Regarding the alledged "NCS" look of NGC holdered coins.............

keets

Sorry for the SNAFU, MadMan, I hit the enter key!!!! Now, to the topic................

I'm not one who has noticed the "NCS look" referred to in various threads, but I don't doubt the validity of those who have mentioned it and their opinions. What I'm curious about is what effect/affect it will have on the overall impression of NGC holdered coins by the hobby as a whole as the "look" phenomenon becomes more prevelant, especially in certain areas of the hobby like Gold, which seems easy to discern?? Will it hurt the across the board value of NGC coins, will it cause collectors to be overly cautious and lower price vs. other holdered coins??

Thanks.

Al H.

MadMarty

darktone

I don't think most collectors know the difference between NCS'ed coins or original coins and most prefer bright and shiney coins. Too many people think original coins have this look. The copper coins look hideous and I am surprised to see people think they are original red. mike

nwcs

Ditto

MadMarty

I will say, NCS does a great job removing haze from proof coins. I know a few other board members who send proofs to NCS to be de-hazed!

DHeath

I have some experience with NCS and modern proofs. I'm of the opinion if the coin is going to be dipped at home, it makes much more sense to send it to NCS and let them conserve it. The coins I submitted for conservation were NOT going to become more attractive with age. Do any of the posters have any evidence of an NCS'd coin turning in the holder? I've seen TONS of amateur dips ruining in the holder. I'd say preserving the coins that don't need to be conserved will require us as submitters to use SOME discretion in choosing what to submit. I've submitted only 1 coin for conservation that was pre-1960, and that was a badly spotted 1924 Peace dollar that someone else had dipped. It won't take long for the collector market to begin rewarding original coins. Perhaps NCS will be used more appropriately (IMO) as a useful tool when that sentiment becomes widespread.

shylock

They could wind up in PCGS slabs too

While NCS seems to reject copper as candidates, they do a great job on copper-nickel. But it does have a "look" to it and I find myself looking closely at images of all newly slabbed NGC and PCGS IH CN's as they show up in auctions. NCS'ed CNs usually have a whitewashed look, and often you can still see the shadow of stains/spots that were removed. The sad part is this makes a buyer who'd prefer complete originality suspicious of all CN's.

RKKay

I have experienced a blue to purple hue and glossy look on some NCSd copper, while some other copper ends up okay. The look is fairly attractive, but after seeing it several times, it's a downer and easy to tell.

MICHAELDIXON

I have used them several times with great results. There are several coins I wish I would have sent to them before slabbing!! Not all coins should be conserved and you should carefully consider each coin before sending them to be conserved. Not all coins sent to NCS will be conserved, some will be sent back with a note saying they don't feel they can help the coin. I have sent several pieces of copper for different board members and they have never curated a piece of copper I sent in. Looking at Teletrade, you can normally tell which early silver proofs have been conserved. They seem to have an unnatural look.

keets

hey Paul

you raise a point that i hadn't considered in my original post, that being NCS'd coins with the "look" that are then holdered by other companies besides NGC. myself, i haven't gotten to a point where i look at a coin and consider whether i think it was conserved or not, i tend to view a coin basically from a perspective of whether i like it or not. one thing i don't like is the look of a coin that has begun to re-tone from an improper rinse. another is the look of copper coins that seem a bit too vibrant and coins that just seem too bright and missing that pearlized type of luster for their age. reading the opinions and experiences of others here has made me wonder if it may be time to look a bit closer.

any opinions as to where the market may head with regard to identifiably conserved coins?? will sellers/dealers be stuck with really obvious ones or in the least be forced to discount them?? one observation that's undeniable for me is the ratio of NGC coins at shows. it is much greater today than it was a year ago and i assume that increase contains NCS'd coins.

al h.

majorbigtime

<< <i> I'm of the opinion if the coin is going to be dipped at home, it makes much more sense to send it to NCS and let them conserve it. . >>





What makes you think NCSs won't simply dip it???

gemini12398

Does anyone know if they remove the cellophane haze on earlier proofs (like from the 30's and 40's)? What have been your experiences, guys?

David

roadrunner

don't think most collectors know the difference between NCS'ed coins or original

The difference in NCS vs other mint state type coins (and most proofs) is pretty substantial. Eventually there will be a backlash against the "burnt" looking white coins. The multi-dipped coins are especially grotesque looking.

roadrunner

darktone

<< <i>any opinions as to where the market may head with regard to identifiably conserved coins?? will sellers/dealers be stuck with really obvious ones or in the least be forced to discount them?? >>

I think the general public prefers the bright and shiney look and does not have the knowledge to tell the difference- if they all get "coin smart" I could see the prices falling on stuff like this but that will never happen until people realize curating is the same as cleaning/dipping. mike

DHeath

What makes you think NCSs won't simply dip it???

You missed my point. Based on what I've seen, they do a good job of neutralizing whatever they use. I've never seen any of their work turn in the holder. I've seen plenty of dealer/collector work turn in the holder. Have you seen otherwise?

UncleWiggly

As pointed out, NCSed coins have made it into different grading co's slabs. Because of the ease for ANA members to send coins to NCS---NGC---HOLDER , I would think there are more NCSed coins in NGC holders. So, if that's true, NGC will end up with a label of holdering NCSed coins. As for the other grading services it will be....oh, there's some in their holders too. I'm asking this seriously. Should we start asking if a NGC coin has been NCSed? Or any coin in a holder? I wouldn't be able to tell if it was or not if I was looking at something Blast White or probably anything else shinning.


Jerry

sliderider

It wouldn't surprise me if PCGS was preparing for this by teaching their graders to recognize NCS coins and instructing them to BB them. I don't think HRH wants to deal with the hassle of guaranteeing grades on unoriginal coins when unhappy buyers of those coins return them for replacement.

DHeath

Jerry,

All holders, PCGS included. I've holdered several modern proof Lincolns at PCGS that were NCS'd. They were all designated RD Dcam.

keets

who has a date when NCS came online conserving coins?? it might be worthwhile to note the prior slab generations of all company holders-----Thanks again, Mike!!!!-----in order to know with certainty what couldn't have been conserved by NCS.

my guess is around April of 2001.

al h.

MICHAELDIXON

Hey everybody I am making a book about the best toned coins that have ever surfaced. Cost of the book is $150 each. Please send me money now. If you send me money you are a sucker.

.
February 2001

dorkkarl

considering the prevalence of coin dr's, why doesn't ncs hire a couple to tone down some of these gleem-white coins?

K S

robertpr

I'm not one who has noticed the "NCS look" referred to in various threads, but I don't doubt the validity of those who have mentioned it and their opinions. What I'm curious about is what effect/affect it will have on the overall impression of NGC holdered coins by the hobby as a whole as the "look" phenomenon becomes more prevelant, especially in certain areas of the hobby like Gold, which seems easy to discern?? Will it hurt the across the board value of NGC coins, will it cause collectors to be overly cautious and lower price vs. other holdered coins??

I'd say that the coin which have the "look" will be discounted in the market just as bad at-home dip jobs are discounted. The coins that have come out nicely will not be.