Question for AH Kennedy experts

Mark

To all AH Kennedy experts: (should I have written "expert"? ... )

I was just reading about Kennedy halves in the November 2003 issue of Coinage and three paragraphs in the story stood out:


"Initial impressions were favorable to the portraiture, ... but [Treasury Secretary Douglas] Dillon wanted Mrs. Kennedy's approval. A meeting was set for Dec. 17. ...

[Gilroy] Roberts later wrote that Mrs. Kennedy asked for changes to the late president's hair, which Roberts said could be accomplished in the short time remaining. Back he went to Philadelphia, where he made 'the part in the hair on the portrait ... less pronounced ... and more accents were added.'

Within 10 days, Roberts was en route to West Palm Beach, Florida with the final trial strike, which Jacqueline Kennedy approved on Dec 27, 1963-all before the legislation authorizing the coin had been enacted into law."


I presume that the second paragraph is talking about the AH Kennedy design. But that paragraph and the next seem to imply that the design with the accented hair was changed immediately after the Dec 17 meeting and the die with the less accented hair was approved by Mrs. Kennedy on Dec 27.

If my reading is correct, this story raises a question: How were the AH Kennedy halves struck? After all, presumably the design without the accented hair, which was approved by Mrs. Kennedy, is the design that would have been hubbed and then used for MS and proof strikings?

Thanks in advance for comments from all.

Mark

Russ

<< <i>I presume that the second paragraph is talking about the AH Kennedy design. >>



The second paragraph could not be talking about the Accented Hair, since it refers to the retooling done after Jackie's objections. Thus, it would be ODV-002. The Accented Hair is ODV-001. Apparently, the author is either confused or is referring to some other "accents" in the design.



<< <i>If my reading is correct, this story raises a question: How were the AH Kennedy halves struck? >>



From what I understand, some dies had already been produced with the initial design. In the compressed time frame and confusion surrounding production, some coins were struck with these dies.

Russ, NCNE

DHeath

They're quoting Breen, and I always thought the timeline was wrong. The first production dies were AH. There is the possibility that those coins had already been struck prior to the meeting with Mrs.Kennedy. The prep time for the production of the coin was extremely short. JMO

BTW - No one has yet explained the existence of the 64 specimen coins either.

Mark

Russ:

I knew (almost surely from your posts! ) that Mrs. Kennedy disapproved of the accent in JFK's hair and as a result the accent was reduced. But I always presumed that Mrs. Kennedy's disapproval was made after the first batch of JFK halves were struck. But the Coinage article asserts that Mrs. Kennedy expressed disapproval on Dec 17, presumably before any JFK halves were struck. Did Mrs. Kennedy express disapproval twice, once on Dec 17 and once after the first batch of halves was struck? Or is the article confused?

The article is by David Ganz and while he has many good attributes, in my mind he is not a world-class numismatic investigator. So I wouldn't be totally shocked if the article isn't totally correct. But I presume that Ganz had the date of the meeting with Mrs. Kennedy, Dec 17, correct. I also presume that Ganz is correct that Mrs. Kennedy made suggestions (= orders) at the meeting.

Mark

Russ

Mark,

It wouldn't surprise me to find that coins had already been struck and were in fact being struck up to and after the meeting with Mrs. Kennedy. Things were absolutely crazy at the time as it had only been a month since his death, and they were operating at an extremely accelerated pace. It's not unheard of for mint personnel to do their own thing behind the scenes without regard for normal channels of approval.

It's also possible that no coins had already been struck, but that some dies had been produced and production staff was not made aware that they were not to be used until after some coins had been produced.

In any event, there is a definitive work about the coin - based on better than a decade of detailed research and reams of documents - that is either nearing completion or already done. It was originally to be published late last year, but has been delayed. I am REALLY looking forward to it.

Russ, NCNE

DHeath

Here is Breen's timeline.

Nov 25th, 1963 Mint director Eva Adams called Chief Engraver Gilroy Roberts to tell him the Treasury proposed to place Kennedy on one of our coins.

Dec 10th, 1963 Pres.Johnson issues press release recommending passage of the bill.

Dec 13th, 1963 Roberts completed the first trial dies and made the first impressions for delivery to Ms.Adams.

Dec 15th, 1963 Gilroy summoned to Washington, and asked to bring trial impressions to show Douglas Dillon (Treasury Secretary) and others

Dec 17th, 1963 Meeting for approval with Mrs.Kennedy and Robert Kennedy to OK design

Dec 27th, 1963 Gilroy flew to West Palm Beach to show Mrs.Kennedy the second design, and she approved.

Dec 30th, 1963 Pres.Johnson signed the bill.

Jan 2nd,1964 Proof dies were delivered and the first press run began.


Breen placed the estimate at 50-60 obverse dies that were used in striking the AH coins, so it would seem the mint began preparing dies well before the second design was suggested or approved.

Russ

Don,

I recall hearing that Breen put the production estimate at 1% to 3% of total coins produced, or 40,000 to 120,000 pieces. Is that correct? If so, based on my own experience hunting the coin combined with population reports, I believe he was a bit on the low side. I'd estimate more like 5%, or approximately 200,000 pieces.

Russ, NCNE

DHeath

Russ, that would mean approx. 100 obverse dies. I think that's plausible. I originally thought it likely that the trial strikes Gilroy took to Washington were the specimen coins, but the specimen coins aren't AH. There remains the possibility that the second group carried to Florida were regular blanks struck with the proof dies. I haven't gotten to examine the reverse of one in hand yet, but the pictures I have seem to indicate the broken ray reverse.