Could someone summarize EAC grading standards?

dan1ecu

Hi, All -

It is my understanding that the EAC (Early American Copper) grades early coppers much differently than the major grading services. Can anyone summarize their standards? Do you think that they are more correct in the way that they grade than PCGS or NGC? Would you like to see them start a slabbing service of their own?

Dan

dorkkarl

summarize? that would be tough. let me just say that YES, their standards are definitely more correct .... for grading COPPER & EARLY material. however, i do not believe EAC standards would be practical for moderns.

NO, they should not start a slabing svc, because EACers respect the rights of other collectors to have different grading opinions.

K S

HalfCents

I've been a member of EAC for a couple of years now, and I still don't quite understand the process. Sharpness, surfaces and color are all factors, and you end up with a "net" grade which deducts for a variety of problems like excessive marks, porosity, corrosion, rim dings, etc. ANACS (can I say that here?) uses "net" grading that appears, to me anyway, to be very similar to EAC. Seems to be a realistic measure of an obsolete coin's condition.

But, you're right: It wouldn't be real appropriate for moderns.

Donovan

Let me throw a bit of realism into this (some will consider it cyincism). EAC grading is a myth. NO EAC DEALER will grade a coin using EAC standards and sell it at that grade. EAC grading is a tool, like any other subjective tool, used by some to justify buying coins at the lowest possible price.

291fifth

The EAC standard is more strict but it still a matter of opinion, especially when net grading comes into play as it usually does on early copper.

dorkkarl

donovan, that is COMPLETELY UNTRUE.

a coin graded by EAC standards is NOT PRICED BY A MARKET GUIDE. EAC standards require pricing by CQR "copper quotes by robinson", & EVERY EAC dealer i know prices more or less according to that guide.

you CANNOT use a EAC grade, then look up the value in "trends" or "redbook". you MUST use CQR (or 1 of the derivative guides).

please be sure you aren't confusing what price guide gets used in pricing the coins.

K S

291fifth

<< <i>Let me throw a bit of realism into this (some will consider it cyincism). EAC grading is a myth. NO EAC DEALER will grade a coin using EAC standards and sell it at that grade. EAC grading is a tool, like any other subjective tool, used by some to justify buying coins at the lowest possible price. >>



Hmmmm? You mean someone may try to buy at a lower grade than they sell at? I'm shocked and dismayed.
However, Donovan is absolutely correct.

Donovan

<< <i>donovan, that is COMPLETELY UNTRUE.

a coin graded by EAC standards is NOT PRICED BY A MARKET GUIDE. EAC standards require pricing by CQR "copper quotes by robinson", & EVERY EAC dealer i know prices more or less according to that guide.

you CANNOT use a EAC grade, then look up the value in "trends" or "redbook". you MUST use CQR (or 1 of the derivative guides).

please be sure you aren't confusing what price guide gets used in pricing the coins.

K S >>



I understand completely and was taking CQR into account when making that statement so let me clarify. NO EAC dealer will grade a coin using EAC standards and sell it at CQR prices. You are correct, they do price coins using CQR but they aren't EAC graded. If you don't believe me, then make a standing offer to buy all 1804 large cents that are EAC graded at CQR prices. You will get zero replies.

dorkkarl

hold on a second. 1804 large cent??? dude, if you find a properly (market) graded example available at (market) prices, by golly let me know! i'll buy every 1 they got!!! ditto 1799! ditto 93 cap!

the point is, for key coins like that, any price guide is out of date the second it's printed.

i assure you that if you just need a nice, common ole 1852 large-cent in xf, you'll be able to get it reasonably close to cqr OR trends.

put it another way, i'd pay 10% OVER TRENDS right now for any properly graded 1796 db half in f-12.

