Opinions on 1st Set to attempt

Rainman

I’ve collected cards since I was a young kid w/’79 being the first set I remember. I have several (more than I care to admit) graded cards, mainly modern PSA 9s and 10s. However, I think the set registry bug has bitten me (or is starting to) and I was wondering what everyone thinks would be a good/manageable first set to start? No rush on the timeframe for completing it and the main consideration at this point is cost- i.e., I don’t want to spend what it would cost to buy a house in attempting to build my first set.

Any opinions?

Thanks.

mrc32

Buy what you like. Period.

I have done raw sets from the 50s 60s and 70s and am working on my first registry set of just PSA graded cards. I picked a super hard set. But I liked the cards so much that I couldn't resist. It is also a manageable size 200 or so cards.

Think about what you like
Think about your budget
Think about what grade you want the set to have

If you are looking for an investment check Virtualizard's post from last weekend.

I'd say if you are looking for a 50s set, go with 1954. I LOVE that set.

Good luck and let us know what you choose.

1420sports

mrc32 said it best.

onegaucho

Ditto. Gotta be something that you like.
Otherwise, it'll be too easy to sell when you need the money.

I'd auction off my wife before I'd sell my 1950 Bowman set....

(just kidding... I think....)

PS. Hey 1420- with all the recent talk of Rose, you might get more Rose submissions to help you find that elusive 67T 9.

Vargha

Do you have a scan of your wife?

Rainman

well my problem (it seems to be a problem in terms of $) is that I love the 50, 52, and 54-55 sets the most. however, i don't want to do a set of PSA 1s...and obviously psa 10s would cost me a house/my first born/spouse. outside of the 50s, i like the 75 topps set- which seems more manageable $ wise. i don't have a rush in terms of getting a set done and catapaulting up the registry, but i also don't want to waste $ on low grade cards b/c 9s-10s are out of reach.

jvineyard

Although I'm building mostly football sets, I've had fun with the 1964 Topps Giants. There is a nice selection of stars, it's a small set (60), and the PSA 8s are very reasonable and pretty easy to find on ebay. 9s start to jump in both price and scarcity, but are still managable. I was only 3 years old in 1964, but I still remember most of these players from a few years later when my baseball interest really kicked in.

1420sports

PS. Hey 1420- with all the recent talk of Rose, you might get more Rose submissions to help you find that elusive 67T 9.

I hope

bleacherbum

I may be a bit of an outlier with this viewpoint, but I don't think it is worth assembling a registry set unless there is an inherent value with having all the cards slabbed. I'm all for collecting any set you like, but assembling a registry set has a cost factor that can't be minimized. I also think you need to make some assessment on the future value of a registered set. You could go out a buy a ungraded 1971 Topps set for $1-$2 thousand depending on the grade (and less for lower grades) and if the bottom falls out of the market you're only out a couple of grand. On the other, if you have a '71 graded set in NM-MT or better you've just squandered $25,000+.

onegaucho

I'd agree with bleacherbum. I've got a 1950 Bowman set complete but only the HOFers graded (most of them, at least). It was much easier to find raw copies in stores and on ebay and I had more fun with it that way. I'm currently debating if it's worth it to send in the rest to get graded. I'm most likely going to wait til the next 'special' to avoid too much in terms of grading fees.

If you pick a smaller set (ie. 1951 Topps blue or red), you might end up waiting a while for them to show up on ebay in graded form.

A cost affordable set is the 1963 Fleer set. 67 cards. They come up on ebay quite often in graded form. And you can put together a nicely graded set of 7s for less than 3 grand.

dbj77

Try the 1970 Kelloggs baseball set in PSA 8. Most singles can be had for $5-$8 dollars. It's a small set of 75 cards and even the rarer cards that are hard to find in PSA 9 and 10 can be had relatively easily and cheaply in 8. The set looks nice and is 34 years old now. You could finish this set fast with little money spent.

Plus, I bet you could pick up some of these immediately from board members here who have extras, probably cut you a deal on bulk purchase. King Kellogg, Galveston, Gemmintman, all probably have extras lying around.


