Do you think My new 1858/7 Flying Eagle Cent Find acquisition is real or not?

earlwbollinger

I know some of you would consider it beneath their notice to look at anything less than an MS65 grade FE, but this is my
little treasure. So do you think it is a real one or not?
In studying the coin and checking my books. no one seems to say much beyond that there is a little die chip mark above the 85 in the date
and of course the broken wing tip on the eagle as well. Anyway it looks to pass all the 1858/7 tests I can come across.
Looks to be a V20 grade coin as well. Mabe VF30 at best.
I put some numbered arrows on the last photo:
1) shows the tiny bit of a seven that is left I couldn't get the coin and lighting angled just right to show it very well though.
2) is a die chip just under the eagle.
3) is a little off but there looks to be a bit of a die chip left there.
4) Seems to have a bit of a die chip there too.
Thanks for looking.

earlwbollinger

ttt

bigtonydallas

Looks like it probably is! Did you cherry it or bought it as the overdate?

UncleJoe

It does not look right to me.

The top of the seven is more distinct, curved and flowing on a geniune 8/7 IMO.

Joe.

JadeRareCoin

It is hard to say without having the coin "in hand", but I based on the images, I would say that it is NOT an 1858/7. Here's why:

1) other varieties have the broken wing tip, so you cannot rely on that diagnostic.
2) I do not see one of the biggest diagnostics: the large chip to the North of the "8" in the date.
3) the reverse must show weakness in the upper right detail.

That being said, there's still a possibility that it could be an 8/7, just not in my opinion (based on the pics). There are some Flying Eagle Cent specialists on the forum, so perhaps they can give their more qualified opinion.

Dennis

seanq

With so many little nicks and dings on the obverse, I can completely understand how one could look like the flag of the 7, especially with the weak wing tip. However, I'm with Jade Coin, this is not an 8/7.

In addition to what he said about the strike on the reverse, it looks like it is the wrong reverse die entirely. The leaf to the right of the T in CENT should be longer and reach up above the bottom serif, but your coin has a short leaf. Compare the reverse to this coin and you can see the difference.


Sean Reynolds

bigtonydallas

You can't always rely on reverse matches as the reverse die could have been changed!!!

lloydmincy

contact eagle eye rare coins - Rick Snow. knows EVERYTHING about the flying eagle cent. In AZ, and has a web site. Look up www.indiancent.com, and see what he says.

earlwbollinger

Well thanks to you all for looking and giving me your comments.
I'll see if Rick Snow isn't busy and see what he thinks.
But then it would only cost me $16 to find what what PCGS thinks anyway.
That would make it official.

It's a tough call, I can use a loupe and see things in the right places, but it hard to tell if it's my imagination and wishfull thinking
getting the better of me. The digital camera sort of makes all the roughness and dings stand way out.
When I look at the reverses of several 1858/7 coins on the internet (for sale mostly) I see both types of reverses too, so I am not sure about the reverses.
I've looked at one coin on the internet a MS65 late die state, and it had even less telltale markings than this one seems to have.
But then mine maybe just has coincidental dings that just happen to make it look just right.
Thanks again

JadeRareCoin

I prefer PCGS for most coins, but I would recommend ANACS for your 1857. The reason being that it is faster and it will not get body bagged (worst case is a NET holder). They will also put the FS number on the slab, if it is the real thing and you pay the extra $. Probably not an 8/7, but I hope that I am wrong for your benefit.

Craton

I would also recommend ANACS for your coin. As Sean mentioned, the reverse of your coin does not show the propper weakness in the upper right quadrant. I have a pretty nice example that shows how much weaker that area is here:
ANACS clipped 58/7 fleagle

goose3

hard to tell but it looks like it could be. Compare it to mine.

link from heritage from when I bought mine.

earlwbollinger

I like the idea of sending it to ANACS to see what happens, I'll have to bundle it up and send it over to them.
If it works out OK, I can always submit it to PCGS later, unless ANACS puts in some NET detractors on it.

I love your coin goose3, the long leaf trailing out over the T in CENT is beautifully shown on your example.

Thanks to all of you for your help.

EagleEye

Looks like a 1858/7 to me.

Thanks for the kind words Lloyd, but I don't know everything - I'm still learning too.

earlwbollinger

Wow, thanks for looking and offering your opinion too.
I was just getting ready to see about contacting you about it.

I think the thing that i had trouble with was about exactly where the little die chip bump would be above the 85.
Everyone would talk about it but no one really showed where it should be at.

The coin has been struck ever so slightly off center, you can see than where the denticles a 6:00 o'clock aren't well formed and almost
looks like it cruded up there in the past.
On the reverse it is a bit weaker in the 3'o'clock are on the rim. In looking at the left leaf, it looks like it has a trace of the leaf leading up to the middle of the T in CENT, but it has worn off the front of the T though.
Very late die stage though, very little left of the 7 or the die chip.

Anyway I'll pack it up and send it off to ANACS to be sure, and cross my fingers for luck.

Thanks for looking, I appreciate it.

Craton

Good Luck Earl! ......... Someone asked so forgive me if I didn't see your reply, did you cherry pick this one?

earlwbollinger

did you cherry pick this one?

Sorta both, I bought it as a 58/7 but the guy tht sold it to me still wasn't quite sure either.
But it seems to pass the tests.
Oh well, off to ANACS to be sure.
Thanks