Looking for your opinions and experiences, pro and con, regarding collecting/building sets.....
coinguy1
Posts: 13,484 ✭✭✭
I think that for a number of reasons, collecting sets can be a great and highly enjoyable undertaking for many collectors. However, I also feel that sets are NOT for all of us.
In order to try to get the ball rolling here, I will list some of the reasons that I advise certain collectors NOT to pursue sets - please feel free to chime in with your experiences, feelings, arguments and ideas for or against collecting sets...
Reasons NOT to collect sets:
Collecting sets forces collectors to spend money on coins that they don't really care about...
That money could be better spent on coins that collectors do care about...
Collecting sets can cause considerable frustration...
Collecting sets can cause a collector to end up with a large group of coins that look too much alike...
Collecting sets can cause collectors to become overly competitive and/or lose sight of why they started collecting...
Collecting sets can cause collectors to be too narrow in their focus and to miss out on many other enjoyable areas...
Collecting sets can box collectors into a corner and create a monster that grows and grows, until the collector is consumed...
Collecting sets leads to collectors being bored when their sets are completed and this often leads to liquidation (at a loss) and a feeling of loss and/or depression on the part of the collector...
Ok, hit me, not literally, please
with some stimulating discussion? 0
Comments
<< <i>wow! >>
Bill, thanks for your wonderful (though overly concise) contribution to this thread.
njcoincrank
On ther other hand, a collector who is really interested in just about all he/she is collecting, has the patience to pass on the weaker coins and wait for the right one and isn't obsessed with *completing the set* can do well collecting in "sets." I think collecting *only* within a set can be confining, but at the same time, I see nothing particularly bad about having a particular collecting interest while also keeping interest elsewhere, and discovering new areas to explore in numismatics.
So . . .
What else is there to do . . .?
K S
It's true!!!
I've gone through a number of Registry sets, but I'm down to about 3 or 4 now (and one of them are Statehood Quarter Proofs
Registry Points are very expensive for high grades, so it becomes a competition for who can spend the most.
Instead of using Registry Points to grade a set, I think it would be easier to just enter how much you spent for each coin and your score would be the total dollar amount.
I like collecting type coins and to me a date series is just a bunch of duplicates. My coins are a combination of raw, ANACS, NGC and PCGS so most aren't recognized for the PCGS Registry.
But I still like them
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
As a kid I watched my father build things -- and even helped on many occassions. He was not an educated man, but was a jack-of-all-trades. As a lawyer I never get to build anything. I just really help kill trees. Not much satisfaction in watching a file grow thicker with more and more useless paper.
So as a release, set building and coin collecting in general as given me back a sense of accomplishment that I remember when I was helping my Dad.
While I do agree with all of Mark's points, there are some other inherent benefits to finishing a set that cannot be measured.
Michael
I have gone around with you on the issue before. I even abandoned the set idea for some time because I found it to not be interesting. Well, I am back with the sets now for a couple of personal reasons:
1. Without working toward a set, I become too unfocused, attempt to chase every cool coin I see, and have ended up buying more than a couple pieces which months later have me scratching my chin wondering why I purchased them.
2. If you collect a set (or a theme), you can really get comfortable with a small area of the market/hobby in a pretty short time. If you collect everything--well, it takes a lifetime, if not longer, to be good at everything.
3. It is challenging--it is not challenging to look upon the expanse of the coin marketplace and find a coin that you would like to have. But it is challenging to view the same expanse and uncover the couple of Dahlonega $5's in original XF condition (as a personal example) that might be available at any given time.
4. Sets make a great visual impression--if you ask people what they liked best about the ANA, many, including myself, enjoyed some of the exhibits. My two favorites were TDN's Seated Liberty $1 set and a complete (minus the unique 70-S) $3 set. Viewing these made me really want to have a set.
One caveat--I agree with the notion of buying the tough to find coins first. Before I acquired the 1861-D $5, collecting the set seemed pointless. After all, I was "never" going to be able to get the key, so why do the rest? Once I was able to acquire the key, it resparked my interest and sharpened my focus.
Over the years, some collectors began to specialize on certain types and dates of coins for spectulative ventures and gave rise to key date collecting. Type set collecting grew out of wanting diversity without the cost of set collecting.
Now collecting has evolved into all sorts of collecting. As it should. With the advent of the registery. Some choose to get high end sets again. Having someone else tell you that you have the Best set or highest rated set drives some collectors. Filling holes in an album drives others.
