Ebay Fraud

RJsCards

Has any else out there been ripped off by fake cards. I recently bought a 1951 Bowman Mantle graded PSA 3 on Ebay and received a card that was inserted into a tampered PSA 3 card holder. Of course the guy has been kicked off Ebay, and doesn't answer phone calls or emails. I have filed a claim with both Ebay and the Internet Fraud Complaint Center. Are there any other avenues I can pursue to try to get my money back? Ebay will refund up to $200, I paid with a money order, so no protection with Paypal. Any inputs would be greatly appreciated.

damnyankees

Sorry to hear that.There's a lot of fake Mantles floating around.Good luck getting your money back.It's going to be hard seeing he's been kicked off Ebay and that you payed with a money order.He's probably cashed it and is long gone.

A761506

Every story like this on here simply reinforces the most important aspect of buying cards on eBay... buy from reputable sellers who have established themselves as legitimate. Don't buy an expensive card from a guy who wants you to send him a money order or Western Union as the only acceptable forms of payment, or who won't even offer to do escrow on a $1K+ transaction. Don't buy from someone who has low feedback selling high-dollar cards. Don't buy from a seller who's feedback shows they have sold counterfeit or altered cards, or who has sold cards in 3rd rate holders.

Sorry to hear about your story, hopefully you're not out too much. Better luck in the future.

jrdolan

What A761506 said, plus this: If somebody is selling a Mantle rookie, for example, and they have no history of selling expensive cards ... or any cards at all ... it's very possible the account has been hijacked.

Somebody is silly enough to respond to one of those spoof eBay e-mails and give up their password. The bad guy takes over that account long enough to run a scam auction and have the money sent to him. Then he resets the information in the account to its proper owner and *poof* he and the money are gone. You file a complaint, and of course the real owner of that account has no clue what you're talking about.

RJsCards

That was the first expensive card I have purchased over Ebay and got burned for over $950. Thanks for the tips and trust me, you only have to get burned once to become really conservative. Just frustrated that their is nothing I can do. Has anyone ever looked into hiring a Private Investigator to try to find crooks like this guy (Steelmetalface on Ebay-- "Robert Stewart" (if that is his real name) in San Diego?

A761506

No one is going to hire anyone to track someone down because it'll cost more to do that than it will to just take the loss. Same reason police and/or FBI don't get involved, petty theft to them, which is really what it boils down to. Every crook wanna-be sets up shop on eBay because they wouldn't dare do it in a situation where they had to look the person they were swindling in the eye, and then they try to make a few hundred dollars... they are all pathetic losers. Expensive lesson, but could have been worse, at least it's only money.

jrdolan

Unfortunately for you, in this case the seller did send you something and it was even a real 51 Mantle, just not the grade you thought it was. Even if you'd used PayPal, you would have had no luck getting them to reverse the charge. Why? Because it's just your opinion that the holder was tampered with.

Heck, even if the guy had sent you a bubble envelope full of worthless 2004 commons instead of the Mantle, and did it with delivery confirmation, you would have been screwed. Believe me, I know.

By the way, how do you know the PSA holder was cracked and a lower-grade Mantle was inserted? Just curious, because there aren't many grades lower than 3. Even a creased card can earn be 3. So if the card you got is that much worse than 3, really trashed, do you mean he switched cards after the auction?

If you post a scan of what you received and give a link to the auction, we can compare.

A761506

I think he means it was switched with a counterfeit, not an authentic Mantle.

RJsCards

RJsCards

Yeah, sorry if I wasn't clear, but the card that was inserted into the PSA holder was a fake Manlte. This guy took a lot of time to barely crack open the case, take out the real one and insert a fake. I have sent the card to PSA for confirmation (that is what Ebay required me to do in order to file for the $200 in buyer protection). The same seller was selling a 52 Topps Mantle in PSA 2 condition that was over $2,000 during the same time I bought my Mantle. Of course Ebay won't give me the winning bidder's information to see of they got the shaft as well. You figure Ebay would be more helpful, but I must be too idealistic.

Snowball

Sorry to hear about what happen.

Seller's FB is private. Was it like this before? Since seller is ID verify you can get the correct info on ebay. That will not show if info has been changed.

If you paid by postal MO you can file for fraud through them, too. Also you can check if seller cashed it at post office. Before cashing post office ask for ID like driver's license. I don't know if that will help recover your money.

You'll get $175 (minus $25 processing fee) from ebay after 1-2 months.

NickM

The same guy (under a different user ID - I believe sharkface2003, but I'll have to check to be sure) sold counterfeit cards to Tom Papa (GoSoxBoSox) and others.

Nick

WinPitcher

speaking of 51 mantles what ever happened to the guy that bought one for 50% of book and the seller didnt insure it and so on wl something? hmmmm so many 51 mantles

RJsCards

Does anyone have contact information for Tom Papa (GoSoxBoSox) and others. I'd like to email him to see what happened with his Mantle scam. Thanks

Mrc1932

I posted my reply on the wrong site. Anyway I found this many Robert Stewarts with Google search engine.
Will E-Bay give you his phone number or address?