Good luck on whatever you decide.

wolfbear

Number one consideration should be to pick a set you really enjoy,
because you're going to be looking for cards for your set, including every common, for a long time.

Then figure how much you're willing to spend, and that will give you the grade you can afford.

mrc32

<< <i>well my problem (it seems to be a problem in terms of $) is that I love the 50, 52, and 54-55 sets the most. however, i don't want to do a set of PSA 1s >>



Rainman-
You could do a set of PSA 5s and 6s for 1954 topps and it will not cost an arm and a leg. It will come out to be a pretty nice set and will certainly hold its value.

Rainman

I think I should clarify somewhat. My timeframe is really quite open- i.e., I’d be totally fine if it takes 5-10 years (or longer) to get a nice set of 8s (and ideally at least 9s). I’m fairly young and have a decent amount of $ (as long as I don’t have to sell children/spouses/body parts) to put towards a quality set. I’d rather have all cards slabbed since raw cards tend to get lost in the shuffle of moving or otherwise easily damaged/misplaced/etc.

Thanks for the opinions so far

Rainman

That’s what I was thinking mrc- start w/a set I really enjoy/will likely hold its value over time- get the cards (say 54s) in fairly low yet decent grades (5s-7s) and upgrade to 8s (possibly 9s) over the years. It isn’t really a “race” for me of any type, but I like the idea of doing what my grandpa did for me- which was pass down his card collection. His weren’t graded, but he took great care w/them and as a result, I have a decent selection of 50s cards. Not to mention he’s what started me on card collecting

RayBShotz

I love when this type of post pops up. The Registry is such a rallying point. Thats why folks like Rainman look for advise here. They have already been swallowed into the machine! Expect diverse opinions, various plans of attack, lots of options delved out by lots of good people.
We just love to reply to these.

Rainman - I for one have some sets being built on the affordability track that you look to travel. I am assuming that you are considering something outside of the modern realm you are currently enjoying. You mentioned 50-52 54-55. It seems that in each set there is a grade level which flys just below the requirements of most more discriminating collectors. What I mean by that ( And I'll take the 54T set as an example) is that mid grade cards, although less of an investment bonanza present very well in PSA Holders. They are encapsulated, protected against further degrading, authenticated and certified to size requirements for the issue. So from that standpoint you can still buy with confidence.
Back to the 54T's and my point. Anything in a PSA 6 grade or higher gets lots of strong play, typically always approaching and eclipsing SMR. If memory serves PSA 6/7 commons go for $20/$30. If you are careful, patient and discrimnating you can grab some very nice cards in mid grade PSA EX 5 with very little competition. Lets face it. People didnt send in 1954 commons shooting for a PSA 5 grade. In a lot of cases the cards present much nicer...and certainly fit better in a budget.

I'll throw out another suggestion. Once your 10% in and have solidly decided to continue your quest, dont worry too much about the stars. Yes their value in any grade is rock solid but you are on a budget...at least initially. You are attempting to build the WHOLE set in PSA slabs so keep the ball rolling. I use the theory " My ship will come in some day" and I will buy the stars at that time. If you espouse a long time horizon, believe me, at least an occassional row boat will dock at your port and you can plug in something really nice at that time.

I have followed all this dogma, to a great extent, with my 66'set. It is currently now 16th on the registry after only working it secondarily for a little over a year. It is 26% complete in PSA 7. PSA 7 has the stature of mid grade when it comes to most 60's issues. Truth is PSA NRMT 7's are darn nice cards. View the scans from my set and see for yourself. I have built the first 26% almost exclusively off ebay and private purchases at a significant discount to SMR. Am I doing that to reap some profit in the end? No. I want to chip away at something on a budget and have found a comfortable niche with a set I enjoy a lot. Oh, and by the way, A rowboat showed up one day and I bought the Aaron in a PSA 7.

The draw is that this is a lot of fun. Grown men (hah!) playing little boy into old age. I'll probably be starting new sets in my 60's and beyond. The comradery is pretty cool too!

