<< <i>Just wanted to let everyone know that I just got off the phone with RT...He called me after being informed of the thread and was more than gracious about the whole thing.
V.r, John >>
Great. Though somehow I doubt this will put an end to it.
There is a thriving market in "those" coins. Just not at anywhere near R&I's hyperinflated prices!
I agree. I was able to put together a Top 5 Franky Proof Registry set without any coins from R&I and for a LOT less money. Same for a Top 10 Roosey Proof Registry set. The coins are beautiful and legitimately rare...at least the early 50's DCAM's. The good news for all you guys that want everything cheap, I will be selling my Franky Proof set at the Jan. 2007 FUN auction as part of my 100% coin liquidation process.
Not exactly true, Dork. There is a thriving market in "those" coins. Just not at anywhere near R&I's hyperinflated prices!
If you buy proofs from Tomasuk, you will likely be buried forever ! >>
As I pointed out before, a lot of moderns sell at retail levels. There are numerous reasons for this and none of them reflect badly on the coins, the collectors or R&I Coins.
I have tried to sell a coin back to R&I and even offer up a few rare pieces that I made. Buy prices were very low so I passed.
They have bid and won a couple of my Ebay auctions - they tend to bid low unless it is a top pop.
In the end, you have to admire their business model - buy coins very low, and sell very high. More power to them if they can keep it up.
And as GregHansen has pointed out, you can assemble a top cameo set without R&I's help. A quick check of my coins shows less that 1% were purchased from R&I.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
The CU Boards are viciously carniverous but it just saved me a ton of heartache. I always looked at R&I ads thinking to one day buy a top pop cameo from them. Not any more!!
Spare your best friend's life!! Adopt an adult dog at your local "kill" animal shelter. You will be changed.
<< <i>And speaking of online dealer coin auctions, whatever happenned to R&I's auctions? >>
I am a new collector here and would like to know what happened to the R&I auctions; clicking on the link sends me to a non-working web page . >>
Maybe Laura's auctions put R&I out of business.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Wow - $3000 was high in the first place - then an attempt to make a $2350 profit in two weeks time. I watched the auction to see if anyone bit. Nobody did.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
<< <i>And speaking of online dealer coin auctions, whatever happenned to R&I's auctions? >>
I am a new collector here and would like to know what happened to the R&I auctions; clicking on the link sends me to a non-working web page . >>
foxxy, you might want to pm member bubbah about this. He used to post under the ID supercarcoins before he got banned, and seemed to know a lot about the firm. I think bubbah is still here, but haven't seen him post since shortly before you got here.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
The last coin I tried to buy from R&I was a 1954-S Franklin described as "a 66FBL in a 65 holder, these coin needs to be regraded...blah, blah, blah."
When I rec'd. the coin I immediately returned it for refund. It was very average, maybe a bit below average, and I would be willing to bet everything I own that the coin would never get into a pCGS MS66 holder even if it was submitted a thousand times.
Rick Tomaska is simply a liar. The hype he lauds on his inventory is usually unjustified.
Recently I had the opportunity to see a PCGS FBL 1952-S that was described by Brendan (one of Rt's minions) as having "BOLD bell lines". It was pitiful! The bell lines were no where close to being full, and the coin is at PCGS right now as a Designation review.
Once PCGS realizes they blew it, it will become a guarantee resubmission and the unfortunate buyer of the coin will be reimbursed? for PCGS's error.
But wouldn't you think R&I's employees (in-laws ) would know better?
Yes they do know better.
Conclusion: Brendan is as much a liar as RT is!
"Wars are really ugly! They're dirty and they're cold. I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole." Mary
I have found that many dealers embellish when describing coins from their inventory. They make their living from the sales of their stock , if they can not move the coins they can not pay the bills . A dealer that repeatedly over hypes , provides false images , and blatantly lies about their product will have very few repeat customers and will develope a poor reputation .
If you are serious about collecting Franklins, R&I is not an outfit you want to deal with!
There are many collectors that are buried deep by paying R&I's exorbitant prices. Sure a tiny percentage of his customers have profited, but I can assure you, they are a small minority.
