Anyone else here not a big fan of slabs

BBN

Granted they help authenticate a coin and you know exactly how good of a coin you get, but especially on Ebay it seems like the plastic case is more expensive than the coin. Anyone else like me avoid slabbed coins?

DennisH

I'm not a big fan of non-PCGS slabs.

If it wasn't for PCGS and NGC, I doubt that I'd collect coins at all.

Kriek

I concur with Dennis.

mojorizn

I want to hold the coin in my hand (thoroughly washed, of course). My AU58 Buffalo Nickel collection is the result of my unhappiness with my slabbed Buffalo short set.

Sure, MS coins are pretty, but nothing beats a coin in the hand that has actually been used in commerce. In 1913 you could buy a loaf of bread with 2 Buffalos. I want history with my coins!

Mojo

goldrush00013

Whatever makes YOU happy. Thats what counts!

Kriek

Very true.

PutTogether

I buy them in slabs, and break them open minutes after i get them home.

JrGMan2004

I like slabs... for me, it's an educational tool in itself. It teaches me to grade, and it keeps me from getting my butt burned on a problem coin... I need to learn to spot cleaning... but it is a field I've had little experience in and need more work on... at the moment, if I'm buying raw... I only buy from dealers I trust... and recently, I've only bought 1 raw coin...

haletj

I hate slabs too, but the coins I want are usually in them.

Edited to add: Guess what I bought today?? A full red ms64 RAW 1924-s Lincoln Cent.

mojorizn

Don't get me wrong. Slabs are an invaluable tool if you are new and want to learn how to grade. Once you gain some confidence in your ability to differentiate between grades it becomes easier to purchase coins raw and adds a whole new level to your enjoyment of the hobby.

Mojo

Vet

All I own are raw coins,they were all collected prior to grading companys.But since I joined the forum it seems to me if I need to sell anything it needs to be in a slab in order to expect a fair price.I have pretty much full sets of everything from 1861 to 1978 including most key dates minus a few varities.Am I wrong in my assumption?comments please

ealandg

I find slabs annoying because I like to see my coins all next to each other in albums. I have one of those Eagle slab albums, but they are pretty cheap and get on my nerves because the plastic is cracking.

I am not the best grader, though, so at this juncture I appreciate having someone else's opinion as well.

Also, because I am not too experienced, I definitely need 3rd party authentication for expensive coins or I won't buy them unless they come from a dealer I know well and trust.

mojorizn

Depends on your selling venue. As you can tell from the forums, there is a lot of apprehension at purchasing raw coins from dealers who are not well known. And most members here will not purchase anything off ebay that isn't slabbed.

Mojo

Sphinx357

I'll buy a coin as raw and submit it, but when it comes back I'll sell it. I don't collect plastic, at all. I had one because I got a deal on it so I bought it for the hell of it. I got rid of it at a show for a profit and didn't buy another since. I collect Morgan Dollars, I put them in my Intercept Shield albums. I could care less if it grades an ms blah according to this company and a blah blah according to that company. I've ventured into the paper and asside from Morgans that's what I focus on. The way I see it, slabs are a money making tool.

Aethelred

I am a huge fan of PCGS and believe they, along with NGC have changed the rare coin market very much for the better. Before 1986 collectors were at the mercy of dealers, many of whom were gross overgraders. If you didn't have a fair grader in your area, you were left with no choice but to take your chances with a mail order dealer and buy your coins sight unseen. Thanks to PCGS, NGC and the internet, our hobby is a much better one today that it was twenty years ago!

As an aside, I love nothing more that buying raw coins which I believe have been undergraded and then having them slabbed (and of course selling them).

joecool

I only like PCGS graded coins, but it's nice to look and feel raw coins.....

Libertad

I understand and agree with you BBN. I collect buffalos, and a smattering of anything else that catches my
short attention span.
I've been upgrading the buff sets for 6 or 7 years now, and it's getting hard to find raw material that is of the
grade that I'm looking for, but it can be done yet. The slabbed stuff that I acquire gets busted out when it arrives.

I have a bunch in airtites and cointains, but don't like the rectangularness of the slabs. Sort of rubs the coin
karma the wrong way. If I collected for investment or resale, I think I'd do it differently though.
And if I collected scarcer stuff, I would rethink the plan. Been burned a time or too, but less than I would've without
listening to the Forum folks.

Let the next caretaker slab them if they wanna.

Aethelred

BTW - My personal collection is British coins only, as you might have guessed. I have collected them raw for many years. I am now in the process of having them slabbed because I feel that would make things a bit more simple for my non-numismatic wife in the event of my demise.