If you will notice, most, if not all, of the recent auctions sold recently came from someones sets.
Collecting is all about the pleasures derived from the hunt and accomplishment of ones goals for whatever reasons that happen to float our individual boats. I will end by saying that each collector should find an area of pleasure to collect that makes them happy. There is no right or wrong choices. Only spectulators would disagree and they are not collectors.
Happy Collecting:
<< <i>I agree. I find set building to be very constraining. It forces me to stick within some "bounds" that I don't find interesting. Also forces me to buy coins I otherwise have no interest in. I think it can also get people focused on the set rather than the coins. Just my thoughts. >>
Hi,
well, it depends who chooses the criteria of the "set" I'd say. I suppose filling a Dansco - well I guess completing a large set can be daunting in the long run. My latest little 19th/20th Century Proof Dime Type Set 1880-1950 - well, it all of 4 coins! Some don't or won't even consider it a set at all I guess. BUT, the coins do what exactly I wanted - exemplify the types of Proof finish (Cameo, Brilliant, Satin etc.), the beautiful designs, both earlier "classic" designs and "modern" too, it was "complete-able" within MY criteria without compromise in a few months(!!!!!)....and I didn't go broke. And...relatively low mintage/low pop on some too. It is "complete" - cuz I decided so - and I will move on to a Proof 1c or 5c type set. And, it is a handsome set of dimes if I dare say so myself - see link below. Basically, the make me happy and that is why I collect
Actually, to do this sort of thing but with more recent coins (perhaps 1c, 5c, 10c etc..and not Proof) and not as "expensive" might be a really great way to further ones coin education. I mean, you have to have a reasonable deal of knowledge, or acquire it, to set the criteria so perhaps a small goal like this would be good for an newer/intermediate collector who still needs to cut a few chops. It forces reading. Plus, no one else will have quite the same set!
Best,
Billy
<< <i>One caveat--I agree with the notion of buying the tough to find coins first. Before I acquired the 1861-D $5, collecting the set seemed pointless. After all, I was "never" going to be able to get the key, so why do the rest? Once I was able to acquire the key, it resparked my interest and sharpened my focus. >>
Exactly. I had all but given up on my Indian cent collection for a few years because I never felt I'd complete it. But once I bought the 1877, suddenly this is "doable" and my resolve to finish it returned.
<< <i>I think that for a number of reasons, collecting sets can be a great and highly enjoyable undertaking for many collectors. However, I also feel that sets are NOT for all of us.
In order to try to get the ball rolling here, I will list some of the reasons that I advise certain collectors NOT to pursue sets - please feel free to chime in with your experiences, feelings, arguments and ideas for or against collecting sets...
Reasons NOT to collect sets:
Collecting sets forces collectors to spend money on coins that they don't really care about...
That money could be better spent on coins that collectors do care about...
Collecting sets can cause considerable frustration...
Collecting sets can cause a collector to end up with a large group of coins that look too much alike...
Collecting sets can cause collectors to become overly competitive and/or lose sight of why they started collecting...
Collecting sets can cause collectors to be too narrow in their focus and to miss out on many other enjoyable areas...
Collecting sets can box collectors into a corner and create a monster that grows and grows, until the collector is consumed...
Collecting sets leads to collectors being bored when their sets are completed and this often leads to liquidation (at a loss) and a feeling of loss and/or depression on the part of the collector...
Ok, hit me, not literally, please
OK, here we go. Let me hit you.
Reasons I collect sets:
1. Spend money on coins I care about.
2. Collecting sets can cause considerable enjoyment.
3. I end up with coins that look different (dates).
4. I do not compete with anyone, so there is no fear of losing sight of why I collect in the first place.
5. I can still enjoy other areas, without collecting them.
6. If you feel boxed in, time to get out.
7. I have never been bored when completing previous sets. I never expected to make money when I
started collecting. The enjoyment I derive when building sets more than makes up for the loss when the
time comes to liquidate. So, no depression here. But if I happen to make a profit at liquidation, then great, it 's a bonus.
Am I making any sense, Mark?
way to collect or the best way to collect but for many there is little reason to collect if we aren't putting
a set together. Whether the set is a year set, date/ mintmark set, or type set isn't so important as
that its end points are known. Certainly these end points can be redefined as the set is being built
and some sets may have no such definitive ending (states quarters, CA good-fors, etc), but it is still
completion which drives most collectors.
