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THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS when you have Liberals playing MLB in Canada!!!
BigKidAtHeart
Posts: 1,799 ✭✭
in Sports Talk
Carlos Delgado refuses to stand when "God Bless America" is played.... Saying that the United States' invasion of Iraq "the stupidest war ever."
(by the way... is STUPIDEST even a word...)
The Blue Jays' franchise leader in home runs and RBIs, Delgado is that rare ballplayer who exhibits a conscience about social issues and has the conviction to express himself in his own small way.
He has chosen, most of this season, to do that by sitting in the dugout or ducking into the clubhouse during the singing of Irving Berlin's prayerful ode, introduced by Kate Smith during her radio broadcast on Armistice Day, 1938.
Agree or disagree with Delgado for calling the Iraq invasion "the stupidest war ever," the Puerto Rican slugger is not being anti-American by showing his disagreement with President Bush's policy. He is not disrespecting the soldiers or, as one Yankee fan said, slapping every New Yorker and American in the face.
Delgado is simply exercising the most fundamental of our rights, freedom of speech, or more accurately in this case, freedom to sit silently while his teammates stand on the dugout steps.
Delgado has spoken out on political issues before, opposing the Navy's use of the Puerto Rican island of Vieques as a weapons testing ground. He joined singer Ricky Martin and boxer Felix Trinidad in taking out full-page ads about Vieques in The New York Times and Washington Post. The military ended the testing last year, but left behind the scars of decades of bombing.
Delgado has put hundreds of thousands of his own dollars into repairing the damage to the people and the environment on Vieques, and wants the U.S. government to do much more.
What began as a private protest against the Iraq invasion, which Delgado did not widely advertise and the other Blue Jays didn't mind, is drawing more attention since he opened up to the Toronto Star a few weeks ago.
"It's a very terrible thing that happened on Sept. 11," Delgado said. "It's (also) a terrible thing that happened in Afghanistan and Iraq. I just feel so sad for the families that lost relatives and loved ones in the war. But I think it's the stupidest war ever."
Delgado reasserted his beliefs to The New York Times in a column published Wednesday, saying "It takes a man to stand up for what he believes."
(by the way... is STUPIDEST even a word...)
The Blue Jays' franchise leader in home runs and RBIs, Delgado is that rare ballplayer who exhibits a conscience about social issues and has the conviction to express himself in his own small way.
He has chosen, most of this season, to do that by sitting in the dugout or ducking into the clubhouse during the singing of Irving Berlin's prayerful ode, introduced by Kate Smith during her radio broadcast on Armistice Day, 1938.
Agree or disagree with Delgado for calling the Iraq invasion "the stupidest war ever," the Puerto Rican slugger is not being anti-American by showing his disagreement with President Bush's policy. He is not disrespecting the soldiers or, as one Yankee fan said, slapping every New Yorker and American in the face.
Delgado is simply exercising the most fundamental of our rights, freedom of speech, or more accurately in this case, freedom to sit silently while his teammates stand on the dugout steps.
Delgado has spoken out on political issues before, opposing the Navy's use of the Puerto Rican island of Vieques as a weapons testing ground. He joined singer Ricky Martin and boxer Felix Trinidad in taking out full-page ads about Vieques in The New York Times and Washington Post. The military ended the testing last year, but left behind the scars of decades of bombing.
Delgado has put hundreds of thousands of his own dollars into repairing the damage to the people and the environment on Vieques, and wants the U.S. government to do much more.
What began as a private protest against the Iraq invasion, which Delgado did not widely advertise and the other Blue Jays didn't mind, is drawing more attention since he opened up to the Toronto Star a few weeks ago.
"It's a very terrible thing that happened on Sept. 11," Delgado said. "It's (also) a terrible thing that happened in Afghanistan and Iraq. I just feel so sad for the families that lost relatives and loved ones in the war. But I think it's the stupidest war ever."
Delgado reasserted his beliefs to The New York Times in a column published Wednesday, saying "It takes a man to stand up for what he believes."