Coins101

It is interesting. When I first started collecting (around 1960), I was collecting Lincoln pennies and I was trying to fill in an old Whitman Coin Folder. I would buy rolls and sit for hours going through them, looking to fill in the slots. I would also get silver dollars from the bank and keep trading them in until a got a nice "shinny" one. I never even thought about buying coins. This was not collecting to me. By the way, I was 6 years old then.

As the years went by, I met an old gentleman who ran a Pawn Shop and we spent many a Saturday afternoon looking at and discussing coins. He was the only coin dealer in town. He convinced me it was ok to buy coins for my collect as there were a few I was having a hard time finding. He taught me a lot about grading and the history of each type of coin. At that time, I could tell you the grade of the coin and the current Redbook value. It also seemed there were two or three grades of BU at that time.

Then came the BU60 - 70 scale as well as the various other numbers for the lower value. Then came the slabs. All of a sudden, there were people buying coins sight unseen for investment purposes rather than their beauty and history. Now you have all these people grabbing coins without really knowing anything about them other than hoping to make big bucks by selling them later. They didn't need to know anything about the coin because someone else did the grading. It was just something in the safety deposit box.

Sorry for the long story but I felt I needed to support my position on why I really never liked slabs. I feel they have taken something very import away from the hobby. What use to be a hobby is now big business.

Barry

With few exceptions, the only coins I have in slabs are worth more than $500, unless it's a frequently counterfeited/altered date. Mostly everything else is in albums.

Russellp23

I like the fact of having slabs because you know exactly what you are getting!

foodude

I am a huge fan of PCGS and believe they, along with NGC have changed the rare coin market very much for the better. Before 1986 collectors were at the mercy of dealers, many of whom were gross overgraders. If you didn't have a fair grader in your area, you were left with no choice but to take your chances with a mail order dealer and buy your coins sight unseen. Thanks to PCGS, NGC and the internet, our hobby is a much better one today that it was twenty years ago!


Good summary of what was too commonly found in the past, and the impact on the present.

Vet

I didn't collect my coins with the intention of selling them, but because I like to see them lined up all in a row.By slabing them it breaks up the set.Recently I have had to sell a few for less then I know they are worth and I guess the only way in todays market to obtain a fair price I will have to change my way of thinking. thanks everyone

MSD61

I have to say this just because it's in a slab doesn't make it a great coin. I have seen some bigtime coins in these "super" slabs graded by these "Super" grading services by human eyes and not gods, that I have found just horrible.

nwcs

I like slabs and buy them. I like raw and buy raw. I enjoy the best of both worlds. But, for the foreseeable future, slabs are here to stay.

HalfCents

<< <i>I like the fact of having slabs because you know exactly what you are getting! >>



Not necessarily, IMHO, after having seen obvious 40's to 58's ingloriously encased in plastic and labelled as 62's thru 67's, even everybody's favorite, PCGS.

coins101: RIGHT ON !!!

I have yet to buy a blinkin' slab. The price of plastic seems to grossly inflate the cost of coins.

Tom

BBN

Good points by everyone. Thanks. I know when I'm looking for buffalos I'm looking for a full horn, good date and some good rough terrain on the buff's fur.

MFH

My favorite collection is the Standing Liberty Quarter. I have a choice AU collection in a Dansco album ( alot of slabs were cracked to fill it) and a Choice MS to Gem MS collection, in a mix of NGC & PCGS ( I always buy the coin, not the holder ) ; this MS set in housed in an Eagle Certified Album, and looks really good.

Quite awhile ago Dave Bowers mentioned that he had hoped that the major grading companies would change the size of their holders, make them round, and have the date/grade, etc. imprinted on the edge , so collectors could once again collect the "old fashioned" way, having all the coins lined up in neat little rows. I wish he was heeded back then.

Conder101

As most everyone here knows, I am a strictly anti-slab collector. I have never purchased a slabbed coin and I never will. Unlike some here, I won't even buy a slabbed coin to crack out. As far as I'm concerned if a coin is in a slab it no longer exists. (Don't confuse that position with my searching for slab for my reference collection. In that case the only thing that matters is the slab itself. The coin and the grade and it's accuracy are of no importence whatsoever.)

