POLL: Is it time for PCGS to stop grading at shows?
rlawsha
Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭
Is it time for PCGS to stop grading at shows? Should they keep the graders at work back in the office and let them catch up on the severe backlog of submissions?
0
Comments
<< <i>They've done it for over 10 years. I'd say it hasn't affected their long term health. >>
Just because they have done it for 10 years does not mean it isn't hurting them. I bet they would be an even bigger company by now if the submission mess were straightened out a little.
Obviously you posted this with an answer in your own head that you want group agreement on to bolster your own opinion.
That is evident by the way you are replying to people (and it isn't just someone playing "devil's advocate".
PCGS would be doing themselves and their shareholders a large disservice to stop grading at shows....NGC isn't likely to stop that practice, and, doesn't ANACS do it as well (I honestly don't know...haven't been to a major show).
How much backlog, from grading at a major show, is there really? 3 days? 4? Per month?
It has already been stated, ad naseum, that the best thing PCGS could do would be to hire more graders (competent and not just someone off the street). What you are wanting (end show grading) is short term...not long term.
So, as long as they run a successful business, they need to do what they are doing. If it is impacting them more negatively than it benefits them, they will likely change. Fees are only 1 part of "success" from show grading. There is also "good will" and "face time". They likely don't make up in show fees the amount it costs them to send, feed, hotel all the people that go. Maybe they do...maybe they don't, but I wouldn't be surprised if they don't make it up all the time.
However, since I am on THIS side of the fence (ie....PCGS is not MY business to run), then I won't venture to tell them how to run their business. But, if I feel I am negatively impacted, I will make my statement(s) then I will vote with my money however it best serves me (staying with them may serve me better even if I am not too happy, or, I may move to more NGC, etc).
If your purpose in submitting to PCGS is for resale, then, calculate how much the delay in your submission (or the extra costs to get it sooner) is costing you compared to resale in NGC plastic. If you are doing it for money, then you are running your own little business. If you are running your own little business, then you should be able to answer the question of whether the wait+PCGS plastic is better for your bottom line and acceptable or not.
If not, move on.
If it is, and you are just wanting to not wait so your money is not tied up....well, you are likely to be suffering for quite awhile.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I know the poll has only been up a short time but so far only 22% of the people want to keep show grading. >>
Ah, the flexibility of the use of statistics. You forgot to note that 32% don't care which can easily be construed as keep the grading. Only 42% have said get rid of it. That's a minority.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>I know the poll has only been up a short time but so far only 22% of the people want to keep show grading. >>
Ah, the flexibility of the use of statistics. You forgot to note that 32% don't care which can easily be construed as keep the grading. Only 42% have said get rid of it. That's a minority.
Russ, NCNE >>
Good point, I knew that would come back to haunt me. I guess if we throw out the I DON'T CARES then it is currently 7 for grading and 13 against. Still almost a 2 to 1 in favor of dropping the grading at shows. Who said math isn't fun?
from what i hear most dealers scream bloody murder at shows after getting their grades from pcgs..especially at 100 bucks a pop
<< <i>from what i hear most dealers scream bloody murder at shows after getting their grades from pcgs.. >>
Hehe, good point. We only hear from the whiners, though.
Russ, NCNE
Or,
send less graders to the shows when the backlog is pretty heavy.
I have only sent in 1 group of my 4 "free" grades and, while I would like to have more of my collection protected by the slabbing, which also offers better liquidity if needed, I don't think it is timely enough, cost effective enough, nor worth my effort to do it via mail.
If I lived closer to them or went to major shows and could just drop them off, then I would likely feel differently.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
You do your best business on Main St.
At shows there are a lot of coins and a lot of people who want PCGS's opinion right there and now, and are willing to pay for it.
There is the old saying ...
We do three kinds of jobs: Good, Fast and Cheap. You can have any two
A Good and Fast job won't be cheap
A Fast and Cheap job won't be good
And a Good and Cheap job won't be fast
People who want a discounted rate for the service just have to wait.
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
<< <i>Grading should be a highly controlled process so that there is consistancy. Taking it out on the road with a circus atmosphere reduces the controls and explains why many use the shows in getting a higher percentage of their submitted coins upgraded. I think consistancy of grading should be the most important factor for any TPG company's longterm business plan. For shortterm business...sure...step right up...crack em out...free popcorn
I agree totally on the circus atmosphere. It kind of takes away the image of 3 graders locked away in a room, isolated from the submitter to guarantee impartiality. I wonder how many deals have been brokered in the friendly confines of a nearby bar. While I realize this happens all the time in business it kind of makes you take a little less faith in the grade on a PCGS coin, especially the very high dollar ones. Don't get me wrong. I use PCGS 99% of the time for my submissions and I will not change that, I like PCGS. What I don't like is simply the somewhat misleading claim of a 15 day submission that really isn't 15 days, that's all.
Jerry
CG
<< <i>PCGS's business will succeed based upon submissions from dealers not chat board members. >>
True, but now they have one less dealer to help pay the bills.
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
<< <i>Your poll is meaningless because it is garnering votes from little pisher collectors who submit a trifling number of coins each year. PCGS's business will succeed based upon submissions from dealers not chat board members.
CG >>
Do you think you could be any more demeaning in your post? What a nasty thing to say. If the poll is meaningless to you then don't vote and move on to another thread where you can discuss million dollar deals. Some of us here actually collect coins as a hobby and enjoy this board. Maybe PCGS needs a BIG DEALER ONLY forum where people like you can go smoke cigars and laugh about the little hobbyists like us.