I am very, very surprised that the PNG has accepted him as a member. PNG is a fine organization, but in my opinion, adding RT to their ilk lowers the entire organization several notches.
"Wars are really ugly! They're dirty and they're cold. I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole." Mary
If you are serious about collecting Franklins, R&I is not an outfit you want to deal with!
>>
I do not believe this is a fair assessment. While the prices may not be as low as many other places, R&I does often have access to some of the best coins avail- able. At one time they dominated many of these markets so their customers have some very high quality coins. They have a lot of depth in proof Franklins though perhaps a little less in mint state coins.
The real lesson here is to know the coins you are collecting and to know whether you are paying a wholesale or retail based price.
Unless you have unlimited funds for coin purchases, and do not mind overpaying by a generally huge margin, then R&I is someone you would do well to shy away from.
"Wars are really ugly! They're dirty and they're cold. I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole." Mary
CladKing , thank you for your insight ; but I still have this question - If R&I were to sell me a Franklin with a description stating the coin was unbeatable for the date and mintmark , and that I would not find a better example :Would this be true ? I am 81 years old and do not have the luxury of spending decades becomming an expert on the Franklin series . I do not wish to find out in the future that the coin I paid 5X the going rate for is marginaly better then a average example .
Knowing that they will sell their coins with a large mark-up, R&I does acquire some of the best available examples of the highest grades, especially, as cladking points out, modern proofs, particularly Franklins. These type of coins, even before a large mark-up, usually already have a large premium attached. But, if you want a nice coin now, and if you know that you won't be looking back, reconsidering that you paid a bit more than the going rate, and you know that you won't have to be selling (either to get back your investment, or make a profit) in the next, (just to throw out a number) five years or perhaps longer, you may be very happy with your purchase.
"If R&I were to sell me a Franklin with a description stating the coin was unbeatable for the date and mintmark , and that I would not find a better example :Would this be true ?"
I do not know the principles that well except by reputation. I have no reason to doubt their integrity. Very few dealers would intentionally misrepresent what they are selling.
I think they would believe it were true in their experience.
O.K., so I've been working and not keeping up on the threads. - I have to say that I have dealt with R&I on many occasions for both buying and selling. I am not a dealer although I hold a good size collection of moderns. (Please no modern bashing.) I have mostly dealt with Alex but have talked with Rick a number of times. The description of the coins have been spot on. R&I ususally has coins that I can't find anywhere else. I have returned one coin that was sent on approval. Overall, a valuable resource for a collector.
Badger
Collector of Modern Silver Proofs 1950-1964 -- PCGS Registry as Elite Cameo
I sent Rick two nice, high grade, PCGS graded coins last week. Talked to him on the phone this week and got kicked to the curb on both coins. Didn't meet his standards. Take that as you will.
Unfortunately, Lee, that is same story I have heard from many others.
That is exactly what I mean by "no two-way market".
He says in his ads, some crap like, "If you have eyeappealing, high- end Franklins, I want to buy them." But he generally will not buy unless he thinks he can get an upgrade.
"Wars are really ugly! They're dirty and they're cold. I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole." Mary
I have only purchased two items from Rick (a 1950-D PCGS MS65FBL and a 1967 SMS Kennedy Birthmark NGC67UCAM (which crossed to a PCGS 67DCAM)).
Both times, the transactions have been very pleasant, and the price, despite its relative strongness, was commensurate to the outstanding quality and service.
I will purchase from Rick when I need some more moderns in the future.
I have no knowledge about Rick's purchasing behaviors, though.
<< <i>I have only purchased two items from Rick (a 1950-D PCGS MS65FBL and a 1967 SMS Kennedy Birthmark NGC67UCAM (which crossed to a PCGS 67DCAM)).
Both times, the transactions have been very pleasant, and the price, despite its relative strongness, was commensurate to the outstanding quality and service.
I will purchase from Rick when I need some more moderns in the future.
I have no knowledge about Rick's purchasing behaviors, though. >>
1. a major modern coin promoter is showing that the two-way street of buying and selling high-grade moderns is thin.
2. the OP's company goes from customer unfriendly, to shilling for known sleezebags on cable TV like Jimmy Gerstel.
