Fake or real Bust half?

Trooper

Just curious any opinions?
Thanks
Tom

PutTogether

need something to look at to express an opinion

lathmach

This is a heavily counterfeited series. I thought this might be good, but looking at it again, the face doesn't look right. Might just be the pic though.
Get a pic of the reverse up. I'll check the variety.


Ray

Russ

That is an amazingly nice looking half.

Russ, NCNE

Trooper

Here's the rev
Thanks!!

Sequitur

This is a heavily counterfeited series.

No kidding. That coin looks to good to be real. This Capped Bust auction states:

"Here is an interesting and truly scarce early US gold coin that can be purchased at a reasonable cost. This Capped $2.50 gold piece is guaranteed genuine, and I guarantee that ANACS will certify it as such. But, of course, the coin does have problem. Either it was once mounted in jewelry or the reeding was damaged, because a few of the reeds have been expertly repaired. In fact, the job is so good that my attempts at photographing the reeding proved a waste of time. As a digital image, the reeding looks natural, normal. If you have a good eye, however, the repairs are detectable "in person." I am offering this piece as a raw coin because, if holdered, you could not see and examine the reeding (of course). piece is fake."

Well, I'm not so sure about the seller's guarantee.




(Not hijacking the thread, just want to emphasize how tough it can be to buy these raw.)

jbsteven

from the photos it looks "grainy" which on my gut feeling tells me it is a cast copy.

Fairlaneman

Funky looking luster. Just like a Whizzed coin. Real or not, I have no clue.

Ken

lathmach

I don't think it's good. That's my gut feeling.
The top of the 0 in the date looks bad. Incomplete. Should be complete and rounded on top.
The dentils should be much stronger on this high a grade of coin.
On the face the nose and chin are too soft and rounded.
The picture is not sharp, and the coin may look good with a nice sharp photo, however.
I couldn't positively identify it in Overton.

Ray

nwcs

My instinctual response says fake.

rottnrog

Looks like a whizzed cast coin to me, but what do I know!!! LOL

Varlis

Fake.

dorkkarl

cheap, modern cast. worth $3 tops.

K S

relayer

Probably a 10 year old piece of metal

ealandg

Something about this just doesn't look right... I think it is something about the edges. I can't quite put my finger on it, but it looks strange to me.

lclugza

Looks like a fake- the denticles are too short, and Liberty's jaw is too square.

Baley

here is an O-105 from the same year, to compare:

Conder101

On the 1830 the photos are not real good. From whatI see it looks like it was cleaned at one time but I don't see anything in those pictures that would convice me it was fake. The dentical lenght that some have mentioned is not reliable since the dentical lenght on these coins is a function of strike, centering and die state. These coins did not have a close collar so the planchet can be closer to one side than the other resulting in denticals in one area and not in another. A strong strike also results in the planchet spreading further which would result in longer denticles. And on late die states the denticals are often worn away. The points of the stars heavily drawn to the edges shows that this die was in a late die state. I would not expect it to show much in the way of denticals.

Baley

What worries me about the first coin pictured is the "fuzzy" edges where the devices meet the fields or on the crisp highpoints of her hair and drapery.

On the other hand, the flow lines above UNITED look nice and real to me, as does the shield.

Tom (trooper) : What's the edge of your coin look like?

drop it gently on a table. does it "ring" like a struck coin or a cast coin?

JxnBoy

Compared with Baley's known good example, the coin in question seems not to match with the "E Pluribus Unum" Band under United States of America. The band stops at the A, where Baley's seems to go further to the M.

Baley

ahh, but that could be due to die variety.

The alignment of the motto and ribbon with the legend varies, and is sometimes diagnostic of rev. die.

JxnBoy

<< <i>ahh, but that could be due to die variety.

The alignment of the motto and ribbon with the legend varies, and is sometimes diagnostic of rev. die. >>



True enough. I don't know the series nearly as well. Even if I wanted for an album, I'd be on the side of having a slab first....

Wondo

It's got a "brushed" appearance. Run away!

dorkkarl

i'm guessing fake not because of design flaws or diagnostics - those match up fine w/ a real coin as a cast c/f would. i'm guessing by what look like grainy surfaces. if the coin's actual surfaces are ok, then the coin probably is real.

K S

Conder101

<< <i>ahh, but that could be due to die variety. >>


Yep, your coin was an O-105 and the coin in queston matches O-119.

Dollars

It is my understanding that this series is copied alot. Most of the copies were made at the same time that the real coins were made. Some of the copies go for more than the real ones. I am by no means a know-it-all. I was told this by a dealer when I told him I was worried about all the fakes in the series.

I do want only real coins. But if I end up with a better fake, I don't know. Most of the raw ones I own are problem coins that no one else seems to want. My lady and I call em Orphans Ladies, just looking for a good home.

JMO

sinin1

whats on the edge? cast copies do not have the correct letters/words
'FIFTY CENTS OR HALF A DOLLAR'


I am thinking real but altered surfaces

dorkkarl

<< <i>Some of the copies go for more than the real ones >>

just to put the record straight, contemporary c/f bust halves are worth bucks, & that's mostly if they are struck c/f's. cheap modern-day cast c/f are worth 2-3 bucks MAX. if you have a verifiable vintage cast, that's worth some bucks too, but it's tough to confirm such a coin as being from an early era.

i have cherry-picked at least a dozen die-struck c/f's over the years, from dealers who thought they were real, but crappy, & sold them for much too cheap.

K S

Conder101

Davignon does list a cast copy of O-119. At the time of the publication of the book only a single piece was known to him. If this piece IS cast then it could be a new specimen of 1830 D-10J.

Prometheus183

Side by side reveals very destinct differences I would say.

Prometheus183

Disregard... operator error