Sooooooo . . .

Vargha

I guess Joe has answered.

Lothar52

where is your original post??? this is hilarious

loth

34GoudeyCollector

It would be gone, I think!

curmudgeon

Unflippinbelievable. Brace yourself for the deluge of the "It's their board they can do what they want posts", sung in perfect harmony by the faithful.

Ruthfan

PSA customer service at its best.

Howitallbegan

Vargha


What was your over under on how long the thread would last. 24 hours 36 hours. Did it last 24 hours ?

sandlot411

He has spoken..I tell them to speak to you live tommorrow..He is now walking the streets telling the news to his people..Ah I think we are winning the War!

dude

Unflippinbelievable. Brace yourself for the deluge of the "It's their board they can do what they want posts", sung in perfect harmony by the faithful.

Actually, the song is "It's my forum, and I'll delete if I want to" (sung to the Leslie Gore tune of "It's My Party and I'll Cry If I Want To")...

Alright folks, let's all sing along......

"It's my forum, and I'll delete if I want to"
"Delete if I want to, delete if I want to"
"You would delete too if it happened to you"

I have no problem with anyone deleting what is written about them on their board.

Here's an example from across the street: My Post Was 100% Factual

Vargha

It actually lasted much longer than I had thought.

aconte

Vargha,

I think dude is trying to tell you to stick to the facts next time....




I'm kind of surprised that dude made this an Sgc bomb... cough... cough...

aconte

aconte

By the way I would of killed that thread a while ago if I were Psa.... probably yesterday....

So I guess I agree with dude.

aconte

carew4me

Lets not stray here folks....PSA can do as they please with this board.

Its the lack of attention and the failure in Service that actually could effect all of us.

My service has been great (just got two orders back) but I would worry if I had a problem and
had to go to PSA for help.
After all these are smart, intelligent seasoned collectors having real issues.

What would they do for a peon like me!

downgoesfrazier

Carew,
Are we spelling "peon" correctly. I've always wondered what the actual spelling would be. Is it pee-on, peon, peeon, pion, pionne--as in Pionne Warwick...you get the idea.

dgf

schr1st

I think that their lack of any sort of a response other than to delete the thread speaks volumes as to how PSA views customers. "Got a complaint? Good! I don't want to hear it." Sure it's their board, and they can do whatever the hell they please, but that doesn't mean that we have to like it.

If only there was another viable grading option out there...

sixdart

The ignore the issue policy is in full affect.

Howitallbegan

Well on the bright side Buckwheat's Pete Rose thread hasnt been deleted YET

LJB17

pe·on ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pn, pn)
n.

An unskilled laborer or farm worker of Latin America or the southwest United States.
Such a worker bound in servitude to a landlord creditor.
A menial worker; a drudge.
(also pyn) In India and other parts of South and Southeast Asia, a person of menial position, especially a messenger, servant, or foot soldier.

peon

Pe"on, n. [Sp. peon, or Pg. pe?o, one who travels on foot, a foot soldier, a pawn in chess. See Pawn in chess.] 1. A foot soldier; a policeman; also, an office attendant; a messenger. [India]

2. A day laborer; a servant; especially, in some of the Spanish American countries, debtor held by his creditor in a form of qualified servitude, to work out a debt.

3. (Chess) See 2d Pawn.

MY FAVORITE
peon

n. A person with no special (root or wheel)
privileges on a computer system. "I can't create an account on
_foovax_ for you; I'm only a peon there."

thegemmintman

PSA had an easy opportunity here to turn some bad PR into good PR. They should have just come on the board, apologized to David, and tell him that a check for the $170 is on the way. How stupid.

grilloj39

I am starting to come to the opinion that Mr Orlando isn't the smartest person in the world. Talk about an easy fix...a nice slowly throw softball in Mr Orlando's direction and he misses it completely.

dude

aconte -- Just so there is no confusion about my prior post, my only point was that I have no problem with any message board sponsor deleting any negative comments about them - even if they are true. If anything I'm respecting Sean Skeffington's decision to delete that message. Some people have this "how dare they delete my thread" attitude and believe the First Admendment applies to these message boards and it doesn't. I like Vargha a lot and it's a shame he's dissatisfied and I hope things get worked out between him and PSA.

CON40

SA had an easy opportunity here to turn some bad PR into good PR. They should have just come on the board, apologized to David, and tell him that a check for the $170 is on the way. How stupid.

What a remark! How on earth does any of us know if those cards were Mint, NM-MT, or Gem Mint? You all seem to be forgetting that even though PSA tries to standardize the grading industry, it is still a subjective skill. If Vargha had doubts about the cards being Mint in his opinion, he should have passed on them or returned them to the seller for a refund.