K S

Donovan

<< <i>hold on a second. 1804 large cent??? dude, if you find a properly (market) graded example available at (market) prices, by golly let me know! i'll buy every 1 they got!!! ditto 1799! ditto 93 cap!

the point is, for key coins like that, any price guide is out of date the second it's printed.

i assure you that if you just need a nice, common ole 1852 large-cent in xf, you'll be able to get it reasonably close to cqr OR trends.

put it another way, i'd pay 10% OVER TRENDS right now for any properly graded 1796 db half in f-12.

K S >>



We weren't talking about trends, we were talking about CQR. Your statement above is exactly what my point is. EAC dealers will not sell EAC graded coins at CQR prices, 1804 or not. Try buying ANY early copper that is EAC graded at CQR prices. You may have a point about the 1852 but only because no one bothers to "EAC grade" common late date copper. The difference between a $10 vg and a $12 fine is meaningless once dealer margins are taken into account. Not so with early copper. Try buying an EAC graded VF 1800 large cent at CQR. EAC dealers will laugh.

dorkkarl

hey donovan, i can't speak for your experience, but i CAN say that i HAVE purchased such coins at ~cqr from eac dealers.

that said, i freely admit that most of my eac-bought coins have come via their auctions, & i also freely admit that, as with market dealers, the choicer material definitely leads pricing trends.

K S

Donovan

<< <i>hey donovan, i can't speak for your experience, but i CAN say that i HAVE purchased such coins at ~cqr from eac dealers.
S >>



EAC graded though?

tjkillian

Wow, we got Dorkarl riled up and it is not about slabs. Cool. What would EAC grade a PCGS Properly graded 1796 D.B. large cent in F-12? What would its value be, assuming problem free?

Tom

Shoedog

You can borrow a video from the ANA library called grading EAC or someting like that.Denis Loring explains EAC grading in depth.I really enjoyed it myself.If you call the library they are very helpful.

Shoedog

and to answer your question,no I would not like to see them start a slabbing service.I like some others don't want to look at my coins thru plastic,It really spoils it for me.I like to hold them in my hand and think about who else might have held them 200 years ago.
Also you can"t see the third side(edge)
I do understand that others might have non-numismatic reasons for preffering slabs.

Baley

Could someone summarize EAC grading standards?

Yes: conservative.

rainbowroosie

Standards are standards....market PRICE is all that matters. Whether the coin says 70 or 40, "price" is what you are negotiating.

nwcs

To be honest, I don't understand the comparison of EAC standards to PCGS standards (for example). They aren't based on the same criteria so of course they won't match! And, what is more, they are simply opinions as are all grade evaluations. The funny thing with all these standards is that everyone is trying to use the same basic scale.

The EAC does have a class at the ANA summer seminar, I believe. And, as another mentioned, the ANA library has materials on grading the EAC way.

Baley

Whether the coin says 70 or 40, "price" is what you are negotiating.

excellent point. Whether you call a coin (let's say, a 1794 cent) a PCGS Fine-12, or an ANACS VF details, corroded net Fine, or an EAC Very Good (scudzy), all that really matters is: how much does it cost?

Conder101

EAC DID have a grading service back in 1985. It didn't last long because for the most part we find that we don't really need one. And as for getting EAC dealers to sell early copper for CQR prices, forget it! Not because we don't follow our grading standards but because early copper has been steadily rising for some time now and the most recent CQR is over four years old. Even the guide "penny Prices" that replaced it is over a year old. I'm sure youknow that in the non-copper market if a series is moving up rapidly that the graysheet can't keep up and you can't buy at graysheet prices either. And it comes out weekly not annually Penny Prices is a GUIDE and a guide only. You still have to factor in how the market is doing and what other items have been selling for recently. Just like in any rising market.

Coin Finder

Let me throw a bit of realism into this (some will consider it cyincism). EAC grading is a myth. NO EAC DEALER will grade a coin using EAC standards and sell it at that grade. EAC grading is a tool, like any other subjective tool, used by some to justify buying coins at the lowest possible price.

Donovan.....amen brother amen!!