Robert Stewart - (858) 560-4112 - 4418 Rueda Dr, San Diego, CA 92124 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert Stewart - (858) 576-1695 - , San Diego, CA 92111 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert B Stewart - (619) 286-3630 - 5239 E Falls View Dr, San Diego, CA 92115 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert C Stewart - (619) 563-1111 - 6750 Mission Gorge Rd, San Diego, CA 92120 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert G Stewart - (619) 583-8740 - 6337 Dwane Ave, San Diego, CA 92120 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert G Stewart - (619) 583-9461 - 6337 Dwane Ave, San Diego, CA 92120 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert J Stewart - (858) 279-5633 - 5807 Printwood Way, San Diego, CA 92117 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert W Stewart - (619) 583-7148 - 7001 Glenroy St, San Diego, CA 92120 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Robert W Stewart - (619) 583-9134 - 7001 Glenroy St, San Diego, CA 92120 - Yahoo! Maps - MapQuest

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Bob

RJsCards

RJsCards

Thanks for the info. I have called a couple of these numbers, but no luck. If the guy has half a brain he'd deny it anyway. It is kind of tough for me to say, "Hey are you the jerk who sold me a fake Mantle for $975?" The guys I have called have acted like I was crazy, so I guess I can assume it wasn't them. I really appreciate all the info though, I won't give up on this.

thedpro

Was the seller of the tampered Bowman Mantle "steelmetalface"

Was his name one of the following:

Elmo Dill
Robert Stuart
John Stevens

If so, the same EXACT thing happened to me.

PM me and I will let you know how I am proceeding.

justanoldtimer

WOW you and the Dpro where riped by the same seller !! You 2 need to tag team his As*

lawnmowerman

<< <i>Every story like this on here simply reinforces the most important aspect of buying cards on eBay... buy from reputable sellers who have established themselves as legitimate. Don't buy an expensive card from a guy who wants you to send him a money order or Western Union as the only acceptable forms of payment, or who won't even offer to do escrow on a $1K+ transaction. Don't buy from someone who has low feedback selling high-dollar cards. Don't buy from a seller who's feedback shows they have sold counterfeit or altered cards, or who has sold cards in 3rd rate holders.

Sorry to hear about your story, hopefully you're not out too much. Better luck in the future. >>

I totally agree with everything A761506 says here. But the most important thing for me is too always use a credit card. I dont think many people understand that you are protected by your credit cards. If a seller does not except paypal / credit cards then they are suspect to me right off the bat. Receive a fake, so what dont pay. You can dispute any charge. Its that simple. Every purchase I make is via credit card. Pay your balance off monthly and dont get carried away and you will be just fine.

easttexascardsandgames

If the USPS was involved your best option to get this seller is filing mail fraud charges.

BigRedMachine

lawnmowerman, how does this work. If I'm unfortunate enough to ever get the shaft and I always pay with a credit card, what is next? Do I call Capital One and say "I got a fake, I'm not paying"? "I never receieved, I'm not paying"? Is it that simple? Do they actually help you? I don't pay with a credit card as often as my bank card for fear that my card addiction will break me, but you've got me thinking I should. Thanks for the info.

lawnmowerman

<< <i>lawnmowerman, how does this work. If I'm unfortunate enough to ever get the shaft and I always pay with a credit card, what is next? Do I call Capital One and say "I got a fake, I'm not paying"? "I never receieved, I'm not paying"? Is it that simple? Do they actually help you? I don't pay with a credit card as often as my bank card for fear that my card addiction will break me, but you've got me thinking I should. Thanks for the info. >>

For example, I won an auction and the jerk never sent my card. I sent him plenty of emails and never got a response. So I called my credit card told them the situation. They simply gave me a credit for the transaction in question. They also communicated with paypal to gather info about the whole deal. Call your credit card tell them you would like to put a charge in dispute and give them all the info they need. They put a hold on that transaction untill they gather all the info they need and resolve the issue. Its the only way to fly!

Matt

BigRedMachine

Thanks

yankeeno7

Wow...ANOTHER where someone attempted to switch a card from a PSA holder...must be the aliens came down and crapped another one out!

Stone193

BigRed
The minute you think a deal has gone sour, create a separate email file and save ALL emails to and from the seller in question - different credit card companies may require slightly different information to make the final credit to your account.

As was said - they will do a "provisional" credit back but unless you follow thru with the required info that they need from you - the seller will get the money back again.

I think most sellers, when given a "charge back" will then be forced to deal with the situation in an appropriate manner.

If you went thru paypal with your credit card - you have to inform them first and let them resolve it or if it's over 30 days, let them deny your claim - people who have tried to go around paypal have had hastles with them - when you use paypal, you have agreed to their conditions of sales and they want to have first shot at dealing with these things - this is just my advice from others who have had chargebacks reversed for not going thru paypal first. Or, in one case, a guy had his account frozen for not following their conditions.

So also remember to save ALL emails in a separate file - I had to make copies of all the letters and give it to the credit card company.

My best advice: do not "accuse" the seller of anything - just email that you are dissatisfied with the item and am awaiting instructions for return. If you don't get a response. Try again and again for a few days - then I advise calling paypal.

For anyone in this situation
Good luck and persistence always gets rewarded

vikesfan40

<< <i>Every story like this on here simply reinforces the most important aspect of buying cards on eBay... buy from reputable sellers who have established themselves as legitimate. Don't buy an expensive card from a guy who wants you to send him a money order or Western Union as the only acceptable forms of payment, or who won't even offer to do escrow on a $1K+ transaction. Don't buy from someone who has low feedback selling high-dollar cards. Don't buy from a seller who's feedback shows they have sold counterfeit or altered cards, or who has sold cards in 3rd rate holders.

Sorry to hear about your story, hopefully you're not out too much. Better luck in the future. >>



WIWAG was reputable with a great feedback record.

yankeeno7

Someone said the "W" word! Time for you to go ask forgiveness from the sportscards gods!

nightcrawler729

Nowadays people will sell fakes in old PSA holders....somehow i think we will see this being advertised for real...

ReprintinPSA