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<< <i>Carlos Delgado is Puerto Rican and since 1917 Puerto Rican born citizens are United States Citizens just like you! So he is given the same freedom to express himself as you have to push your political stance on a sports message board. >>
all the more reason he should stand for the song.. if Delgado thinks his country is so wrong to be in Iraq/Afghanistan, then he SHOULD WANT his country to be blessed..
<< <i>Before making a post you might want to do a little research. Carlos Delgado is Puerto Rican and since 1917 Puerto Rican born citizens are United States Citizens just like you! So he is given the same freedom to express himself as you have to push your political stance on a sports message board. >>
yeah, that may be "technically true" but they should not be...
puerto rico is great, ALL the benefits of being an American but none of the bad aspects. no taxes would make me want to stand for the song even more though.
If you read it correctly, Delgado is opposed to war of any kind, not just this one. I don't agree with his opinion but I will respect his beliefs. Also realize that he did not choose to make this public, the media jumped in and decided to advertise his stance. He's not Michael Moore, just a US citizen making his beliefs known.
Should all the Quakers in the US also be deported for opposing this and all other wars?
<< <i>Should all the Quakers in the US also be deported for opposing this and all other wars? >>
yes! and the NFL shouldnt keep allowing the Pro Bowl to be played in another country! oh.. wait.. Hawaii is the U.S. isnt it?
but seriously, Atheists are the only U.S. Citizens that should oppose "God Bless America".. other than that, if a person believes in ANY kind of deity, shouldnt that person want their country to be blessed? if the country isnt currently in the condition you'd like it to be, shouldnt you want it to be blessed for the better?
just my opinion..
<< <i>puerto rico is great, ALL the benefits of being an American but none of the bad aspects. no taxes would make me want to stand for the song even more though. >>
well SOME of them have to pay taxes according to the IRS
<< <i>Take your BS partisan attacks to the Open Forum where they will be welcome. This isn't the first time you've tried this crap. >>
He is a baseball player - doing this DURING his games...
hence the forum SPORTS TALK!
(funny how that works, huh?!)
and also, I have tried to use the word CRAP
before on these forums, and it blocked it.
CRAP used to be a censored word on these forums!
Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism.
Groucho Marx
<< <i>THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS when you have Liberals playing MLB in Canada!!! >>
And Delgado's refusal to stand has what exactly to do with Canada?? Are you suggesting it would have been OK if he was in NY or LA?
<< <i>(by the way... STUPIDEST is not even a word...) >>
The Concise Oxford Dictionary..stupid..(stupider,stupidest...
Skip
ANGEL OF HOPE
Skip
TUSTIN CA
THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS when you have self-righteous, right-wingers stirring up trouble on purpose!!
--and then sit back and feed the fire. I feel sorry for you if you enjoy p*ssing off fellow sports card collectors. Do you learn this behavior at your church? Are you teaching your innocent children this same hatred for fellow citizens?
Congrats on another fine job displaying your intolerance for others.
If you had any sense of cordial civility or politeness, you would delete/edit your title, and maybe all your posts on this thread--but we all know you will not.
Just like Bush/Cheney--hate for others is your addiction, accountability for your actions is irrelevant.
The fact that this scenario is taking place at a baseball game is just scenery. Your sole purpose in starting this thread was to attack his political views--and you made sure to incite ever more fever by having "liberals" in your thread--once again a blanket slam on basically 50% of Americans who have a different poltical view than you.
My step-Dad would be considered a liberal, and he did 2 tours in Vietnam. My grandfather served in WWII, an uncle in Korea, and my first cousin gave his life in Desert Storm (82nd Airbourne). All of my family served so that rights we as citizens enjoy would be safe.
It is your right to hate us because you get some sense of purpose in that--but these forums have proper places for spewing your hate (see Open Forum). You probably timed this thread on purpose, knowing that most of the administrators are involved with the National, and may not have a chance to moniter these boards until next week. If there are any moderators around, they certainly aren't doing their job.