The early services which did authentication I had no problem with. Authentication is objective, dies can be identified and in almost every case the coin can be shown to be either genuine or false. (In those few cases which are inconclusive they are simply returned as no opinion.) Grading on the other hand especially in the higher grades is very subjective. Yet collectors, especially newbies and the investor types, tend to accept them as gospel. Newbies are told to only buy slabs of the major services until they know how to grade, but the slabs become a crutch and many never learn how, just depending on the slabs to be right. It has been said that slabs have saved us from the terrible practises of the unscrupulous dealers of twenty years ago. But when you buy the coin is either a PQ coin, a lock for the next higher grade etc and the dealer wants a premium price. When you sell, the service made an error, what could they have been thinking, it's a low end coin etc. It's the same thing as twenty years ago. The game is the same, just the language has changed. And since the advent of slabs has greatly increased prices for high grade coins with even one point differences resulting in large differences in value the rip off possibilities are probably even greater today. No, all slabs have done is priced many collectors out of the market for nicer coins and resulted in the unknowledgable getting skinned worse. I'd gladly go back to the days of the early to mid 70's when collectors started out learning grading, making mistakes and learning from them. And when mistakes were made losses were usually smaller.



<< <i>I like the fact of having slabs because you know exactly what you are getting! >>


You forgot the smiley at the end of that.

DeepCoin

Slabs and ebay have forever changed coin collecting. Now the little guy can sell his coins (expensive and cheap) without losing 50% immediately.

I would also say that slabs are not a panacea for all the ills of the hobby, but I feel strongly that many people (including myself) have come back to the hobby. They have stabilized the market and made it more efficient.

Let us not forget ebay, where the little guy can find the other little guy and eliminate the dealer for a reasonable (insert flame here) transaction cost.

What I particularly like are those who come to the PCGS sponsored site to bash them all the time. I am not saying drink the kool aid, but sometimes I wish the totally negative folks would just let it go. (rant now over)

route66

Major dealers can't agree on grading all the time. Mostly MS 50-70. If they can't agree, how can most collectors grade correctly when they only spend x amount of time in their hobby weekly?? Dealers spend 40-60 hours a week. I'll take PCGS slabs anytime. I know I'll be right 95% of the time. And when I go to sell, they'll be other collectors like me who trust PCGS. They don't have an agenda. JMHO. Steve

cladking

I'm not a big fan of slabs as a collector, but I think they've been great for the hobby. As a
collector I have my own opinion of grading and don't particularly care about anyone else's.
I do appreciate them for authenticity since there are many areas that I don't feel competent
to always spot counterfeits and other non-original coins.

But it would seem that slabs have been beneficial to the hobby in a number of ways. The most
important is in reducing the ability of those who would misrepresent coins and their conditions.
Grading has also removed many problem coins and counterfeits which could well have prolifer-
ated over the years. It does give newbies a sense of security in buying even if the source of
this security is often overrated somewhat. The slabs also are fairly effective at preventing coins
from damage.

There is a need for education of newbies about just what grading is and is not, but has this as-
pect really changed so much since the '70's.

Dave99B

Certified grading has eliminated a lot of crooks from this industry - that, in and of itself has made it a net plus for the biz. Has it dummied-down some people’s ability to grade? Yes. Do people still get taken? Yes. Has it driven up prices? Yes. But over all, it has increased liquidity and has given the business some much-needed credibility.

As a side, note, I always chuckle when I see people say, "I'll only buy PCGS material", or "I only buy raw". If you're truly "buying the coin", what's the difference?

Learn how to grade and you'll expand your horizons (and your enjoyment).

Dave

UncleJoe

Slabs have their place.

I think the most important is to certify the coin as genuine.

The next most important IMO is for MS grades. While I know many might argue that there are plenty of misgraded MS coins it is sure better than all the MS-63's or AU-58's that were once sold as MS-65's.

Joe.

errormaven

Speaking only from personal experience, I find that, regardless of the company involved, the application of the 70-point Sheldon scale is irreproducible, subjective, arbitrary, and capricious. In other words, it's a complete crapshoot as to whether a coin is grossly undergraded, grossly overgraded, or graded just about right. I give slabbed coins just as much scrutiny as raw coins, and never pay more just because the coin is entombed in plastic. In fact, I regard plastic as a drawback because it prevents you from inspecting the coin's edge, weighing it, testing its ring, and testing its specific gravity. I almost always crack my coins out as soon as they arrive.

Dave99B

Errormaven, you have hit the nail on the head, even though I'm not sure what "capricious" means!

Amen, brother...

Dave

meos1

Slabbing has a place. I personnaly collect in the original mint packaging so a slab does not fit into my patterns of collecting. If the coin is rare, often counterfitted, or requires attributtion such as RPM or VAM slabbing is a good route. Otherwise, the coin collecting hobby has survived for quiet awhile before slabs came on the scene. I do seek a slabbed coin for 2.50 indians, a buffalo D/D/D/S. I don't look to have the finest registry set.