The closest I've come to not working on a set was years ago when I first got interested in tokens and
medals. Many of these were of unknown use and origin to me at the time so the collection was ordered
from one thing to something very similar to something similar to it. While I searched for items (still do)
to pull together disparate parts of the collection, there was still a sort of "type set" quality to it. Curiously
these collections still maintain this old organization but includes far more "sets" than it once did.
If someone can find any framework in which to collect other than sets then it can certainly make a fasci-
nating collection, but such frameworks will be difficult for others to appreciate in most cases.
It's not that I disagree with the premise of the thread so much as I see no alternative for most collectors.
The first thing which comes to mind is what the word "set" means. I am sure if polled forum members would have many different definitions of a "set". From when I was a kid filling Whitman albums from pocket change, I understood that a "set" meant a specimen of each date and mintmark of a particular series (i.e. Franklin halves). The coins in this type of set could be placed into a Whitman or other commercially produced holder.
Today I do not think of a "set" in the same myopic fashion. Since I have returned to the hobby I have read as much as I can get my hands on and have looked at various areas of the hobby. While I still have my Whitman folders from when I was a kid and while I still fill in holes from pocket change, I have developed an interest in a wide variety of areas including:
a. 1950-1970 Cameo proofs and SMS coins;
b. toned coins;
c. type coins [just started a U.S. Type Set in a Dansco Album];
d. clad coins;
e. 1947-1958 mint sets;
f. older commemoratives; and
g. grayside and darkside coins.
With the above in mind, am I a set collector? In one repsect yes, since I consider the coins in a particular area of interest [i.e. my 1950-1970 collection of cameos] to be a set [semantically the word "set" allows me to label certain coins which have a logical connection to each other]. In other respects no, since I collect a wide variety of coins with no particular plan other than to obtain examples that I enjoy looking at and enjoy learning about [the downside to this approach is large numbers of coins].
The above ruminations on Mark's thread should have a point. I guess my point is that hobbyists should decide why they have taken up the hobby and determine their goals in the hobby. Once this is done, they should pursue the hobby in a manner whereby they can acheive their goals and have fun while doing so [for collectors, it is a hobby after all and it should not be like work].
If I was just collecting cool coins without working toward a set, I might miss out on all the aggravation Mark mentioned, but I'd also miss out on the thing I enjoy the most!
There was a new dealer at our local show this weekend, I sat down and he asked me what I was interested in, my reply was something eye appealing.
<< <i>One caveat--I agree with the notion of buying the tough to find coins first. Before I acquired the 1861-D $5, collecting the set seemed pointless. After all, I was "never" going to be able to get the key, so why do the rest? Once I was able to acquire the key, it resparked my interest and sharpened my focus. >>
I typed out a nice response, favoring set collecting, and the %&$@# server timed out on me. Hitting the back button brought up a reply screen,m but my text was gone
Instead of trying to recreate it, as others have already made similar comments, I'll respond to RYK's comnment above:
Buying the keys first works in sets where the keys aren't rare - only pricey. Examples - 1877 IHCs, 1909SVDBs, 1916D dimes, etc. These coins come up in multiples just about every major auction. Try finding the keys first in any of the Seated or Bust series. It's not possible, as some only show up once every few years. In those cases, build your series as you can, and buy the keys when the opportunity presents.
The Ludlow Brilliant Collection (1938-64)
what about...
the sense of accomplishment/pride when completing a set
the thrill of the hunt to fill holes in the set
the knowledge gained by collecting an entire series as opposed to just a few dates
the competition (some enjoy)
I collect U.S. mainly as a Major Type Set, and the Large Cents and Half Cents - all Dansco Album models (so far). And I'm already tiring of the Large Cents.
Spreading out to some "darkside" coins has re-energized my collecting fever again and I have just started a Canadian Type Set, again, Dansco albums. I envision beginning a UK type set in the future as well. But I doubt I will ever attempt any "series" or "set" where they all look alike except for date and/or mintmark differences.
My OmniCoin Collection
My BankNoteBank Collection
Tom, formerly in Albuquerque, NM.
My goal is to buy what I like because collecting itself becomes an education. I have had the opportunity to buy certain coins and have regretted it later, but I am thankful for what I bought when I bought it.
There is more to coins than one series, one denomination and one country. Expand your horizons because there is so much to appreciate...
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Its interesting, its virtually limitless, its fun, and its relatively affordable.