<< <i>and my first cousin gave his life in Desert Storm (82nd Airbourne). >>
All the way!
Seriously guys, knowing all of you the way I do, this is probably not what anyone would want to happen. You are good people and I respect all your points of view. I think Akbar alluded to the fact that if we all just practice the 'art' of tolerance....and BTW, here's a question for you: if you are "on the job," i.e., on company time, whose freedom of speech do you get to express? Yours or your boss' view? Just a thought.
Stone
Groucho Marx
<< <i>Ladies and gentlemen let's get ready to rumble!
Seriously guys, knowing all of you the way I do, this is probably not what anyone would want to happen.
no way! an intra-forum Battle Royal Steel Cage match would be great! Maybe we can arrange it for next years National?
BTW - I'm the dude in the red & white tights doing the sweet drop-kick..
horrid ways possible. He doesn't know the fear of a hijacked plane and the terror that went on during that
flight. He doesn't know the horror of mass gassings, or living behind a veil all your life. This moron plays
baseball. He doesn't put his *ss on the line. Its the police outside the locker room that put their lives on the
line for him! Its the firemen that stand guard over his multimillion dollar house that put themsleves in the
way of danger. This guy knows nothing of bravery. He is where he is today because of American's who
freed themselves from the British and helped stop lunitics like Hitler and Sadaam. Americans who valued
freedom and liberty even over their own lives!
I don't remember him speaking out on the horrors of Sadaam...gassing his own people. Where was he
during the first gulf war? Was it ok then? Why is this idiot talking now? Without war we have no freedom, we
are but one of the few countires where he can live like a king and make millions batting .300 or .100.
Delgado needs to thank whatever God he worships, that there are brave men and women out there who
are willing to protect him and his family even when he insults those people and spits in their faces!
-Kevin
<< <i>Without war we have no freedom, we
are but one of the few countires where he can live like a king and make millions batting .300 or .100.
Delgado needs to thank whatever God he worships, that there are brave men and women out there who
are willing to protect him and his family even when he insults those people and spits in their faces!
-Kevin >>
I've said it before.. As usual, I agree with Kevin..
<< <i>I don't remember him speaking out on the horrors of Sadaam...gassing his own people. >>
Actually, not only did the U.S. cast a blind eye toward Saddam's human rights abuses for most of the '80s, we were at least somewhat complicit in them. Only when it became politically and economically expedient did we become righteously indignant about Iraq's WMD's.
<< <i>I've said it before.. As usual, I agree with Kevin.. >>
Kevin and Pan
I'm not one to argue politics/ideologies with sports and altho I tend to be conservative, I enjoy the liberal point also, but with respect to the belief by Delgado, I think you guys have stuck the landing on this one.
Furthermore, this is just my opinion, but when a ballplayer is "on the job", they should leave their individual biases/feelings/beliefs at home. The sports arena, whether it be a ball park, awards ceremony, television show etc., should be devoid of politics, ideologies and personal agendas. It ought to be about the sport, competition period IMO. Sports figures, entertainers e.g., get away with crap you or I could get fired for in our jobs.
Mike
Why is America fighting Sadaam? Because of what he does to his countrymen? Oil? Bush vengeance? Were there "weapons of mass destruction"? Wasn't that the main reason we are there, and when none are found the reasons change.
I do not agree with his style of protest, but I do agree with his reasoning. I am sure that Carlos Delgado appreciates the life he has, as well as recognizing the anguish of the families of all of the victims of 9/11 and the war in Iraq. He does not think that we should be in Iraq, and that sentiment is shared by many Americans.
<< <i>Why is America fighting Sadaam >>
1420
That is my whole point. We should not know "what" his attitude is from anything he displays while in a baseball uniform. We can all disagree with the policies and actions of our elected officials but I don't think they should come out in the sports arena.
Mike
of the people who keep us safe. If you want to talk about Bush start another topic, this has nothing to
do with him, just a rotton, selfish ball player who doesn't know what he has. Maybe we need to drop him
in the middle of Liberia or Iran and see where his anti-war protests get him.
