2004 CNA report

1960NYGiants

Just got back from the Canadian Numismatic Association 2004 convention held in Toronto. This was my 3rd CNA convention. I will try to post scans/photos later.

Day 1:
Toured the Royal Canadian Military Institute. On display were weapons (swords, pistols, rifles, and other small arms) used and captured by Canadian forces from 1812 to present. Including examples from the US invasion of Canada in 1812. For British military collectors, the institute has a near complete collection of campaign medals issued by the Crown to units of Canadian troops. Also on display is a complete set of shoulder and cap badges from units that fought in WW I and WW II.

Visited the Royal Ontario Museum (ROM). We were given a private behind the scenes numismatic tour. We were issued cotton gloves and allowed to closely examine some of the coins.

Part 1a: early English hammered silver crowns and gold nobles dating back to the 1400’s. Followed by examples of 1700’s + 1800’s British Governor General medals. Part 1b: ancient (Greek, Roman, and Byzantine) silver and gold pieces. All of the specimens reviewed were VF or better. The curators’ estimates of value ranged from $1500 to $20,000 US.

Part 2a: ancient Chinese (over 1000 years old) cast brass spade money, knife money, and money trees. What’s interesting about the money trees is that they were burial offerings for use in the afterlife. Part 2b: North American trade silver used by the explorers when dealing with natives. Part 2c: India counter stamped silvers from about 1000 years ago. Part 3c: A Canadian Coin Cabinet acquired in the 1920’s that held a near complete high grade set of pre-Confederation tokens (OH YEAH!) including a set of the extremely rare Vexator pieces and near complete grouping of Blacksmiths. I had not seen examples of this quality before.

Now the kicker – most of the coins are not on general display, nor are they photographed/catalogued. There is only one numismatist on staff and his specialty is ancients.

Days 2 + 3:
Convention only had approx 40 dealers – which is small compared to ANA conventions. Some of the notable dealers included: J&M Coins, Chuck Moore, Mike Findlay, Sean Isaacs, Newcan Coins, Bob Armstrong, Kadillac Koins, Michael Walsh – Canadian Coinoisseur, and Richard Stockley books.

Lots of ICCS material as expected. Also saw a bunch of PCGS, NGC, and ANACS slabs. Registrants were given a PCGS sample slab containing the 1967 silver centennial quarter. PCGS had a small display tended by two lovely ladies. But I didn’t see much activity happening there. AH of ACG had 4 cases but most of the coins were PCGS, ICCS, and NGC graded. Only half of one case was ACG stuff. He looked very bored. Brian of ICCS had a table but he was in and out of the show a lot. ICCS is located in Toronto and I suspect that he was working the show (picking up, grading, and delivering). There was a new service that I was not familiar with “CCCS”. Their setup looks a lot like ICCS except they use blue labels. The scuttlebutt I overheard by some dealers was not positive. NGC, ANACS, ICG, or SEGS were not present.

Pre-Confederation tokens were hard to come by. I managed to add seven to my collection including a nice VF copper 1781 North American token @ $160C. The price is high by Canadian catalogue but very cheap compared to the Redbook. Saw a nice original Molson piece in VF+ but holed and way too expensive @ $500C.

One dealer, Ross King, had mostly pre 1900 British material in high grades including an XF/AU Queen Anne crown. He had lots of red/brown coppers, too. British commonwealth gold was readily available. Saw a nice Gothic crown with orange/blue/purple color.

Canadian paper was selling at strong prices. Full red copper was demanding high prices in excess of 3x catalogue for MS63 grades. Two dealers were doing OK with books. I was able to snag a copy of The Charlton catalogue of Canadian Communion Tokens.

There were 3 dealers that had a large inventory of medals. Mostly Art Deco style medals from France, Belgium, South America and some US. Most had nice eye appeal and some BBLs were noticed. Prices were typically around $200C each. Lots of white metal coronation pieces, I picked up a bronze 1902 piece issued in Scarborough, Ontario and a copper 1937 piece issued in Lachine, Quebec.

There were 14 exhibits. Two of which I really liked. The best (IMO) was a display of the “hanging fleece” tokens from Newfoundland compared to examples of British Conders. The tokens had superb lustre and grade AU-UNC. The other nice exhibit was a set of 16 varieties of groats from Henry VIII, all high grade (VF+) hammered silver.

The auctions seemed lightly attended. I only stopped by for a few minutes between club meetings and activities, so cannot say if prices realized were good. Lots of dealer-to-dealer activity early Friday. Friday afternoon and Saturday saw a steady stream of collectors including YN’s. I did not attend Sunday as I opted to get out of Toronto before the Indy Car Race shut down the city.

All in all, the show was fun. I enjoyed talking with many dealers that I knew from eBay or online. I also enjoyed meeting other members of the Canadian Association of Token Collectors. Next year the convention will be in Calgary.

Gene

theboz11

Great Report,, Thanks

canadiancoinguy

Sounds like it went very well! The ROM part seems quite interesting.

ajaan

Here's a photo of a CCCS certified coin. The company was set up by a Canadian coin dealer.

satootoko

<< <i>Here's a photo of a CCCS certified coin. The company was set up by a Canadian coin dealer.

>>

Is that PVC?

ajaan

I believe it is the same set up as the ICCS holders - inert inner flip inside a PVC flip.

farthing

Great show report!

I'm jealous over the Canadian tokens you were able to see and hold

Askari

Thanks -- a great report! I'm glad you were able to find some nice additions for your collection in the short time you had!