Sorry if you were offended--that was certainly not my intent. I am just another littel pisher collector too. I do not expect PCGS to alter its business to suit me or to base its business decisions on what I say here. Forum members spend a lot of time here moaning and groaning but it does not make for a useful forum or a pleasant experience. I think we would all do better to take some the bad with the good when dealing with the grading services, understanding that they are not perfect but that the benefits provided to collectors in the aggregate outweigh the shortcomings.
Consider this. When have you ever seen a post that said, "I bought some conis that were in a PCGS/NGC/ANACS holder and this time I did not get burned like when I bought raw coins."
CG
Something has to give. I voted "Drop show grading". Let the dealers scream, they can still use the Walkthrough service.
Edited to correct typos.
Free Trial
Jerry
However, I believe it is important from a bussiness
stand-point for PCGS to make is presence known
at shows. P.R. is a necessary element to any bussiness.
Camelot
support the other. It seems their only choice is between a location change to lower overhead/employee costs; or to make economy
grading non-economic for the lower value coins. Basically as a stockholder I would like to see a second business location in
a state with favorable tax treatment/ lower overhead where the lower level submissions are mailed for grading by more emplyees at greater speed.
<< <i>Is it time for PCGS to stop grading at shows? Should they keep the graders at work back in the office and let them catch up on the severe backlog of submissions? >>
Handcuff them to the grading tables and don't let em out until they are done.
They can go to shows when economy is 14 days turnaround.
Please check out my eBay auctions!
My WLH Short Set Registry Collection
I thought not.
The backlog isn't unique to PCGS. NGC lists the modern turn-around at an estimated 12 days. I have an invoice that arrived there 12/13 that hasn't been scheduled for grading yet. It'll likely finish at around 30 days. My last modern to PCGS turned-around in 30 days. I figure PCGS will do away with the guaranty on all but the expensive tiers. It's likely what they SHOULD do. It'll eliminate lots of aggrevation for them and the submitters. NGC has been running a banner post on the message board asking for modern grader resumes for several months. My guess is that PCGS would hire a good candidate as well. I don't think either service can keep up with the growing demand. PCGS has increased fees and minimum coins per order. If NGC follows suit, there'll be more increases in the future. It is a tipping point. IMO PCGS's strategy in lieu of addressing demand with grading staff is to accomodate the highest fee submitters. NGC's strategy seems to be accomodating the collector by maintaining lower fees and not offering a guaranteed turn-around time. We'll see which strategy prevails. If nothing changes, NGC will gain marketshare, and PCGS will see fewer but more expensive coins. I'll happily buy coins in either holder, and will submit coins based on which service makes the most business sense, but I won't be in too much of a hurry to get my coins back at either service in the short-term. It's hard to complain when fees are low and they're trying to hire graders. If either service solved the problem quickly, it would be a solution none of us would like.
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
K S
as other first page respondents noted, your bias prevents acceptance of differing opinions and the poll seems to demonstrate that keeping show grading isn't necessary a bothersome thing to most of us. remember, economy service is almost 50% discounted, why would you expect PCGS to place a priority on getting those submissions done?? open your wallet and shorten your wait, it's really that simple. unless you just like to blame someone else for the angst over your choice of being a victim. the other options are to quit submitting to PCGS and remove the source of the "whine" or buy already holdered PCGS coins.
things are generally simpler than we make them out to be.
al h.
<< <i>couldn't possibly care less. show or not, i've never submitted a coin to pcgs, & doubt i ever will.
K S >>
Why are you here???
<< <i><< couldn't possibly care less. show or not, i've never submitted a coin to pcgs, & doubt i ever will. K S
Why are you here??? >> >>
what does it matter???
K S
<< <i>Why are you here??? >>
For the same reason I am, because he likes COINS. We don't care about slabs and the services opinions. 've never submitted, never bought a slabbed coin and never will. Personally it wouldn't matter to me if the services folded tomorrow except for the fact that the forum here where we discuss coins would also fold. But I'm on other forums that aren't dependant on the grading services and they would probably get busier, so it probably wouldn't matter that much anyway. The reason I'm here is for the same reason people use eBay. There are other places they could do the same thing, but they go to where most of the action is.
Just a couple of my own thoughts.
Maybe bring bare minimum graders and only offer the super expensive "instant" grading for the dealer crack-out doctors.
Or, stop grading all together and just take submissions. At least with that you can save on the postage to send them to PCGS.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
Please don't mistake me as a fan of PCGS customer service -- far from it! -- and take this comment in that context: unfortunately, those who are quick to construe the demise of PCGS due to lack of customer service will (likely) only jump ship when it doesn't affect their pocket. That's the problem in this industry -- there isn't another coin grading service that commands top $$ for coins in their holders. We (including myself) talk about NGC as an alternative but I wouldn't take my coin and put it into an equal grade NGC slab and loose 1/2 my coin's value -- my principals don't run that deep
It's the Microsoft concept -- how many people have been singing the demise of Microsoft, and for how long?? Yet in certain segments their market share still continues to grow -- hard to believe you can grow market share when you already own so much of it.
So the above is the long answer -- the short answer is "Yes," continue grading at shows...makes all of our PCGS slabbed coins more valuable
<< <i>It's a cash cow. Until they loose money on it, it will continue...... >>
I don't know, is it? Think of the business travel expenses, hotels, meals, flight, the security cost, the show booth costs, etc. It has to cost easily in the tens of thousands. I don't think HRH eats at Denny's. I don't know how many coins they have to grade just to cover the expense and I don't know how many they grade. It certainly is not creating good will with the submission business.
They grade a LOT of coins at a show, and seem to even have difficulty keeping up with the demand at $100 a pop. And for those in a big hurry, they offer a $200 show grade option.