Interesting grading results

Boopotts

Just got my grades for a seemingly ancient submission (4111041, zip 48198). Not much of interest, except for the two '85 Donruss Clemens'-- one of which rated a '5' (and no, I have no idea) and the other came back counterfeit. What makes this so peculiar is that both were cracked out of BGS holders; one from an 8.5, and one from a 9.

Has anyone ever heard of counterfeit '85 Donruss??

KallMaloneSay

Not counterfeits, but I once did send in three Clemens 85 Donruss straight out of factory sets and one came back a 9 while the other two were deemed "evidence of trimming". I've heard that they come out short from factory sets, but two of the three trimmed? Man, you're bringing up some sour grapes from the past that I'd prefer to forget.

DirtyHarry

I am still learning here, but your unfornunate experience may be a good example of why one may want to use the "crossover" service rather than cracking cards out. Regards.

goodriddance189

there were suspected counterfeits in 85 D back in the late 80s, notably Eric Davis, Clemens, and the Seaver card (cant remember it its the ERR or COR version, whichever one is worth more)

Boopotts

Also, there were a couple of other crackouts on this invoice, so I'll list them here in case anyone's interested.

1983 Topps Gwynn; BGS 8.5 to PSA 8
1987 Fleer Bonds; 2 BGS 8.5, both PSA 8. One SGC 92, PSA 9
1990 Leaf Sosa; PSA 9 to PSA 9
1993 SP Jeter; BGS 8.5 to PSA 8

All the BGS 8.5's had high subgrades (e.g., 9,9, 8.5,8, etc.), but it didn't surprise me that they came back 8's as they weren't very attractive cards. I'm curious to see how badly the graders at PSA butchered the Clemens in the 5 holder, since it looked fine when I sent it in. I know nothing about counterfeited '85 Donruss, but I'm inclined to take PSA's word for this over that of the clowns at BGS.

Boopotts

DirtyHarry-

Always-- I repeat, always-- crack and resubmit. Cracking BGS holders is hit and miss, since sometimes they come back trimmed, but I've never cracked a card out of a PSA slab that didn't at least come back graded. As most people here will tell you, it's almost impossible to get an upgrade on the crossover service.

Stone193

Boopotts
Although of no help to you but for added interest, the 84FU Clemens had a lot of reported counterfeits due to the popularity of the set in the early 90's and of course hi $ value.
Mike

qualitycards

<< <i>1990 Leaf Sosa; PSA 9 to PSA 9 >>


BOOPOTTS - Were you expecting a 10? ...jay

DirtyHarry

Boopoots - thanks for the insight. As I qualified by "I'm still learning here" - I have just learned something else.

Boopotts

Jay-

It was a very nice 9

srs1a

Boopotts,

I'm not sure that your advice is the best as I have gotten bumps up using the x-over service...and at both SGC and PSA. I've also gotten cards back that I was sure would cross over, but didn't.

I think that there is some bias in the x-over services, but you can still do allright. If you don't like the result, you can still crack and submit....but, my advice would be to try to cross them once and see how you do.

The best one that I've done was a Clemente Rookie BGS (not BVG) 5.0 that crossed to a PSA-6 (It was badly undergraded...Beckett's whacked it with a 4 for edges because of a rough cut). I also had a '67 Banks SGC-86 (7.5) that went to a PSA-8. On the other side of the coin, in the same submission, I had a '58 Banks that was a SGC-84 (7) that I thought was a complete lock for a PSA-7, but didn't cross....go figure.