If you don't like W thats great, If you think Kerry is jerk fine, but this country is kept safe by people who
don't get paid squat and don't get to be on tv to receive awards. Its those people that give is a right to
post whatever we want here, and its those people that make it safe to take your kids to the vet and
have a few hot dogs and get home safe at night!
It real easy to sit in your 100,000 dollar car and pull into your gated community and million dollar home and
forget about the poeple who died and will die for you. Delgado needs to stand when the flag is raised and
thank God for what he has.
It makes me sick that every 4 years we come together and act like morans and it makes me more sick that it
takes a bunch of cowards running planes into our buildings to knock sense into us. If you have forgotten how
it feels remember back to how you felt waking up September, 12 2001!
Do anyone of us want to live in that world the rest of our lives?
I don't
We need to thank the people who really matter in this country, and it AINT ball players, especially selfish ones!
<< <i>I guess it was OK, though, when Bush was at the Daytona 500. >>
Yawie
Bush is also a citizen and is both a representative and a spectator - did he stop the race and give a speech?
Mike
for me to pay you before you say something important?
LMK
Kevin
The larger point is that, for better or worse, sports have always been infused with politics: The Miracle on Ice, Muhammad Ali, Louis-Schmeling, and so on.
<< <i> dunno, but I doubt he was there simply to enjoy the race. >>
Good point - may have had a covert agenda - but who knows?
I agree, sports will always have the national agenda and society as a "back drop" - but that is different than making an "overt" demonstration of ones personal beliefs during some part of the event experience - in this case the preamble to the actual game.
This is just my opinion and believe me it won't get you a cup of coffee or anything.
Thanx
Mike
edit: 3rd grade grammar
<< <i>You probably timed this thread on purpose, knowing that most of the administrators are involved with the National, and may not have a chance to moniter these boards until next week. >>
First, let me say that I think you are one funny dude!
Second, I did not "start this thread out of hate".
Dispite what you might think, I am a very nice guy
with morals and feelings and compassion and
an open mind, but I do have opinions. Mine just
happen to be different from yours.
I did not attack you. So let's just agree to disagree
on somethings.
Last, I put this here when I found this story on the web
so that others could see it that may not have heard about
it. I do not like what he is doing and feel basically like Joestalin
in the sense that I am disapointed that Delgado chooses to
protest that song. The idea that God (any one he might choose)
might actually Bless us, seems Exactly what an Anti war person
would Want to happen... but regardless, I just posted it here to
share information It is a baseball star acting a certain way in a
baseball game during a long honored baseball tradition (song),
so it is a Sports topic. Period.
And by the way. I did not know that Nationals were this week,
but the SportsModerator1 is always around.
Feel free to check with him on this, but I am pretty sure that I
am in the right forum... I mean it is not sports cards or trades
or selling... but it is SPORTS TALK.
Speaking of, do you think that other players would follow suit
if Carlos got a better response?
And what do you think that Bud Selig is going to say to him
in their PRIVATE meeting about it?
and Should home teams do anything to stop this?
I am sure that there are MANY good opinions about this and
how it EFFECTS THE GAME as well as how it effects your opinion
of the Player, team and leauge (if Selig does nothing)
Thanks.
~jeff cornett
he has over 10000 posts so he can do whatever he wants
<< <i>how did you do that? >>
wtf? it wont even let me quote him!
<< <i>Get your political chit off of this board >>
good one, Justin!
Stone
Mind control. It’s hard to think about but the internet and these big tech companies and marketing has fried brains. Pretty scary. Reminds me of the commercial of the “running of the puppies” commercial with the guy crawled in corner afraid of puppies instead of bulls. Insanity
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I would say that if you sit for the national anthem in protest you are exercising your rights. Fine. BUT don't stand for the Queen or another countries flag when in fact last time I checked, the UK and all the other countries participated in the same war. It should be the same. No??
End of Rant. Is it Friday yet
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