Does sniping screw sellers?
CharlesDarwin
Posts: 285 ✭
Just wondering what you people think of this idea?
Does it result in lower prices for the buyer? Since there's not quite the bidding action before hand?
Does it result in lower prices for the buyer? Since there's not quite the bidding action before hand?
to live outside the law, you must be honest ---- bd
0
Comments
as buyers, do we care ?
Russ, NCNE
I had 6 coins at 99c with no reserve end this past Sunday... I didn't get my first bid until Sunday morning. Subsequently, I had some 25-30 bids on Sunday alone, and quite a few snipes, a few which more than doubled the auction's price.
From that experience, I'd say sniping doesn't hurt... it just results in fewer early bids that can scare a seller
Jeremy
I hate it when you see my post before I can edit the spelling.
Always looking for nice type coins
my local dealer
As far as I'm concerned, as long as the seller gets a sale, they have sold at a price they are willing to sell for, and are therefore not screwed. If someone opens bidding at $300 for a $500 item (or sets a $300 reserve), they are saying, in effect, "any sale price at or above $300 is sufficient for me to be willing to complete this sale." Any offer of $300 or more is NOT screwing the seller. They have indicated, through their opening bid and/or reserve, what they consider the minimum acceptable sale price.
Having said that, for those so inclined as a buyer, if they have the time and ability to do so there's no reason to ever do anything *but* snipe your best offer a few seconds before the auction closes. If a few of them compete, as they often do for desirable items, the result for the seller can be quite satisfactory.
Couldn't agree with you more...
Without a reserve, the seller accepts whatever is offered. If there are "lurkers" ( God forbid), they can bid as they see fit.
The "snipe" mechanism seems to work well for the more seasoned bidders.
I (
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
I would think it keeps some people from getting caught up in a bidding war where they are no longer bidding what they think the coin
is worth but what their ego is worth.
It causes anxiety for sellers because they worry their item will sell for too little to the very end.
I use it almost exlusively.
-Khayse
Anything that increases the bid price benefits sellers (a no brainer)!!!!
<< <i>It causes anxiety for sellers because they worry their item will sell for too little to the very end. >>
If they worry that the item will sell for too little, then they have set up the auction to allow them to buy it for too little. That's their problem, not the bidder's.
Note that I'm dealing with this as a seller right now -- for one currently open item, I have a double-digit number of watchers and, halfway through the auction's run time, no bids on an auction with an opening bid of $325, a BIN of $425 and a market value of probably $450. So I don't speak only from the point of view of the buyer. Yes, I worry that someone will snipe $325 at the end and take it -- but that's a calculated risk I *chose* to make when I started the auction. More likely, with this number of watchers, a few bids will be made in the last few minutes, and hopefully that will get the bid closer to the BIN price, at least. I do wonder what would have happened if I started bidding at one cent and set a $325 reserve, but we'll never know. Nevertheless, if it sells for $325, if I'm disappointed, it's my own fault for letting someone take it at that price.
Experience has taught me that the best way to sell is to get a lot of bids. You get a lot of bids by starting the item off at $0.99 and no reserve.
This is how I sell 95% of my stuff. Usually things turn out fine, sometimes you get screwed. Sniping contributes to this.
Everyone knows how to avoid this (by setting a reserve). There's not much need for sniping for an item that has a reserve at it's retail
value. The whole idea of sniping is to hide what you think is the real value of the item, to try to get a bargain.
But I don't like having a reserve. It turns some potential bidders off knowing that they may spend time and effort winning an auction and then
still not getting the coin. I'm not a dealer and don't need to get any particular amount and any particular coin.
-Khayse
<< <i>> .
. Usually things turn out fine, sometimes you get screwed. Sniping contributes to this.
The whole idea of sniping is to hide what you think is the real value of the item, to try to get a bargain.
>>
How can getting a higher (sniped) bid contribute to a loss????
Maybe the idea of sniping is to buy something you want at the best possible price, or to guarantee that you win the auction!!! You will never know how much a winning sinper actually bid!
(add) If I see a coin selling for 80% of it's value with 3-4 days left, I sometimes get the feeling Im bidding against the house.
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
<< <i>Anything that increases the bid price benefits sellers (a no brainer)!!!! >>
True, but if you get two people to start competing with real time left, they're bound to fight and one will push the price too high, which is good for the seller. Wars are avoided with sniping.
<< <i>It can't help sellers. It keeps the valuable information of what people are willing to pay for a coin hidden from other bidders. >>
But that can help, too... there have been times where I've figured that since a big player has a bid in, I won't win if I bid what I feel is a relatively fair amount, and on occasion, I've just not bothered bidding... without knowing there's a big guy there, more bidders may take the time to place a snipe.
Hey, I just got a snipe... I love them
<< <i>I Or is that just sour grapes? >>
you got it!!!
Steve
Because the person who is waiting until the last minute to place their bid is withholding information about the true value of the coin.
They are also causing other potential bidders to second guess their decision to bid. "Why is this coin going for so little? Is there a mark in the
picture that I didn't notice? Does the seller have a bad reputation? " Etc.
> or to guarantee that you win the auction!!!
I don't think many people that want to guarantee that they win wait until the last 5 or 10 seconds to bid.
> I think it helps the seller. If the bid stays low more people put the coin on their watch list and bid on the coin.
