New 1909-S VDB but is it red?

Merc

I bought a MS63 1909-S VDB Lincoln cent graded MS63 red by ANACS. It is red, but has toned some. The early Lincolns are not the firey red like the ones in the 1930 or later. The obverse looks red at one angle, but is a purple red when viewed from another angle. The PCGS grading book states a 63 can have more mellowing and still get graded Red. Is this date normally a bit on the dark side? Are they more generous with the grade due to market grading on a rare date?

The coin looks nice and is free from contact marks. It is much redder than the pictures show. It is just hard to get a picture of copper. It just has a few hairlines in the fields. I would have graded it MS64RB. Does ANACS have a grade guaraentee or copper?


Could anyone post their red 1909-S Lincolns to compare? Thanks

goose3

solely from your pics it looks pretty darn nice. The obverse looks RB to me and by no means RD. The reverse looks like it could be RD.

looks nicer than my PCGS MS63RB one tho!

jdimmick

from the photo's:

The coin looks like it has mellowed a little to the rd/brn side a bit on the obv. Reverse looks full red.
However, that is one nice 63, lots of luster, minimal marks, nice fresh look. I think a possible candidate for 64RB at PCGS??

Several of the other services are still holdering coins that to me look more like thier RB, as red. Should be 95% red on both sides according to the publish standards to be called red! Ill let the copper experts comment more on that!

jim

mdwoods

Very nice for a MS63 coin. ANACS is tough on wheaties.

291fifth

Judging from the photos the coin would be called Red-Brown today. Who knows what it would grade at PCGS.
Cracking out copper is a real risk because they just might decide it is AT and body bag it.

Bikingnut

Based on the coin that I posted in the below thread, I definitely think it's got a shot at getting the red designation.

So where's the red?, thread

merz2

IMHO and based on other 1909 Lincolns I have and seen it could get RD from PCGS.Very nice coin !

Merc

Anyone have some nice red 1909-S Lincolns to show?

Shamika

Wow! I'd bust that puppy out and send it to PCGS. It may not be RD but it sure looks a heck of a lot better than MS63!

iras4

I don't believe ANACS has a color guarantee on copper, but it looks like a MS-64 RB to me from the photos. Color appears completely natural. IMHO, it needs to be cracked out and sent to PCGS, as I think you'd get a 64RB out of it. This caveat must be considered, however., There's always the possibility that PCGS will put it in a bodybag with the notation "questionable color."

I had a 1909 VDB DD Obv FS-012 in an ANACS holder graded MS-64 Rd that was indeed a fiery red with only the most minor mellowing. I showed it to David Schweitz, Jack Beymer and others and all said it was conservatively graded & should grade MS-65RD and one guy said shot 66R. Cracked out & submitted and came back in a bodybag with a questionable color notation. Found out that 2 graders graded it MS-65Rd but the finalizer refused to agree, calling the color "questionable."

I needed that coin in a PCGS holder for a customer building a Lincoln Registry Set w/varieties. I should point out that I am an experienced Lincoln Cent specialist & dealer and the color looked like any fresh out of the roll 1909 VDB (not doubled) cents that I've seen.

Just wanted to point out the risks of cracking it out. It's unlikely that PCGS will ever give an upgrade if the coin remains in the present holder, as that would be admitting that they are easier on small cents than ANACS.

Ira

dorkkarl

"RED" for any lincoln from 1909 is quite a different color than for any later years.

K S