Best of Luck Rainman; please let me know what you start up, maybe I can help. One invloved you'll get lots of encouragement right here.
RayB69Topps
Rayb69Topps

NickM

Any '50s set in PSA 8 or better will be tough. I would strongly recommend looking at doing a set from that era in 7 or better - the cards will still be very nice.

For '54 Topps, PSA 7 non-scarce series commons generally go $25 to $50 (SMR is $30). Robert V. Moore sets a floor on the prices of these cards with his bidding (unless he misses one due to a bad listing or is on vacation). He does sell on eBay sometimes, however. High population commons in PSA 8 go for $45 to $65 apiece, with medium-pop commons going for $75 to $100, and low-pop commons going for outrageous amounts sometimes in bidding wars. Don't even think about building the set in PSA 9. Some of the cards simply will not be found in that condition, and the Aaron is a down payment on a house all by itself (and the Banks, Kaline, and both T. Williams would be if you were in a low cost-of-living area).

A set like '70 Kellogg's in PSA 8 or better could be done in a couple of weeks. PSA 9 or better condition would take longer, but you could get most of the high-pop cards very quickly.

If you really want cheap and fast, go for the '72 Kellogg's All-Time Greats set - 15 cards.

Again, pick what you like. Look at scans on the registry if you're not familiar with the set. Also, look at the overall SMR price for your desired grade. Odds are that you will pay at least 2/3 of that for your set, even if you purchase only when you get good deals.

Nick

NickM

I differ with Rainman on how PSA 6 cards are selling for '54 Topps - I find that most non-scarce series commons go for $12 to $18, with very few going significantly over that.

GAI and SGC cards also sell at a significant discount to PSA prices for the same grade, if you want to play the crack-out game or don't mind assembling a mixed set.

Nick

Davalillo

1)Would not do a set in less than psa 8 unless it is truly a classic(34 Goudey,T205 etc.)

2)Would not do a Kellogg set--particularly 1970--after all you have to keep looking at it. "even the "rare" cards can be had easily and cheaply in psa 9"--hmmm, seems like something I said once. "A set like 1970 Kellogg could be done in a couple of weeks"--substitute 9s for 8s and that is close to another direct quote.

Dav

Tipem

Rainman,

I suggest that if you are considering a 50's set,stay above 53 for sure.The sets below that are very costly if you are going for 8 and above.I am doing the 56 set in 8+ and dabbling in the 55 set the same way.I have found that the 56 set will be around 25-30K when I am done.It should sell for 36-40K if I desire to sell.Real nice cards and one of the most popular sets in the 50's.My time frame is 2-3 years realistically.

Good luck on your venture.

Vic

interchanges

Nothing less than PSA 8?

He did say "collect" and I think the word managable was in there.

A 50's or 60's set in 8 or above would almost be a burden.

thegemmintman

<< <i>a good/manageable first set to start? No rush on the timeframe for completing it and the main consideration at this point is cost >>



Rainman - to me "manageable" means not a large set, and since cost is the main factor here I would recommend you consider doing a 1964 Topps Giants set (60 cards) in PSA 8 or a combination of PSA 8 and 9. The 1970 Kellogg's set (75 cards) in PSA 9 would be a great choice too as others here have suggested.

Davalillo

One consideration is do you want a challenge--70 Kellogg and 64 Topps Giants would be simple in 8. If you want to do just one set in 8 and want it to be a relatively small set then something like 1960 Fleer or 1964 Topps Stand-Ups or 1954 Red Heart would at least represent a challenge.

Rainman

thank you for the response- this is one of the more informative boards on CU. as for kelloggs, i'm not too fond of those cards (no offense to King Kellogg/the other kellogg followers) personally. since my horizon's undefined time wise, it seems it would be manageable time and $ wise to start say a 54 set (i do like the red heart)- or maybe the 55-56 (i like all the 50s sets). while 60s sets may be cheaper (i'm not as familiar w/vintage graded prices as i am w/modern), i'm personally not overly fond of the 60s cards. nice cards, but i don't know if i'm so intensely passionate about them that i MUST collect entire sets of them. same w/70s for the most part, though i do enjoy the 75 and to a lesser degree the 77 set.