3. just because you write a well known book on the types of coins you sell, doesn't mean you have any more ethical business practices than the next guy (and sometimes less)
Comments
<< <i>Just wanted to let everyone know that I just got off the phone with RT...He called me after being informed of the thread and was more than gracious about the whole thing.
V.r,
John >>
Great. Though somehow I doubt this will put an end to it.
Perhaps, though we can try to get back on topic.
<< <i>R&I is now hosting the ONLY Ebay style auction site strictly made for numismatics!! Please visit us at:
www.ricoins.com/riauctions
Come buy, sell and trade all your numismatic items with us! >>
The link does look interesting and is hard to read. It could become of some importance and
looks like it's off to a good start.
K S
<< <i>ah this thread does bring back memories. the 1st 2 posts were all you need to know about owning "the best" 1950s proof coins
K S >>
Not exactly true, Dork. There is a thriving market in "those" coins. Just not at anywhere near R&I's hyperinflated prices!
If you buy proofs from Tomasuk, you will likely be buried forever !
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
I agree. I was able to put together a Top 5 Franky Proof Registry set without any coins from R&I and for a LOT less money. Same for a Top 10 Roosey Proof Registry set. The coins are beautiful and legitimately rare...at least the early 50's DCAM's. The good news for all you guys that want everything cheap, I will be selling my Franky Proof set at the Jan. 2007 FUN auction as part of my 100% coin liquidation process.
Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum
<< <i>
Not exactly true, Dork. There is a thriving market in "those" coins. Just not at anywhere near R&I's hyperinflated prices!
If you buy proofs from Tomasuk, you will likely be buried forever ! >>
As I pointed out before, a lot of moderns sell at retail levels. There are
numerous reasons for this and none of them reflect badly on the coins,
the collectors or R&I Coins.
K S
They have bid and won a couple of my Ebay auctions - they tend to bid low unless it is a top pop.
In the end, you have to admire their business model - buy coins very low, and sell very high. More power to them if they can keep it up.
And as GregHansen has pointed out, you can assemble a top cameo set without R&I's help. A quick check of my coins shows less that 1% were purchased from R&I.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
<< <i>ah this thread does bring back memories. the 1st 2 posts were all you need to know about owning "the best" 1950s proof coins
K S >>
When dk's right, hes right.
<< <i>And speaking of online dealer coin auctions, whatever happenned to R&I's auctions? >>
I am a new collector here and would like to know what happened to the R&I auctions; clicking on the link sends me to a non-working web page .
<< <i>R&I is now hosting the ONLY Ebay style auction site strictly made for numismatics!! Please visit us at:
www.ricoins.com/riauctions
Come buy, sell and trade all your numismatic items with us! >>
Link does not work. Only auctions you have ARE ebaY style auctions BECAUSE they ARE ebaY auctions.
Could you post a link that will work?
Jonathan
<< <i>
<< <i>And speaking of online dealer coin auctions, whatever happenned to R&I's auctions? >>
I am a new collector here and would like to know what happened to the R&I auctions; clicking on the link sends me to a non-working web page . >>
Maybe Laura's auctions put R&I out of business.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Purchased at the Heritage auction at FUN.
Heritage
Then an attempt to flip on Ebay:
Ebay - Egads
Wow - $3000 was high in the first place - then an attempt to make a $2350 profit in two weeks time. I watched the auction to see if anyone bit. Nobody did.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
<< <i>
<< <i>And speaking of online dealer coin auctions, whatever happenned to R&I's auctions? >>
I am a new collector here and would like to know what happened to the R&I auctions; clicking on the link sends me to a non-working web page . >>
foxxy, you might want to pm member bubbah about this. He used to post under the ID supercarcoins before he got banned, and seemed to know a lot about the firm. I think bubbah is still here, but haven't seen him post since shortly before you got here.
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
When I rec'd. the coin I immediately returned it for refund. It was very average, maybe a bit below average, and I would be willing to bet everything I own that the coin would never get into a pCGS MS66 holder even if it was submitted a thousand times.
Rick Tomaska is simply a liar. The hype he lauds on his inventory is usually unjustified.