While I'm working on a type album, I've also found it fun just to collect what catches my eye--be it another example of a design, or something completely different. If it caught my eye, there's a reason that it did.
I also think sets can be more than either type or date funs. For example, you can have an era set--say, an example of all the coins from the Civil War... or from some other important time in history. Also, as someone who likes color, one set I'm working on is a toning set--yes, the morgans are designed the same way, but with different methods of attaining color, they're all unique.
Jeremy
The bad part is it forces you to buy the common dates as well as the rare ones. Of course you can buy the common ones in super high grade which makes them "condition rarities". Also, many sets are near impossible because of one coin.
1. Collecting sets provide a RANGE of values on coins if you're going for a target minimum grade. Collectors tend to want expencive coins in holders. Other coins dates around that just arnt worth slabbing. So you have to pick between:
a) Having some slabbed and some raw.
b) Buying the few expencive ones and cracking them out to put in an album (uniformity in presentation.)
c) Buying all slabs. This costs more and makes it more difficult to have a consistant grade set.
2. If you're building a single set at the top of your financial ability, you have to stay focused. You get the wants to start other sets, but if you keep starting sets, you'll never finish them.
3. It limits your numistmatic education in other series.
Pros:
1. If you focus on one series, you become very proficient and knowledgeble about your area of specialization.
2. "Collector's high" when you finish the set.
3. The set makes for a great presentation once it gets close to completion (or completed.)
4. You develope friendships with other guys that are building similar sets.
David
42/92
First POTD 9/19/05!!
I have always been a set organizer. I bought baseball cards as a kid and arranged them by player and team, but never knew whether I had a "complete" set until I was old enough to realize what those numbers meant that were inside the baseballs on the reverse of the card. From that time on I spent just as much time with the reverse side of the card as I did with the obverse. This brought "order" to the collection and made me comfortable with what I had - something so simple could take a mess and turn it into a collection.
When I collected cents, at first it was a date and mint mark affair. After a while I found that many of my cents had mintmarks in different positions. I was about ten at the time, so my understanding of the microscopic side of the coin hadn't really started. I was organizing my coins by date, minrmark, then by the position of the mintmark, but I had little way of telling exactly what I would need for a complete set - so I developed a plan. I collected the mintmarked coins by position - just to have fun. There were nine positions - high and to the left was a '1', while low and to the right was a '9'. At ten years old, I was collecting memorials and wheats annotating the mintmark with a number for position. A 1956D cent with a high centered mintmark was a 1956D2 cent.
In 1984 I discovered Wexler's book on the Lincoln cent doubled die and was absolutely taken aback at the detail to which some people would go to collect one series of coin - I had found my specialty. I loved arranging the miniscule into more miniscule. I enjoyed exhibits at the fair where insects were arranged by sub-species. I liked reading about the shades of shades in colors I could not see. I guess you could call me wierd. Anything that had order and brought out faint differences and embelished them with "different" listing categories fascinated me.
That's what led me to work in cent die varieties, and what keeps me there today. Assembling a "set" of over 2,500 different coins with the same essential design, and pointing out the differences between them is a science made for me. After years of trying to tackle collecting with half published die variety systems I decided to use my own and publish a site with that system...thus was born coppercoins into the world.
With all that having been said, I fully understand people buying for the love of the look of the coin, not caring whether they have an entire set. More power to them - but if I were to try doing that I would have a difficult time trying to make order of my own collection. So I stick with the set collector's mentality on sterrhoids.
The Lincoln cent store:
http://www.lincolncent.com
My numismatic art work:
http://www.cdaughtrey.com
USAF veteran, 1986-1996 :: support our troops - the American way.
which is somewhat open-ended since there will be more dates and more discoveries of pre-
viously unknown varieties. We all know that someday a collector will be able to go to Copper
coins and find all the different Lincolns ever made, but even when this does happen it will be
known only after the fact.
Perhaps to some extent this is a major factor in all collections; to discover something previously
unknown. To blaze trails even over well plowed land.
i do not like same dated sets of course there are some exceptions like older 19 century coins and some dates i like so they are a set to me or even a neat setof the same date proof coins without the gold 1860 to 1916 even one dated set say 1881 or 1910 would be ultra cool and completeable for most
but i like type sets of different coins and also i like my own version of sets
like a set of indian cents thaT are proof coins in various shades of brown and red brown and some with colors some not
some with cameo some not
or a set of late date walkers but the obly coin you got is the walker 41 s but monster toned
this date would be your type coin for your type set
i make up my own sets of coins..........
makes sence to me and i got a more fully diverisfyed set to boot
michael
<< <i>
Pros:
1. If you focus on one series, you become very proficient and knowledgeble about your area of specialization.
2. "Collector's high" when you finish the set.
