, which is very understandable, it is a 9. My friend and I never could see the crease.

mrc32

I hate stories like that

Virtualizard

Bob,

Thanks for the insight into the history of that card! I agree, selling it "as is" in it's current GAI 9 status, is the best way to go. For skyliner's sake, I hope no potential bidders read this thread!

JEB.

Buccaneer

<< <i>
The main point in question was PSA's claim (we showed them the card in person at the show) that it had a barely perceptible, minute paper crease on the back of the card. So, essentially, if the grader sees this crease (not even definitive on 7 times magnification), then it is a 5 or 6. If you miss the crease, which is very understandable, it is a 9. My friend and I never could see the crease. >>



And that is why I won't play the grading game and send cards into PSA for grading. Others have yelled about inconsistencies and while that is a problem, to me it is microscopic judgements that gets slammed while very obvious flaws like centering and print defects don't get knocked down. I have seen 71/29 centered as well as print splotched, grainy PSA 8s. But have a card with superb eye appeal but with a barely (if at all) perceptible, minute paper crease and watch it fall to a 5 or 6. That is BS, imo.

mikeschmidt

This seems very similar to a story that has circulated with the N172 King Kelly that was originally sold by Mastro as a PSA 6 and found its way to a PSA 9 holder. Hmmm

Virtualizard

Makes one think about going through their collection, pulling their high end 8s and 9s of higher valued cards, and playing the game, doesn't it!

JEB.

koby

<< <i>Several months later, the card had been submitted, raw, to PSA and had come back a PSA 5, a PSA 6, and a PSA 6. We decided to go back to GAI at that point to try to salvage our $400, so we asked the dealer to submit it to GAI. The first time it came back a GAI 6, and, lo and behold, the second time it came back a PSA 9, and it resides in that holder today in the Mastro auction. >>




Scary

ajw

Hmmm...I wonder why that story isn't in the Mastro item description?

WinPitcher

hmmmm

"when he bought it"

salvage our 400.00

now in a psa 9 holder...

is it me or does anyone else see all that?

jackstraw

i thought he should have waited untill the auction ended to give us/world the play by play?

onlyme63

I think you should pull the card from auction and use it as a nice christmas present for someone in your family. I'm sure someone else in your family would appreciate such a gift...

Just a thought there, Bob...

psa10fan

I meant to say, it now resides in a GAI 9 holder. I mistyped.
I certainly did not intend to undermine the card in the Mastro auction. I've owned PSA 10s that I bought from sellers who told me the card had originally been a PSA 8 or a 9 and that they resubmitted it and finally got a 10. That never bothered me, but I know it probably would be a problem for some collectors. This card is a GAI 9 and should be valued on the basis of that grade, not on the history of the grading. In retrospect, I should have never revealed this history. I was simply trying to respond to the question of whether it should have been crossed over before being auctioned. I thought it would be of interest to know what might happen if it was crossed.