Recently I had the opportunity to see a PCGS FBL 1952-S that was described by Brendan (one of Rt's minions) as having "BOLD bell lines". It was pitiful! The bell lines were no where close to being full, and the coin is at PCGS right now as a Designation review.
Once PCGS realizes they blew it, it will become a guarantee resubmission and the unfortunate buyer of the coin will be reimbursed? for PCGS's error.
But wouldn't you think R&I's employees (in-laws
Yes they do know better.
Conclusion: Brendan is as much a liar as RT is!
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
If you are serious about collecting Franklins, R&I is not an outfit you want to deal with!
There are many collectors that are buried deep by paying R&I's exorbitant prices. Sure a tiny percentage of his customers have profited, but I can assure you, they are a small minority.
I am very, very surprised that the PNG has accepted him as a member. PNG is a fine organization, but in my opinion, adding RT to their ilk lowers the entire organization several notches.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
<< <i>
If you are serious about collecting Franklins, R&I is not an outfit you want to deal with!
>>
I do not believe this is a fair assessment. While the prices may not be as low as
many other places, R&I does often have access to some of the best coins avail-
able. At one time they dominated many of these markets so their customers have
some very high quality coins. They have a lot of depth in proof Franklins though
perhaps a little less in mint state coins.
The real lesson here is to know the coins you are collecting and to know whether
you are paying a wholesale or retail based price.
Unless you have unlimited funds for coin purchases, and do not mind overpaying by a generally huge margin, then R&I is someone you would do well to shy away from.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
If R&I were to sell me a Franklin with a description stating the coin was unbeatable for the date and mintmark , and that I would not find a better example :Would this be true ?
I am 81 years old and do not have the luxury of spending decades becomming an expert on the Franklin series . I do not wish to find out in the future that the coin I paid 5X the going rate for is marginaly better then a average example .
I do not know the principles that well except by reputation. I have
no reason to doubt their integrity. Very few dealers would intentionally
misrepresent what they are selling.
I think they would believe it were true in their experience.
with the Rick a number of years ago and built a #1 Kennedy Proof set with
his help. Rick Tomaska is the man that wrote a definative
book on modern proofs. If he says that a coin is the best he
has ever seen,I would tend to believe him. He has probably
looked at more modern proof coins in high grade, then almost
any other dealer in the Nation.
Camelot
Badger
Link to 1950 - 1964 Proof Registry Set
1938 - 1964 Proof Jeffersons w/ Varieties
I will concede that, as Cladking says,
"While the prices may not be as low as
many other places, R&I does often have access to some of the best coins avail-
able."
My main objection to R&I is their sour ethics, outrageous markups, and failure to make a two way market.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
Camelot
That is exactly what I mean by "no two-way market".
He says in his ads, some crap like, "If you have eyeappealing, high- end Franklins, I want to buy them." But he generally will not buy unless he thinks he can get an upgrade.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
<< <i>Negotiate hard on the price. >>
valuable..............and sound advice ; thank you
<< <i>It took me some time to dig up... >>
And yet it fell off the front page so quickly.
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
Both times, the transactions have been very pleasant, and the price, despite its relative strongness, was commensurate to the outstanding quality and service.
I will purchase from Rick when I need some more moderns in the future.
I have no knowledge about Rick's purchasing behaviors, though.
The auction site just faded into oblivion.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
<< <i>I have only purchased two items from Rick (a 1950-D PCGS MS65FBL and a 1967 SMS Kennedy Birthmark NGC67UCAM (which crossed to a PCGS 67DCAM)).
Both times, the transactions have been very pleasant, and the price, despite its relative strongness, was commensurate to the outstanding quality and service.
I will purchase from Rick when I need some more moderns in the future.
I have no knowledge about Rick's purchasing behaviors, though. >>
What exactly is the Kennedy birthmark?
Franklin-Lover's Forum
looks like a few things are happening here:
1. a major modern coin promoter is showing that the two-way street of buying and selling high-grade moderns is thin.
2. the OP's company goes from customer unfriendly, to shilling for known sleezebags on cable TV like Jimmy Gerstel.
3. just because you write a well known book on the types of coins you sell, doesn't mean you have any more ethical business practices than the next guy (and sometimes less)