I know Vargha was trying to do the right thing and "clean things up", but this is not an exact science. What he sees as less than Mint, may not appear so to someone else. If PSA doles out $170 to him based on his evaluation of their slabbed product, what do they owe me for cards that I own that I believe to be overgraded? Or anyone else who owns one of the 7 million cards that PSA has slabbed?

My 2¢... this is not a mechanized service. There will be goofs from time to time. Lighten up and realize that it is just bleary-eyed guys who are looking at your cards. Not lasers and computers. PSA has no obligation to pay anyone anything here. They should still be ashamed of their response and their customer service -- that's apalling! -- and they should throw Vargha 10 free grades for his troubles, but don't hold them 100% accountable for a skill that cannot be 100% automated! That will only result in disappointment on someone's part.

grilloj39

dude...I think your missing the issue here...of course PSA/SGC has a right to delete any negative thread on their boards without providing a response...but it isn't the best way to handle issue (especially this issue) when a long time supporter of PSA is treated in such a horrible and disrespectful fashion.

The fact that PSA has decided to handle this issue in this manner speaks volumes about the way they wish to conduct business with their most loyal and ardent supporters. PSA supporters deserve better.

koby

<< <i>I am starting to come to the opinion that Mr Orlando isn't the smartest person in the world. Talk about an easy fix...a nice slowly throw softball in Mr Orlando's direction and he misses it completely. >>



Is it necessary to insult someone personally in this fashion?

You must be a very successful in your line of work to be able to criticise decisions made by executives in the market-leader for this industry.

thegemmintman

<< <i>What a remark! How on earth does any of us know if those cards were Mint, NM-MT, or Gem Mint? >>



CON40 - your point is well taken, but you're new around here. Vargha has been here for years, and he knows his cards. He's not someone we never heard of before possibly making up some story. Besides he was already told by a PSA Representative that the cards were incorrectly graded. Then he was given the royal runaround. So really my comment was exactly correct.

grilloj39

koby...I've had positions of responsibility where I have supervised over 200 people. I am not an expert in managing a grading company but I have over 20 years of leadership and management experience and know an easy fix when I see one.

I do not know if Vargha deserves a refund or not, but I do know he deserves a full explanation, followed by an apology...it's called humility, something which the leadership at PSA lacks.

JrMacdaddy

And does that apology or explanation have to be on these message boards for all to read and critique?



<< <i>I do not know if Vargha deserves a refund or not, but I do know he deserves a full explanation, followed by an apology...it's called humility, something which the leadership at PSA lacks >>

grilloj39

No of course not...a private apology would suffice.

koby

Grillo,

Take a look at the thread that Carol started.

David apparently talked to Cassi, the new cusstomer service representative, and was satisfied with Cassi's response. Why aren't you?

Are you just trying to incite controversy on the PSA forums?

Koby

CON40

CON40 - your point is well taken, but you're new around here. Vargha has been here for years, and he knows his cards. He's not someone we never heard of before possibly making up some story. Besides he was already told by a PSA Representative that the cards were incorrectly graded. Then he was given the royal runaround. So really my comment was exactly correct.

I meant no disrespect to Vargha and his knowledge of cards. In my short time on here, I have gleaned that he is a master Jedi.

But, my point concerns the bigger issue here. We want to hold PSA to a consistency of grading standards that is impossible to uphold. Let me make an analogy (my way of understanding the world).

If you go to the doctor for an itch (I won't say where) and he prescribes a cream for it, but it doesn't stop the itch, do you ask for a refund on the cream and expect your follow-up visit to be free? Of course not, because we all know that medicine is an inexact science. You ask the doctor to prescribe something else (usually stronger), and you give that a try with better hopes.

Now, I am not saying that card grading is as critical as medicine, but both come with the expectation of being 100% accurate, but we should all know better because humans are prone to inconsustency and mistakes. If you are expecting more than a human effort from PSA, then you are asking too much. As long as they can detect altered cards and authenticate cards, and if the condition is "reasonable" for the grade number on the flip, should we complain any louder than a small mutter to ourselves?

Now, back to that horrendous, CYA, reactive customer service...

JrMacdaddy

<< <i>As long as they can detect altered cards and authenticate cards, and if the condition is "reasonable" for the grade number on the flip, should we complain any louder than a small mutter to ourselves? >>



Based on the way they describe themselves I would say yes, you should complain. Their marketing tag line isn't "We do an OK job". They're the ones that are setting the bar that high, shouldn't we expect them to follow through? I say yes.



<< <i>Grading cards can be tricky, and a lot of money often rides on determining the right grade. What if you find out your "Mint" Cal Ripken rookie is only "Near Mint" when you go to sell it? Or, that the "Mint" Ted Williams you’re thinking about buying has actually been trimmed? You want to be able to buy cards with the confidence that they are accurately graded -- and that’s where we come in.