3. The set makes for a great presentation once it gets close to completion (or completed.)
4. You develope friendships with other guys that are building similar sets.
>>
Thank you, LincolnCentMan, for pretty much nailing my thoughts on the topic. I am trying to build a complete set of clipped Lincoln Cents, and at the stage I'm at now I get a "collector's high" just crossing a coin off my want list. I've also met several terrific people and collectors with similar pursuits - it's still a competition but a very friendly one.
One thing about my collection is that, there is still stuff I like and buy isn't geared toward building a set. But it is all centered around one general theme - I love incomplete planchets. In the past year besides the Lincolns I've bought the following with clips: modern clads, bicentennial quarters, Morgan dollars, large cents, half cents, a Standing Liberty Quarter, Civil War tokens, foreign minor coinage, transit tokens, gaming tokens, and blank planchets.
All that said, there's no thrill quite like crossing a coin off my want list and filling in a blank spot in an album. So I guess while I can understand and appreciate the appeal of both, personally I prefer the set-building approach.
Sean Reynolds
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
No prob... just giving my view. I really struggle b/w all slabbed and all raw. I really prefer raw, but the investment side of it keeps me from cracking the higher dollar coins to put into an album.
I've got two circ SVDB's right now that ar in PCGS holders. Either would go great in a dansco that is complet except for the errors and SVDB. I've had the SVDB's for about a month now and havent put either in the album. I think, "Well, if I need to sell the SVDB for some quick money, it's so much more marketable in a PCGS holder." So I have the SVDB's in the slabs, and the rest of the set is raw.
David
If I collected 1 coin of 200 varities, my collection would be lost in the crowd.
If I collect 100 of 2 varieties, my little collection becomes even more special to me.
I'm sure Dr. Phil could have a field day with this.
Bottom line, collect what makes you happy, but remember the mortgage will come due again next month.
Joe
1) I like learning as much as possible about what I collect. This includes doing research if necessary and sharing knowledge with like minded collectors. I'm a detail guy (just ask TDN). I like the concept of discovery and yes, there are still discoveries to be made. I like becoming an expert in a narrow field.
2) The sense of accomplishment of achieving a goal that is hard to accomplish in some of the sets. Even more difficult when constrained on a budget. Making tradeoffs on which coin to acquire (isn't making trade-offs what life is all about?) is challenging.
One last comment, this runs sort of contrary to the date (mintmark agnostic) sets that DH proposed this morning where a set (this is just an opinion) is diluted to some level (but many more would collect...that's a good thing).
keoj
What about the immense feeling of satisfaction that comes after you finally acquire the last coin that you were missing?? Doesn't that offset all the agony and frustration experienced during the hunt?? There's also the thrill of the chase to be considered. If you're doing a registry, and you know there are others in your area that are doing registries in the same series who visit the same shops that you do, getting there first when a new addition arrives can be exhilirating because you know you just beat out a rival for that coin. Doing sets is frustrating sometimes, but it also a lot of fun.
I find that I really, really enjoy a certain series and I love finding the coins with every type of toning nuance and shade of grading. I like to hunt out coins with light, medium and darker original toning and building a set for me is really the only truly engaging endeavor.
I now have a complete Barber half set in VF/XF and I find myself wanting to focus the set even more, like honing the collection to a pure XF set, or a meticously graded VF30 one no exceptions. Then again I realize that just completing the set I do have took tremendous effort and time and...."what the hell am I thinking"? LOL
Set building seems very rewarding for the right series in more affordable grades, for other series with impossible dates it could be an effort in futility.
Tyler
the only coin i collect on purpose is the morgan. she's for the most part inexpensive and i don't HAVE to have the keys. i'd like to put a wlh set together and then see if i can put a gobrecht set together. i'd be satisfied with a coin or 2 from each denomination. to me. there is something special about the morgans, wlh, and gobrecht's seated liberties. they're so beautiful and perfect and it seems like they can take a lot of wear w/i losing anything.
but then i like to buy pretty coins just to have them....
*sigh*
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.