i'm the type of person who needs to start somewhere to keep and remain motivated- i.e., while i aspire to own a 50s set in psa 8s (and perhaps higher), i'm not sure how manageable cost or time wise that would be right now. so it would seem feasible (assuming prices aren't too insane) to start w/a few psa 7s in my chosen set (i'm leaning towards '54 or '56 right now). like one poster said, eventually your ship comes along (congrats on that aaron in a 7 btw) and i think that by acquiring 7s and reselling some of the other cards i have (and saving $), i could upgrade to psa 8s eventually.

by "manageable" i mean: not 800 card sets w/9034803483 inserts. but "manageable" doesn't mean "can be completed the quickest." as the infamous fairytale says, the slow one eventually wins the race (or something like that). time's not a huge issue right now (though obviously i'd like the set done before i die) and unlike some of the modern cards i buy, it doesn't seem like there's such a great deal of price fluctuation from week to week/month to month in vintage cards (but i could be wrong).

ideally whatever set i choose will appreciate in value $ wise, but even if it doesn't, like my grandfather, i'll have something to pass on to my kids/grandkids. the cards he gave me (mainly from the 50s w/a few being earlier) are my favorite cards to this day. and since he's passed on, they're something "tangible" i can still pull out and look at, fondly recalling his stories about certain players. it's that type of thing that inspires me to start a registry set.

downgoesfrazier

Rainman,
Davalillo hit the nail right on the head! In fact, why not just collect something like, oh...I don't knnnnnnoooooowwwww....hmmmmmm...
Ah! Hundreds of sets in PSA 8!!! If you think about it, it's the only way to do it. Sure, you'd run out of bodyparts to pawn eventually to finance the venture, but why the heck not! In fact, I'm going to stay the course on this one. Dav, I've seen the light!...geez...

OK, for the rest of us... 64 Giants sound like a winner. Attractive, star selection, manageable number, availability, unique format, plenty of experts to help you with valuable information and still quite challenging in ungraded form these days.
Also, Shotz's example was awesome! Centered EX/MT copies from the early-mid 50's are nice cards--many of which look NM/MT even at arms length. They present exceptionally well and will hold their value very nicely. I would suggest aiming for some specific attributes if you go this route.

Try to buy as many of the cards in person that you can and look for exceptional color strikes and registration. Stay away from excess print debris and keep your centering within 60/40. Cards with an almost imperceptable surface wrinkle in a 5 or 6 holder present great. Light, natural, even corner wear with slight graduation at the tips of a couple should be the culprit that lands the card in 6-7 range-- 90/10 razors are butt-ugly regardless of the grade in most opinions. Colectors in this range (5-7) are obviously not obsessed with the grade as much as the card so if re-sale is on your mind you've got to make them look the part. Plus, that's the only real challenging part of building those in EX/MT. I did 52's and 53's in 6-8 and had a great time and built a real nice lookin' couple of groups. My love (obsession) of perfection got the better of me and when I realized I could never afford "virtually perfect" 53's, I bailed and started collecting my youth, the 70's. I'm still clinging to many EX/MT and NM HOF'ers from those sets for the simple reason that they present so well for the grade...it CAN be done. One key element that can't be overlooked if grading the cards are in your future is to get very familiar with what 6's and 7's look like in PSA holders so you can make educated purchases as you begin your set. You probably know this, but many new set-builders get an expensive education when "judgement day" comes (play ominous music )...

Wishes of ease and happiness with whatever you choose and, like wolfbear said, choose wisely as you'll be lookin' at the things for a loooooong time.

dgf
P.S. If nothing else floats your boat, may I suggest 1979 Topps? If that's what started it all for you you may like it as much as I have...

downgoesfrazier

Rainman,
I hadn't seen your last post...
Your Grandfather sounds like a winner! Thanks for sharing. Hearing that stuff never gets old.

dgf

Rainman

yes he was a winner dgf. april marks 4 years since his death and it still hurts to this day. but things like my love of baseball cards b/c of him and so on bring me smiles and are memories that can't be replaced.

btw, are there certain honest sellers you'd recommend on ebay for vintage

NickM

davalillo - what makes Red Hearts a challenge in PSA 8? It seems that most of the cards can be found very quickly from a few dealers. The only issue is the price.

