Sumnom-WAKE UP!

laurentyvan

Sumnom-I saw you falling asleep in another thread. Please chew on this to stay awake. I thought you might want to give us the benefit of your knowledge.

sumnom

Huh? What? Hmmmmm?

laurentyvan

Snap to it boy! This is your field of expertise. OK- it's a 100 mon and...

sumnom

Er..... it's from the Tenpo era?

sumnom

Ummm, Jacobs and Vermicelli say it dates from 1835.

sumnom

Krause says 1835-1870.



And, "varieties exist."

sumnom

Ding Fubao says 1835.

laurentyvan

Ah, good, you're coherent again. And the grade?

satootoko

Well, Sumnom didn't seem to be anxious to talk about these when I started typing, so I though I'd throw some stuff out there for him to pick apart.

Then he started posting!

Anyhow, according to Jacobs there were 484,804,054 of these 100 mon coins cast in the Tempo Tsuho era (commencing in 1835), mostly in copper but in "many other metals", including iron and brass. The JNDA uses the alternate English spelling of Tenpo Tsuho (same Japanese characters) and identifies 24 different types. Krause uses Jacobs' spelling, and only identifies "smaller hole" and "larger hole" varieties. The authorities are generally in accord that they continued to circulate to the end of the 19th Century, despite the official changeover to milled coinage in 1870. Jacobs is the only authority I have found in English which gives a mintage figure, and I don't really give much credence to his precise number, especially since they were cast by multiple sources, including some intended solely for use in the Ryukyus (Okinawa area) and other provinces.

Edited after reading Sumnom's first several posts.

laurentyvan

Thanks to both of you gentlemen for your late night chats. I got a nice Shu the other day but am having trouble imaging it properly because of its rich toning and small size. I find coins that don't fit our mental images of coins very interesting.

sumnom

JNDA also says that there were many, many contemporary counterfeits.

The varieties in the JNDA are differentiated by variations in the hole size and calligraphy. You have to really look carefully to see the differences. Much patience and a good knowledge of Chinese characters are needed!

sumnom

I have seen cardboard flips for these coins but I have yet to see a slab for one!

laurentyvan

JNDA also says that there were many, many contemporary counterfeits.

The gentleman I purchased this from is one of my regulars and grew up in Japan so I have a tendancy to trust him-but I could never tell for sure if it was fake or not.

sumnom

I am not saying yours is fake. I just was throwing out what I found in the JDNA catalogue.

I don't know much about these coins so i am only just know reading about them. It seems you can tell which coins were minted where. My 1976 JDNA catalogue differentiates the Tosa and Satsuma issues, for example, by calligraphy and thickness of the rims.

sumnom

Did the Ryukyu issues also bear the legend "tenpo tsuho?" I see that there were also 100 mon denominations from 1863 that bear the legend "ryukyu tsuho."

satootoko

<< <i>Ummm, Jacobs and Vermicelli say it dates from 1835. >>

Is that Vermeule's cousin, or his dinner?

lordmarcovan

I've got two of 'em.

sumnom

It took a while for someone to recognize my noodle joke.

hamiltonjh

I have one of them. however, it's one of the "varities" I guess. Notice the top character on the right side picture. it's different than yours. Same coin, but slightly different. However, I'm not sure of the year. and unfortunately, mine has corrosion on it. not sure I can get it all off. Got some off, with goo-gone....but...anyway....

edited for: looking again, and comparing it to yours again, perhaps they're the same but yours is a little more worn so I missed the details. I'd like to hold them together to compare.

1jester

Hmmmmmm......this is all Greek to me! (with apologies to Dimitri )