Always the contrarian, eh Mark? I'll agree more people will watch a cheaper item but I'm far from convinced that this will result in
a higher overall price. Probably it will just result in 10 different people all trying to bid $70 on a $100 item at the very end.
As a final thought, why aren't all of Heritage's bid auctions "sealed bid"? Answer: Because it would result in lower overall prices.
-KHayse
ps we may be arguing over semantics. It doesn't "screw" sellers but it's not to their advantage.
<< <i>They are also causing other potential bidders to second guess their decision to bid. "Why is this coin going for so little? Is there a mark in the
picture that I didn't notice? Does the seller have a bad reputation? " Etc. >>
Actually, they cause me to wonder how many snipers are out there... that commonly has me rethink (and oftentimes raise) my bid. When it's high to begin with, I figure it's near it's max and feel safer with a bid closer to the current price.
Jeremy
<< <i>Charles,
as buyers, do we care ? >>
Noooooooo, it's "who cares"!!!!
A snipers dream, 4 mins left, slabbed coin bid at 60% of value with one of those terrible pictures, yellow coin. Wrong light setting.
<< <i>Experience has taught me that the best way to sell is to get a lot of bids. You get a lot of bids by starting the item off at $0.99 and no reserve. >>
Ditto. I start everything at $1 no reserve. I look at eBay as an auction venue, not a retail store. Personally, I love snipers.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>The whole idea of sniping is to hide what you think is the real value of the item, to try to get a bargain. >>
Hey, I earned my knowledge the hard way -- why should I share it with other bidders or a seller who can't be bothered to do the same? Frankly, I do not snipe "to get a bargain." I snipe to not have an ignorant bidder run the price up a dollar a bid until he beats my bid by a pittance ... and then I have to go bid again at the end to keep him from doing more of the same. It is not my responsibility to teach that penny-ante bidder the value of something. When I'm up against knowledgeable bidders, often my bid is not much higher than theirs.
The kind of sniper I dislike is the sort I call "überbidders." These guys usually also don't know what the item is worth so they bid ridiculously high. They probably figure they get the item and an education on its true value from the knowledgeable bidders by paying only one increment higher for the privilege. That works until two überbidders go for it ... then one of them loses big time!
Come on over ... to The Dark Side!
Days 1-2 nothing happens
Days 3-5 slow build-up to aprox 30-40% of their final value
Day 6 # of bids increase, up to 60-70% of final value
Day 7 stand back! Snipers can do astonishing things, up to doubling price in last 10 seconds.
I had a 1652 Oak Tree Shilling that went from $1176 to $2600 in the last 10 seconds of an auction as two sniper bids were placed. Wow.
They don't allow sniping at major auctions and for good reason. Imagine a scenario with no one bidding waiting for a clock to tick down to < 2 seconds and then 6 diff people raising up their paddles and screaming out a bid. What a mess! Guess what? It's not allowed. If you toss in a bid in the last second, they wait and see if anyone still wants to better it.
I'm not very good at sniping but when I do it and win, I usually get the coin for LESS than what I was willing to pay if need be. I think sniping is a stupid system and I'm not an ebayer consignor, just a bidder/buyer. There are better systems out there.
roadrunner
When I sell, and it's 1 minute to go.....I always hope for snipers . Am I hoping to get cheated?
As a seller the human and technical elements of sniping make me nervous. You're relying on snipers to show up on time or their sniping software to be reliable. And there's always the chance that their internet connection fails or EBay's site seizes up. One thing is certain -- selling with no reserve on EBay is not for the faint of heart. You watch your item bid up to 60% its value for 6 days, 23 hours and 59 minutes and then hold your breath.
This auction I followed the other night is an example of how one late bid (18 seconds left) more than doubled the sale price. If the sniper didn't show up it sells for 2.3K less. Sometimes you're relying on one solitary EBay member to get his bid in, and if he doesn't we wouldn't even know how screwed we were.
In a live auction, a potential buyer knows what he is up against and has the opportunity to increase his bid.
If ebay extended an auction by five minutes after receipt of last bid, I believe prices would generally be higher.
Imagine how many FEWER bids would be put in if we relied on ourselves to bid in the last few seconds (as many insist on doing - with or without a sniping program) instead of a very sophisticated yet incredibly simple software program to do it for us. Now that's how sellers would really be screwed.
<< <i>selling with no reserve on EBay is not for the faint of heart. You watch your item bid up to 60% its value for 6 days, 23 hours and 59 minutes and then hold your breath. >>
Adrenaline is my favorite drug.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Does it result in lower prices for the buyer? Since there's not quite the bidding action before hand? >>
Not only that, but as the sniper you don't get an opportunity to second guess yourself.
When I first started eBaying 6 years ago, I'd make a bid and after either coming up short or being outbid at a later time I would start to justify paying a higher price and would place higher and higher bids. I HATED TO LOOSE.
After winning a few auctions with bids that were too much, I started sniping. Now, if my snipe comes up short, I figure it wasn't ment to be and I can move on to other auctions stress free.
After winning a snipe, I've never ever had a seller complain about it.
I pretty frequently have underbidders complain about their loss. Maybe they are the ones who are screwed.
Or perhaps the other buyers are ripping themselves by not bidding their max, just like I bid my max.
You put the coin up for sale, it gets bought whats the problem.
All the seller should be concerned about is getting the coin sold not how its bought.
A snipe is a bid just like any other bid!!