Barber quarter collectors - looking for some history on the 1901-S

Casey

In the Winter issue of the 2001 BCCS Journal, Glenn Church wrote an article that stated the following related to the 01-S: "Most of these coins went to Hawaiian Royalty and some day these coins will flood the market, thus depressing the value."

I don't follow quarters very closely but thought this was pretty interesting. Can anyone provide any more information?

Casey

ARCO

There are some theories or rumors of some small hoards that might exist. One rumor is that a roll or two are in Hawaii, another is that some are in the Phillippines. Neither has ever been confirmed or verified. Due to the extremely high value of the date, it seems unlikely that any will surface in the future and that most if not all of the MS examples are known.

The 1913-S has nearly half the mintage but has many more mint state examples than the 1901-S, highlighting that not only did the 1901-S have a miniscule mintage, but that its survivorship was extremely low. What makes the 1901-S so amazingly scarce is the nearly complete vacuum of coins in the midgrade ranges of Fine-AU. In MS it can be had now and then, even though it is very scarce and commands a kings ransom to purchase.

An original roll turning up is not very probable, but it is within the realm of possibility. I would wager all that I own that there are no hoards of coins in the F-AU grades that exist or that ever will.

If you want the scarcity of the 1901-S barber quarter at a fraction of the price of the 1901-S, try to find a 1898-S in MS. You probably won't find one anytime soon, but if you could, it would be one of the great bargains in numismatics for the price vs rarity in my opinion.

Tyler

MFH

Tyler,

I couldn't agree with you more. The 01-S went directly into circulation; the rumor of a hoard of 01-S showing up in Asia is well within the realm of possibilities, yet none have been documented. The largest hoard ( two coins in PCGS 50 ) I have ever seen were at an ANA show in March, 2000; Win Callender / DLRC had them. I've never seen an AU 55 to 58 coin without any problems.

Its the last date I need for my AU set ( AU 55-58). Finding one is almost an impossibility.

David Lawrence noted that a hoard of Philippine coins of 1898-S, 1899-S and 1900-S have come back into the US, and most have been mishandled. These three dates ( as well as the 1897-S ) were the last ones I added to my set. Most coins of these dates that I saw were indeed mishandled, and it took me almost four years of intensive looking to locate these four dates in problem free almost uncirculated condition.

I have never looked at this series in Mint State, as very choice examples are well out of my coin budget.
I'm more than satisfied with very choice AU coins.

majorbigtime

I love '01S quarters, and own 3 of 'em (down from 5 awhile ago). Survival rate is low, but envision San Franscisco at the turn of the century. I believe the large Chinese population may have had something to do with the low survival rate, as many silver coins reportedly were sent to China for a date with the melting pot.

Whatever the reason, these coins are scarce and always invoke interest among dealers and collectors. It is noteworthy that hi-grade circulated examples are virtually non-existant (I passed on an EF40 at Long Beach around 4 years ago for $7K--big mistake).The price for a low grade has more than doubled in the past couple of years and I haven't seen a MS example auction or otherwise sell for awhile.

jdimmick

One of my favorite coins of all time. Truly scarce if not down right rare in problem free mid circulated grades as others have mentioned. Ms pieces are tough, but do come available from time to time for a big price. Also, on the lower end they are pricey, but available. I have owned a PCGS Good-6, then upgraded to a Vg10 and now I have a super nice F-12 which is actually a 15 all day any day. It took me 4 years of intense searching to locate the PCGS fine that I have now. Early on in my initial search I did run across a few pieces in higher grade that I would have liked to have purchased, but couldnt afford it at the time. One was an Xf-45, and two were Au-50's. There is another (Board member) among us that has been searching for a nice Vf for over ten years I believe (Hope I right on that Dave).

Since the aquisition of my piece, which I owe my life to Steve Elwood for finding it, I have seen two other circulated ones come available, but were quickly sold. They were an NGC-30 out of a Nevada collection that went to auction, and an NGC-45 that was at Baltimore last year that looked somewhat rough IMO, and Dr. Pete's PCGS AU-50 that Harry Laibstain sold last year.

The prices have continued to escalate rapidly on this date and probably will continue as collectors snap them up when they come available. IMO, the lower grade AG's and G's are about topped out vs thier availbility, but for somereason collector demand for them seems to keep um moving as well. But back to your question, I had herd the rumors about the possibility of some coming out of hiding, but after all this time, I dont beileve we will ever see it materialize, and if so, I would have to agree it would most likely not be in the problem free middle circualted grades where the fewest coins survice and the largest demand is?

jim

roadrunner

I tracked mint state specimens of all barbers for a several year period back in the late 1970's and found that as a rule, it was the off-year S and O mints that were the most underrated. I was very careful not to count duplicates. Price-wise the 01-s, 96-s, and 13-s were quite expensive but showed up at about the same regularity in gem or choice condition as the following: dates like 98-0, 98-s, 99-s, 99-0, 00-0, 01-0, 07-S, 07-D were on my "buy" list in MS65. The 99-s at that time was probably the toughest date in the series to find in gem grade. Yes, even tougher or just as tough as the
01-s. I located my first specimen in early 1980 when it was $6000. I passed as the market was insane by then and the value ultimately fell by at least half. I was able to buy specimens of 98-0, 00-0, 01-0, 07-s and 07-D however. The rarity groups have changed quite a bit since then as they always do from decade to decade. Resubmissions on the pop reports also skew the results.

I don't know if it was Dave Bowers or someone else at B&M that alluded to a roll set of MS Barber coinage still out there. I wouldn't doubt it. A friend of mine has been trying to pry free a roll of
BU 89-cc dollars so there is still plenty of untapped stuff out there.

roadrunner

Dave99B

Interested thread, Casey!

Count me among the doubters that hoarded rolls of 01-S quarters are in existence, unless they are buried or hidden somewhere, long lost and forgotten about. Clearly, it would be well within reason to believe that a few very well-to-do collectors in the early 1900s could have recognized the miniscule mintage of the 01-S, and may have hoarded the date. Could they have hoarded quarter so extensively, that it caused such a shortage today? Highly unlikely. But even had they done so, the coins must have been lost over that last 100+ years. I just can’t believe they are sitting in someone’s safe deposit box.

I tend to believe either the recorded mintage is wrong (the actual number being much, much lower), or many bags were simply lost. Accounting procedures and mintage accounting at the Mints has been spotty at times. Maybe some clerical error at the Mint caused the bags to be inventories incorrectly? Maybe, when located, they were melted down, and the silver purposed? Who knows. It’s really all just conjecture. My gut feeling is that very few 01-S quarters ever made their way out onto the street.

The examples that did make it out of the mint were either culled from circulation very early (and today exist in MS or AU condition), or they circulated freely until worn virtually slick. There is indeed a vacuum of examples between VG and XF, where material is seemingly unavailable.

I myself have searched for about 15 years for an 01-s in original VF condition, lacking only it and the 13-s to complete my VF set. The two or three VFs I have seen were all heavily cleaned, yet still made their way in PCGS and ANACS plastic. All showed technical VF wear, but all were abused (hairlined and bright white). These were coins I would not want to see in my set! If I have to, I’ll probably downgrade that date to an original VG example (advice David Lawrence gave me ten years ago, after telling me he had only seen two original VFs in his entire career).

Contrats to Jim again who beat me to the F-12 he currently controls. That coin is truly amazing…Jim, when you upgrade to the VF-20, I’ll buy your F-12!

Dave