'60 Fleer is a good set, but right now, prices on PSA 7 and PSA 8 cards from it are high.

Stand-Ups are an acquired taste. That's something somebody would need to really like beforehand to get into collecting in graded form.

'60 Leaf is also an option no one has mentioned. It's fairly tough, but small.

If somebody wanted an easy one to submit himself, I'd recommend '68 Topps Game. It's one of the easiest sets to correctly predict the grade on.

Nick

downgoesfrazier

I buy all over and have never had a problem with anyone. I would say that BMW is the best I've dealt with, however. Mike typically deals with high-end stuff, but he purchases many lots of mid-grade cards for his clients. He has a discerning eye and has always delivered for me. I am a show-hound and didn't buy too many cards on eBay. I've bought from everyone from Brian Drent at Milehigh (awesome) to Levi (when I've run out of options) and can't say I have any complaints. Chris Porter is one of the great guys out there as well. He found me a blazing 55 Berra (PSA 8) that fit my criteria and a 62 Yaz (PSA8) within a couple of weeks andl has helped me with 70's cards...pretty diverse.
For raw it's Kyle's (Kyle Boetel) and Paul Starx (Starxcards). In addition to many quality cards that graded above what he advertised, Paul sold me a doctored card (a '56 Williams) that didn't grade and he made good on it immediately. He's solid.

I know these are solid guys because they know I don't have tons of cash. Any dealer can be the greatest if you're oozing money and collecting sets of high-ticket stuff. They're all "You 'da man!" and "I really looked hard for 'ya, dude" while they sink their 170% of SMR into you. BMW, Starx, Drent, Kyle and to some extent Chris will help the smaller, slower, budgeted collector. I like that.

dgf

Davalillo

NickM,

You may be right on the Red Hearts but I remain two cards short of completion in psa 8--maybe I am not trying hard enough.

60 Leaf is another good cheap selection.

DGF,

I was suggesting one of these sets which I believe he said he wanted to do over a period of years. Most collectors should be able to swing one of these over a period of years--and if you do 1 set and devote yourself to it do you really want look at it and see off-condition cards and do you really want it to be so easy to collect in 8 (like Topps Giants) that you can go out there anytime and buy the cards cheaply.

Dav

Vargha

Maybe I missed it in all of these posts, but what is your annual card budget? That's one of the main determining factors even if you do plan to build the set for the next ten years.

Rainman

vargha i don't have a set in stone annual card budget (which i believe is the first step in becoming a Set Addict . based on the past few years, i tend to spend roughly 2-3k/year on cards, sometimes more, sometimes less. this is spent mainlly on vintage cards (raw usually), boxes, graded cards/autos of my fav players, and the random "I must rip a few wax packs RIGHT NOW" moments. my main interest in doing my first set is:

challenge- there are some very nice looking cards out there (50s seems to be my favorite era)- i'd like to collect some nice graded examples- and i like the "hunt" for cards- as long as it's likely that i'll eventually find the card

manageability- not an 800 card set- something that can in theory be completed within my lifetime/ideally 1-2 years. but not something i have to sit on ebay all day every day watching/waiting for that "1 card" to come up for sale

investment- ideally i can acquire a graded set that will increase in value- even if i have to start out w/6s and 7s and upgrade

history- something i can ideally pass on to the kids/grandkids

when i envision building my first registered set, i see myself buying a few graded cards/year (say maybe 10), perhaps starting out in the lower/more affordable grades (say 6s/7s and the bargain 8s if there are any), completing the set within 1-2 years- and then upgrading or moving on to another set

Vargha

This may sound funny, but $2-3K isn't that much. For 10 years, that gives you $25-$30K to spend. Use SMR as a rough guide and work backwards from there. For example, 1952 Bowman is at $14.7K in PSA 7 and $33.2K in PSA 8, so it would be a decent candidate to build. 1952 Topps is at $89.6K in PSA 7, so it would not.

mrc32

Rainman- 2K-3K a year is PLENTY. That is approximately what I spent last year if you subtract out what I sold in cards and junk on ebay. I bet I spent a little under 2K.