Dan

1956Quarter

That would be me. I hate SLABS. I have never ever seen a slab with the correct grade on the tab, they are always way too high for the coin inside. This in turn only justifies selling at a higher price for which the coin does not deserve. I don't care who the company was, they are all the same, never right. Some are worse than others.

WaterSport

Put any collection in a Capital Board and I am a happy person..You can see the whole darn collection and don't have to pull boxes out and look at each slab, etc. You can see your collection in one beautiful, organized handsome display. The only reason I was "forced" to go slabs was when I started trying to buy high grade stuff before 1930 (Lincoln cents) We are talkng serious money and I had to be reassurred what I was getting was not messed with. Now, I find them good for those odd ball stuff like varieties. But grading is still crazy. Like someone earlier said, I started collecting when a BU coin was just that, Brilliantly Uncirculated, as in new and shiney and untouched from the mint, and everything else WAS NOT. As far as the graders go, its still a crap shoot or we would not keepicracking and resubmitting. Even the quality critics of the differant garding services have a far narrower arguement since anyone here can produce a NGC or PCGS overgraded coin. For me, it will come down to one day I may decide to crack open those 90 Lincolns and stick them in that capital board, just so I can enjoy the bigger plastic they are enacsed in at one time.

WS

IrishMike

99.99% of my collection is raw. When somebody has asked me in the past who the grading company is on a coin I own, I usually have to go look to be sure. Two weeks ago I was at a show, looked at some nice coins in slabs, but couldn't tell you whose slab they were in. Do I hate slabs, no and are they a good thing for the hobby, is some cases yes.

Edited to add: Do I care if others like, dislike, or could care less about slabs, the answer is no, quite frankly it's their business.

jom

From the "physical" standpoint I hate them. Coins look much nicer in some sort of holder where they can be seen together such as captial plastic or albums.

From the authenticity standpoint this is where the "slab" gets it's BEST use, by far.

From a grading standpoint it helps in setting an APPROXIMATE value for the coin. I believe that collectors and dealers ABUSE this in a lot of ways but TPGing has done more good than harm overall for the hobby.

jom

Coppernicus

I trust the slabs from the big three for: 1) protection - I am clumsy when holding small objects! 2) authentication, especially the rareities 3) decent grading standards - not perfect, but decent.

I still buy raw but only when I can have the coin in hand. Buying raw, sight-unseen is a total crapshoot. Even with a liberal return policy, who needs the hassle? If I buy a MS65 Lincoln wheat in a PCGS, NGC, or ANACS holder, at least I am somewhat assured of getting a decent coin. Again, this is not to say the coin may not truly be a 64 or a low-end 65, but at least it's in the ballpark of what I expected.

Ideally, all purchases should be "in-hand" but that's not always possible. The slabs give more people the opportunity to buy reasonably graded coins than if the TPGs did not exist. I think the TPGs have had a poisitive impact on the hobby, overall.

Mike

tgilliams

I'd have to personally inspect your unslabbed coins, that makes it more difficult to sell and always less than coin is worth. I like raw coins, but I'm not a grader and want some liquidity in my collection. Raw takes away most liquidity.

nwcs

One other thought. Grading is ultimately an opinion. Consistency is the only real thing to look for. And I would bet that PCGS and NGC are far more consistent across more series than most of us could ever hope to be. In addition, they do not have the same level of vested interest that produces the attitude that coins not in my possession are to be graded to a stricter standard than those in my possession.

vega1

Wow, I am surprised to see so many "anti-slab" views on a forum run by a company that slabs coins.

I'm going to go out on a limb here, I love slabs. As a matter of fact, I won't buy a coin raw unless its under $20 or directly from the mint. I am relatively new to the hobby, I started collecting in 1998, and when I started I did not know very much, a mercury dime in change sparked the interest. I had some very bad experiences with dealers early on, and the one of the first coins I bought was from the HSN You live and learn. I stopped dealing with those people and organizations, and since then I have read everything I can get my hands on, poured over the internet for info, go to coin shows, and spent every spare cent I have on this passion. I am much more knowledgable then I was, and now I have a pretty good US type set going of around 40 coins, some dated as early as 1807. I have some keys and some early proofs, and every single one of them is slabbed (ANACS, NGC, and PCGS) and I enjoy the hell out of my collection. For me, I need them to be slabbed. It brings me peace of mind and increases my enjoyment. I buy the coin, and I'm able to let my 3 year old daughter look at a coin like my 1926-s buffalo nickel, not something I might be willing to do if it were raw

I LOVE slabs.