Difference between MS and PR grading. . .

NYCcollector

I notice that on the PCGS website, they explain their grading system, but don't distinguish between MS and PR coins at the higher grades. So, for example, an MS 63 and a PR 63 are both described as "Moderate number/size marks/hairlines, strike may not be full."

Are proof and mint state coins really held to the same standard? Even ho-hum proofs have no bag marks at all and have far fewer hits or hairlines, and much stronger strikes (slower stamping speed, newer dies) than even their most gem-like business strike counterparts. It's hard to imagine a decently preserved proof coin that wouldn't start out darn close to PR 68 ("Virtually as struck with slight imperfections, slightest weakness of strike allowed") -- at least if PCGS really holds proof coins to the same standard as mint state coins.

I have a few common-date MS-66s. They're very nice, but not nearly as nice (objectively speaking) as their proof cousins. So why are there so many PR 66s around? Is the scale really the same?

tradedollarnut

So why are there so many PR 66s around?

Because they were struck for collectors, who predominantly took better care of them than the general public did of circulation strikes.

Russ

NYCcollector,

The main issue that will lower the grade on a proof coin is hairlines. Think of hairlines as the proof equivalent of bagmarks on a business strike. Because they are difficult to detect, the coin will look much nicer than it's business strike counterpart, and yet may be graded only in the PR64, PR65, or PR66 range. Because of improved handling at the mint, this is not so much an issue anymore, but for earlier material, it's a BIG issue.

Let me illustrate with a couple examples:





Those two coins are from the same matched die pair. Both look pretty good, but one grades PR68, while the other grades PR65. The difference is hairlines.

Russ, NCNE

NYCcollector

Thanks, Russ. That visual demonstration is most persuasive.