With No SCD, Who Will Grade Star Basketball Now?

shagrotn77 · February 18, 2004 4:32AM

I confirmed with SCD that they are no longer grading cards. I'm wondering if their Star Basketball experts will be grading for someone else now. Has anyone heard anything?

TheCARDKid · February 18, 2004 6:34AM

SCD homepage

I wonder if PSA has ever considered regrading Star cards. Maybe they think there is still too much uncertainty surrounding them (even with Crosner and Taft as experts). It'd be cool to see them grade the 5x7's as well.

goodriddance189 · February 18, 2004 6:36AM

the second wave of "counterfeits" werent counterfeits per se, but they were "discovered" as uncut sheets in the 1990s by president Bob Levin. whether or not this story is true is up for debate. some believe that they were just reprinted using the same printing plates and paper.

it is impossible to tell which are originals and which came from uncut sheets.

Lothar52 · February 18, 2004 7:30AM

i dont see anything on there page stating they dont grade cards anymore...where did u learn this??

loth

mikeschmidt · February 18, 2004 7:40AM

PSA does grade Star baseball...

koby · February 18, 2004 7:46AM

The website is still ok. Where did you hear this? If it is true, that is too bad. It is unfortunate that a legitimate company like SCD has to fold, while companies like PRO, USA, ASA, CTA, Mint, GEM etc are still grading cards.

shagrotn77 · February 18, 2004 10:11AM

No, we are not grading anymore.
thank you

-----Original Message-----
From: ShagRotn77@aol.com [mailto:ShagRotn77@aol.com]
Posted At: Monday, February 16, 2004 9:59 AM
Posted To: SCDA General
Conversation: Card Grading
Subject: Card Grading

Does SCD still grade cards? I have some Star basketball cards I'd like to get graded, but I've heard SCD does not grade cards any more.

Lothar52 · February 18, 2004 1:00PM

haha...anybody got a SDC set? Know of anybody who was collecting there cards?? i have ONE ...OVERGRADED 78 schmidt....i only had to buy one card to know its either PSA or SGC for my collecting

loth

lamar · February 18, 2004 10:41PM

goodriddance189,

The differences between the original Star cards and the stuff printed after by Levin are fairly easy to spot. It's been written about several times on these boards. I've collected Star for a long time and can spot the fakes pretty easily so to claim there's no difference without knowing much about the situation is weak. Is a completely uniformed opinion still an opinion?

mcastaldi · February 19, 2004 1:03AM

With SCDA gone, who will grade Larry Fritsch's mountains of mid-grade stuff?
How will he get comped advertising in SCD without being able to hawk SCD's grading service for them?

Mike

goodriddance189 · February 19, 2004 1:34AM

<< <i>goodriddance189,

The differences between the original Star cards and the stuff printed after by Levin are fairly easy to spot. It's been written about several times on these boards. I've collected Star for a long time and can spot the fakes pretty easily so to claim there's no difference without knowing much about the situation is weak. Is a completely uniformed opinion still an opinion? >>

don't get on my case, i was quoting verbatim from a 1996 card mag interview with Levin himself

wallst32 · February 19, 2004 4:41AM

It's a shame the 83-86 Star cards aren't more widely accepted in the hobby. I've always been a big fan of them since they offer the true rookie cards of many of the stars I watched growing up, and of course because they are really the only true regular issue modern scarcities in my opinion (I don't count #'ed cards since their scarcity is fabricated).

From what I know, it was known exactly which cards were "discovered" at a later date. This included half of the 86 regular set, a bunch of the smaller subsets, and a few unknown issues (this probably caused the most suspicion). Because of this finding, there was speculation that other cards/years could also have been reprinted (such as the 84s and 85s) as the value of the cards soared. As someone else mentioned, I would agree that there is a discernable difference between the original and "newer" cards. Any rumors that the cards were mass produced at a later date don't seem reasonable; take a look around, how many do you see?

I think part of the reason why they aren't graded is due to the quality (or lack of). Some of the key cards such as Jordan and Barkley are almost always cut well shorter than standard length. This makes it difficult to detect trimming for one thing. Also, if a card was cut shorter from any other set, would it be graded? If not, then should a company make an exception for a set that is known for quality problems? I would say no, unless the card is clearly qualified as a miscut (SCD does not downgrade for miscuts on Star).

I've always been puzzled as to why Beckett continues to recognize and price the cards, but won't grade them.

goodriddance189 · February 19, 2004 4:56AM

quoted from Collectors Sportslook, March '94-

The Rumor: Star Company cards have been reprinted
The Verdict: False.
The Skinny: a popular rumor is that the Star Co. went back to press and created new "old" sets, namely the 1986 Best of the Best and Magic Johnson player sets. i more likely version is that these sets have been around as uncut sheets since 1986.
according to legend, Levin went broke in 1986- he had solicited for and produced these two sets, but never distributed them. Levin, who denied ever going broke, said he kept the sheets for 5 years before selling them to Shonco Sports, a longtime Star distributor.
"i had them wrapped in quantities of 100-125 in brown butcher paper, same old yellow tape and everything," Levin says. "it was all original from 1986. Shonco new the value of an unreleased product, and bought them"
Shonco then sold the sheets and cut sets to hobbyists. terms of Levin's sale to Shonco are "private," Levin says, "a figure" i want to keep between the two of us."
according to basketball card dealer Don Quan of RTS Sports, the sets from the sheets were "laser-cut, so they were the best of all Star Company sets. they're also te only Star sets not to come bagged."

so there, Lamar, my opinion isn't completely "uninformed" as you state, considering the source came from Levin himself.