We’re the Professional Sports Authenticator (PSA) -- the world’s largest third-party authentication service. No more guesswork or taking the word of one dealer over another. Now you can have your sports cards graded by an unbiased group of the hobby’s most experienced sports card grading experts -- and at the same time be assured that the only interest they have in your cards is to make sure they’re properly graded and carefully preserved. PSA’s permanent grading standard is recognized industry-wide as the best possible form of consumer protection. So when you see a card for sale in a holder displaying the PSA logo, you’ll know you can buy with the confidence that the card has been properly and professionally graded. If you want to verify the grade of a card before you sell, have it graded by PSA and realize its full value without leaving any money on the table. And if it’s safe, long-term storage you’re after, PSA’s tamper-evident card capsule offers the most visually appealing form of safe card storage known. Our protective inert, optical-grade plastic holder will help keep your top athletes in great shape for years to come. >>

NickM

CON - I believe that would make him Darth Vargha.


Nick

grilloj39

koby...the short answer to your question is that if vargha is satisfied, then so am I.

scottsusor

<< <i>... I think your missing the issue here...of course PSA/SGC has a right to delete any negative thread on their boards without providing a response...but it isn't the best way to handle issue... >>


Yeh, there's been an issue missed here, alright. And if we want to talk about the best way to handle an issue, let's start with taking a complaint public before trying to resolve it privately with a phone call to Joe Orlando.

And lest I be accused of "singing in harmony" by some neanderthal, let's look at this for what it is -- PSA dropped the ball -- BUT, that happens a million times a day in a million businesses. What percentage of these types of problems get resolved privately with a simple phone call? Probably about 99% of them.

Businesses don't stay in business by going out of their way to be incompetent and ignoring their customers. Mr. Vargha obviously found one or two "bad apples" -- they are present in every business, and they usually get terminated if "the boss" finds out. What opportunity did Mr. Vargha give Joe Orlando to find out about these "bad apples" before going public on PSA's own board? None. Zip. Zero. Nada. And we should be surprised the thread was deleted. C'mon, get real or get lost.

Scott

CON40

jrMac;

I am being a little lenient with the word "reasonable" but I mean that not every card fits the grade to a "T". Some will be weak for the grade, others strong. That's the call (and the skill) of the grader. I am sure any grader's standards (regardless of company) fluctuate in the course of any given day/week/month... we need to give them a little more slack than this thread seems to want to cut them.

My problem is not with the grading. With 7 million slabs, there are bound to be some misses... but they should never miss with customer service. At the end of the day, that is all they can rest their laurels on... and if they are not striving their best with customer service, eventually it will be their downfall (i.e., be usurped by a superior service grader (gai?), lose credibility as a leader in the field, or worse, fold)...

tripoli

Everyone quit their whining! For all those who hope PSA hires a bunch of CSR's to handhold all your little complaints: GEt over it! I hope if they do any hiring, it's to increase their grading capacity. And you know how easy it is to walk down to your local unemployment office and find all those wannabe sportscard graders looking for work. Enuf already. How about stories on how you began sportscard collecting or that first memory of meeting an athlete who's card you owned? Less about ragging on some poor guy who's probably on vacation with his family.


my .02 CDN

Vargha

Less about ragging on some poor guy who's probably on vacation with his family.

For seven weeks? Heck, I'm going to work for PSA.

JrMacdaddy

CON40, I agree with you 100%.

PSA is at a disadvantage as we hear a lot of the anecdotal evidence that they do a poor job concerning customer service on these message boards. I have yet to send in cards directly as its less of a hassle to go through a dealer that will do it for me. All I can go by is what I read on these boards.

If you have great service you tell 1 person, if you have bad service you tell 100 people.......

UnAmuzd1

<< <i>But, my point concerns the bigger issue here. We want to hold PSA to a consistency of grading standards that is impossible to uphold. >>



Forgive me for snipping your analogy.

The following is taken from the PSA website:

The PSA Financial Guarantee of Grade & Authenticity is fundamental to PSA's concept of third-party grading. The cash-back policy ensures the accuracy of the grade assigned to any PSA-graded card as long as the card remains in its tamper-evident holder.

I think that it's wrong to tell Vargha, or anyone else, that we can't hold PSA to consistency of grading standards when they themselves advertise this guarantee on their website. If it's impossible to uphold, it shouldn't be part of the service they offer. I for one am glad to see that Vargha seems to be getting a response, if belatedly.

If they hadn't made this guarantee, you'd be right - we'd have no reason to hold them to anything. But, there it is: "Ensures the accuracy of the grade assigned." If they advertise it, customers have a right to expect it.

Just Morrie
Collector of Cards