Not everyone can have VARGHA bucks

40ozman

My first set was a 76 Wonder bread football. The cards were dirt cheap raw, and the set is small. While the set might not resale for much, it gave me some knowledge about sending raw cards in, and got me ready to tackle more complex/larger sets. Maybe try a smaller set, like a kelloggs or something similar just to start.

How about collecting something you remember collecting when you a kid? You mentioned 79 topps. These can be had in PSA8 inexpensively, and raw material is abundant. My collection is of stuff I remember collecting when I was kid. While must of you have know idea why I would grade any 1984 Ralston Purina card, let alone get a complete set of graded, these cards hold a special place in my heart.

NickM

davalillo - BOTN sold a Snider in PSA 8 yesterday on ebay ($578).

Nick

Rainman

I like the idea of doing a set from my childhood- and actually I have several sets I put together by hand in raw form from my childhood. However, those sets seem to have a zillion cards (792) and that seems daunting to me initially to start w/for a graded set. Also, I can likely pick up late 70s/early 80s stars and commons (of which I already own many, several of which are likely gradeable) fairly cheap for the next few years- whereas I'm not so sure I'll be able to pick up 7s from 50s (and maybe 60s) sets cheaply for the next few years. For some reason, a set of 100 or less seems more manageable than the 792 sets of my childhood $ and time wise for a first attempt. My income fluctuates (i.e., I work ull time, freelance at night, and sell cards on EBay) and likely will for several years, but I have a decent amount of disposable income and could up the $2-3k/year I spend if need be. However, assuming I start w/a set of 100 cards and buy say 10-20/year, $2-3k/year towards “set building” seems reasonable.

thegemmintman

What about a '71 Topps Greatest Moments (55 cards)?

Just throwing ideas at you as you provide more parameters of what you're looking for. Tough set and it will cost you some bucks over time.

Rainman

thanks gem (and everyone else). i haven't decided just yet on the year of the first set i'll do, but i think i'll keep it under 100 cards as that seems more manageable time (though time's not a huge issue- just in the sense of not wanting to be overwhelmed by an 800 card set) and $ wise.

jackstraw

here would be a good start to a 1964 or 1965 set, both sets a collected by members here and this guy is top notch. if you start a set GASPIPE
will be able to help you out to good start. i believe most of all the 60's sets look real nice in 7/8 grade. i like the 50's sets but your on your own there. i personally would do a 59 set but thats me.

Vargha

Don't get me wrong. I was talking in the context of what he wants to build. If you are trying to build most 1950's sets in PSA 7 or better, $2,500 isn't alot of dough. Please keep things in their proper perspective. If you want to be realistic about it, spending over $20/year on cardboard is one heck of alot unless you are a box manufacturer.

Rainman

No problem Vargha- I understood your points and I realize that my dream of a 52 Topps set in PSA 9s/10s is probably a dream (but that's what makes life exciting). BTW, not that it matters, but I'm not male

Vargha

Shouldn't you be "rainwoman" then? Or do you just hate K Mart?

Putty

Rainman Welcome! I am also new to these boards and to the hobby of collecting complete sets. As a beginner I dabbled with 56 topps BB until I found what I was truly looking for. I was bored one evening and took a look at 51 Bowman and it was love at first site. My goal is to collect the whole 324 card set in PSA 6 or higher, the only exception will assuredly be the Mantle which will be a lifetime pursuit due to my budget. Anyway here is my 2 cents, collect what you like, period. Keep in mind the cards you can’t afford now in the grade you desire you can always purchase in a lower grade to finish the set then when and if your budget allows buy those same high value cards in the grade you want and sell the lower grade card and hopefully recoup your original investment. Whatever you choose I hope you enjoy yourself doing it, that after all is the reason we are all here, we all love this insane hobby!

Rainman

I hate KMart and friends gave me the nickname Rainman b/c I guess I'm a Rainman in some ways (it's my favorite movie).