Kid4hof03 · February 19, 2004 6:07AM

But it is 10 years old and there has been much more information presented since. The Star cards are great, but they are so tough to authenticate. This is obvious because the most legitimate of the grading companies won't grade them. There are experts that are well-informed and trusted in the process of authentication. I would rely on their information more than the sum opinion of collectors that don't really specialize in the sets.

lamar · February 19, 2004 11:27PM

Well thank God you've got quotes from Levin in 1986. Hey, did you know that the NBA sued him for reprinting all this stuff in 1997? That's a year after the crook got sued. He reprinted all this stuff in the late 80s/early 90s and then tried to pass it off as warehouse finds. That's what he got sued for. For future use, the criminal usually does deny any wrongdoing right up until they get convicted for the offense.

lamar · February 19, 2004 11:31PM

I did mean 11 years after. The reason psa doesn't grade these is they started grading the fakes because the market information wasn't there initially and then got scared off, stopped grading them and pulled them from the pop report like they never existed. I've seen fakes in psa cases.

goodriddance189 · February 20, 2004 12:01AM

find me some evidence that Levin reprinted Star cards, or shut up.

mexisar · February 20, 2004 12:05AM

hey Lamar,

what is one way to tell if they are faked?
is it the color?
are all the fakes centered?

thanks

mexisar · February 20, 2004 12:10AM

hey goodriddance189,

did a search on the subject and found this about what Lamar is talking about
http://smsportscards.american-data.net/dimple/infopresstest2.html

stuff the article says

"In conducting the seizure on July 9, the U.S. Marshals recovered more than 125,000 Star basketball trading cards, some in uncut sheets. "

"The Star basketball trading cards alleged to be counterfeit include the following sets: 1985 Miller All-Star Set, 1985 Chicago Bulls Arena Set, 1986 Chicago Bulls Arena Set, 1986 Crunch 'n' Munch Set and 1991 Michael Jordan Promotional Sets. In addition, Star International, Inc. is alleged to have reproduced cards purporting to be the legitimate 1991 Chicago Bulls 25th Anniversary Equal Set. The NBA cautions collectors to be careful and aware of counterfeit products when making purchases."

article an scd grading them
http://smsportscards.american-data.net/dimple/infopresstest.html

lamar · February 20, 2004 12:21AM

first, the nba sues levin article: nba sues levin

second, the message board on this discussion already: message board link

hopefully these links work ... i'm not really sure how to do that. so everyone doesn't have to read through all the stuff goodriddance requested, the easiest factor to spot is the original star cards have color bleed around the back edges (if the front border was blue, there will be blue around the edges on the back), while the reprinted ones have no color bleed. The original ones are also bigger than standard size, while the reprints are perfect 2 1/2 x 3 1/2.

JESSEJAMES · February 20, 2004 1:02AM

Goodriddance... Have a little respect man! Lamar knows what he is talking about... Real Star cards are very easy to spot. I have been spotting them way before SCD even graded them. When SCD started grading them, I was still buying raw ones off Ebay and getting them graded and made a pretty good chunk of change.

You better just stick to hockey, Red Wings fan.

God Bless.

z2345 · February 20, 2004 1:18AM

<< <i>the easiest factor to spot is the original star cards have color bleed around the back edges (if the front border was blue, there will be blue around the edges on the back), while the reprinted ones have no color bleed. The original ones are also bigger than standard size, while the reprints are perfect 2 1/2 x 3 1/2. >>

This is hogwash.

<< <i> The Star basketball trading cards alleged to be counterfeit include the following sets: 1985 Miller All-Star Set, 1985 Chicago Bulls Arena Set, 1986 Chicago Bulls Arena Set, 1986 Crunch 'n' Munch Set and 1991 Michael Jordan Promotional Sets. >>

This is true.

The sets listed above are easy to distinguish as they look nothing like the cards produced in the 1980s.

JESSEJAMES · February 20, 2004 2:06AM

Z2345,
You can't just write "This is hogwash"... Use some evidence to support your statement, or at least elaborate.

What Lamar wrote about the color bleed is 100 percent correct and I will back him on that one.

lamar · February 20, 2004 3:21AM

What exactly do you people that claim this is all "hogwash" base your opinions on? I give you exact details about the differences and you come back with some moronic statement with no explanation. If you don't know the difference, go post on another topic or stay here and learn a little, don't be ignorant enough to dispute it with no evidence. I know i'm right so I don't need to waste my time if all i'm going to get for responses is "hogwash." The only guy that actually seems to be familiar with Star cards is Jessejames. Nice 'fro by the way.

goodriddance189 · February 20, 2004 5:03AM

<< <i>Goodriddance... Have a little respect man! Lamar knows what he is talking about... Real Star cards are very easy to spot. I have been spotting them way before SCD even graded them. When SCD started grading them, I was still buying raw ones off Ebay and getting them graded and made a pretty good chunk of change.

You better just stick to hockey, Red Wings fan.

God Bless. >>

i was just going on what ive read in various hobby publications over the years, that the Star cards were authentic in terms of being original, but illegally distributed after the fact. every report ive seen gives 3 versions of the Star cards- the original bagged sets of the 80's, the laser cut cards from the "find" in the 90's, and counterfeit cards. i wouldnt have gotten on lamar's case if he wouldnt have gotten on mine after i reported info from reputable hobby mags

With No SCD, Who Will Grade Star Basketball Now?

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