Jefferson specialists question

centmaster

I'm looking for a 1939 nickel with the Ty.1 reverse of '38. I can't find a price record for any PCGS 66FS coins that sold in the last 3 years that were truly the '38 reverse. Heritage has sold a few that they listed as '38 rev., but they were really the '40 reverse and Teletrade hasn't sold any. I know that PCGS used to label the reverse of '38 when it really wasn't. Any idea of what a real '38 reverse 66FS 1939 PCGS coin would go for would be much appreciated. I know they are much rarer than the '40 reverse.

clackamas

That is a good question. So many of the FS 39 coins are really rev of 40's. I think that if you had a "true" rev of 38 1939 and sold it you may get hosed becasue the pops really do not reflect the "true" POPs on these. Are you selling one? You may get a better deal by placing it with someone here than with heritage. Most dealers don't look for or can tell the difference.

MJPHELAN

I saw one sold on Teletrade about 1 1/2 years ago which sold for only $300 (I missed it!). I saw one for sale on E-bay for $1100, but no one bought it (which amazes me). I don't think most people realize how rare the reverse of 38 is in full steps. The pcgs population report does not help this.

centmaster

Thanks, guys. No, I wish I had one to sell. I'm looking to find one. Even a 65FS would be OK at this point!

MJPHELAN

I bought mine in a SEGS holder as MS-66 5 full steps. It crossed to PCGS as MS-66FS! I think ANACS is also a good bet to search under. I saw one for sale about a year ago, but don't remember how much it sold for.

stephunter

I bought the one that was listed as a reverse of 38 in the Heritage internet sale about 2 weeks ago, but it is the rev of 40. I knew that when I bid on it, I needed the rev. of 40 as well.

CarlWohlforth

Do they designate Full Step for well struck Jeffersons with the reverse of '38? It seems those wavy steps could never be full, and they don't look full on my proof 1938...

stephunter

All the services will grade the reverse of 38 full steps on the mint state coins. I agree with you, I have seen pleanty of 38 reverse coins that do not look like full step coins.

MJPHELAN

About 3 years ago PCGS started accepting the "wavey" steps of the 1938 reverse. The first 38-D certified as full steps sold for about $1400! Now they can be obtained for a much more reasonable price. According to Bernard Nagengast, only about 1/1000 1939 rev. of 38 Jeffersons are full steps. I think when this becomes more common knowledge, they will become more valuable.

NIckelCollector

I'm still looking for a 39P reverse of 38 in full steps. If anyone has one let me know. I' m willing to pay a premium for a high grade example.

The PCGS pop reports are very misleading. When PCGS started attributing both reverses it used the existing coin numbers and all certified coins were given the reverse of 38 #s. The reverse of 40 got the new numbers. Most of the 39Ps listed as reverse of 38 are probably reverse of 40.

I have purchased several that the sellers said were reverse of 38 but were really 40.

Frank

solid

PCGS uses a different criteria for the Rev of '38 nickels in regards to full
step, allowing for the fact that the dies themselves did not have sharply
defined steps as in the Rev of '40.

leothelyon

Before PCGs started grading FS nickels, I knew who had most of the certified ANACS coins at one time! And half of them were not FS! I bought my coin raw for $425 which ANACS certified in MS66. Here's the coin!


Leo

MJPHELAN

Leo,

Is that a reverse of 38? Do you have a photo of the steps?

leothelyon

<< <i>Leo,

Is that a reverse of 38? Do you have a photo of the steps? >>



Hi Mark
Here's the best I can do with a pic of the steps. There is separation between the 4th and 5th step under that 3rd pillar but it's difficult to capture. There's also a nice quarter of the 6th step showing.
The ill defined steps of 1938 and the type 1 1939PDS will almost never show 5 full complete steps, even if you were able to find one like the coin pictured below. The reason lies under the 1st pillar between the 1st and 2nd steps. The first step thins out to nothing as it extends under that 1st pillar. that area of the steps is also difficult to find on the proofs as well My coin shows that separation under that 1st pillar , but stops just short of reaching the left side.


Leo

Cocoinut

I bought a 1939-P in PCGS MS67FS around November of 2000 or 2001. There was no distinction made then between the type of 1938 and type of 1940, and I remember it was a pop 2 coin at the time. The coin is stashed in my safe deposit box, so I can't check it now, but I believe it may be the type of 1938. It was a Teletrade investor lot of 2 MS67's, and the description said one of the coins was full strike. I wasn't sure if that meant it had the FS designation by PCGS, so I only bid what I thought a regular MS67 would be worth. I won the lot, and when I received the 2 coins, sure enough, one was a 67FS.

I don't have a Jefferson business strike Registry set, and don't follow the market for them very closely. Can anyone tell me :

(1) what a MS67 non-FS is worth, and
(2) what a MS67FS runs for the type of 1938 and
(3) a MS67FS type of 1940?

I'd like to know "real" market prices, not the CU published prices.

TIA

Jim

keets

someone mentioned getting "hosed" by buying the Reverse of 1938 coins. i think the wisest thing to do with these coins is to buy at a price that seems closer to the Reverse of 1940 level. with the pop numbers all screwed up due to the changes that were made several years ago by PCGS and most recently by NGC, it's pure speculation what's really out there as far as numbers for the three dates and the two varieties.

another thing that i believe would be helpful to us all would be for HRH to enter a thread like this and give us a tutorial of sorts as to exactly what they will assign the FS designation to. i toted a few nice coins to a show in the hopes of having him look at them and talk to me about it but we missed each other. my instincts tell me that since the step detail is inherently weak from the die to begin with, a legitimate Full Step coin like what we're accustomed to with the Reverse of 1940 may be a fantasy and few-and-far-between. i assume the variety is graded according to "strike intent" when the steps are clean and the lower portion of numbers 5-6 are visible. it's an almost certainty that any FS examples are EDS.

these are coins to be purchased not by the faint of heart!!! how much faith do we each have in the series???

al h.

Cocoinut

OK, I pulled my 39-P MS67FS from the bank yesterday, and it turns out that it's "only" a type of 1940, not the scarcer type of 1938.





Jim