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Economy is Good, LOL, are americans blind??
sumner1984
Posts: 82
I have bloomberg channel on TV now and they are saying how the economy is improving. Yet I been watching the national debt clock http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/ and it has skyrocketed to over 7 trillion today !!! Along with that, im sure everyone here knows how the price of gold is skyrocketing as well. Is this some kind of conspiracy and is the media being controlled .I guess the economy can be OK today with a national debt skyocketing to record highs, but it cant go on much longer.Tomorow or next week when retail sales are slower then I guess the economy will be not OK, since american economy is based on consumer spending and military might and thats about it, how sad.
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<< <i>is the media being controlled >>
The answer to this should be fairly obvious.
<< <i>they are saying how the economy is improving. Yet I been watching the national debt clock http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/ and it has skyrocketed to over 7 trillion today !!! >>
And the national debt is relevant to economic recovery because?
Russ, NCNE
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Because the Gov has to borrow that money. Right now it's not an issue because there isn't much demand in the private sector so rates are staying low. But if the economy is going to continue to recover, businesses are going to borrow as well, and as a result interest rates will sky-rocket. Then recovery goes bust.
<< <i> Now, would you like me to go more in-depth? I can drag out the notes from Economics class if you wish... but in all, Bush has little real influence in the economy, except what control and influence he has on the budget in Congress... >>
In order to make a statement like that, you need to drag out notes from more than JUST your economics class. Politics can affect the economy in many ways, and essentially anyone who has sat in the oval office has done just that. Foreign trade policy is created by the white house, congress, special interest groups, etc. These policies affect your job, standard of living and overall health of the economy. When Clinton signed NAFTA into law, and trade liberalization has only increased under Bush, all of a sudden factories in the US can be shipped abroad and those that remain force their workers to earn less cash. Are you telling me, THAT doesn't affect the economy? These measures come straight from the white house, not the federal reserve. When Bush puts steel tarrifs or signs trade agreements with China, these have major effects on the economy.
Take another example- The redesigning of the overtime laws and job classifications with who is exempt and who is non-exempt that has happened on Bush's watch. This is a POLICY initiative, has nothing to do with the Fed. Now all of a sudden, millions of Americans who were earning overtime pay may find themselves "reclassified" and no longer eligeable to earn overtime pay. Now they have a lot less money to spend. Are you telling me that does NOT affect the economy?
Let's take one last example- the medicare bill passed into law by President Bush. This includes a drug benefit for seniors. Now all of a sudden, the Federal Government (Not Federal Reserve- they had nothing to do with this) will be paying drug makers big bucks to cover the perscription costs for the tens of millions of Americans who are about to retire. These drug companies will make a TON OF MONEY! Not to mention the forces in the white house trying to privatize medicare. Don't you THINK that the insurance companies that will manage these medicare plans won't make money? These measures will definetly affect the economy!!
So get your nose out of the textbook and look at the big picture, my friend. It affects me, affects you, and affects everyone out there. Now, I'm not taking an anti-Bush or pro-Bush stance in this post, I'm just pointing out that EVERY president, Democrat OR Republican can negatively or positively affect the economy. But blindly saying that Bush hasn't harmed the economy in one way or another is just plan ignorant. The economy is very dynamic and any number of factors can influence it, and that includes the white house.
I never know where to start with statements like some of these. While they
differ from my politics this is not even really a political consideration. Our gov-
ernment does what it does despite, and because of political affiliations. Each
causes problems and blames he others. Conversely each has solutions for which
they want sole credit. Certainly many of the spending programs have been pro-
mulgated by the Democrats and many of the tax "reductions" have been pushed
by the republicans. Meantime the people tend to blame which ever party holds
the presidency. Things won't change until Americans wake up and demand re-
sponsibility and accountability ay all levels of society. ...And this is unlikely to
happen until they accept responsibility themselves.
As far as who controls the media this one's easy. Liberals have a stranglehold on
virtually all media and can see no evil while a democrat occupies the oval office and
no good with a republican.
Things must REALLY be looking up.
And to Tsimmerdown: Little problem I see with your arguements... every one of your examples, would first have to be approved by the House and the Senate with a majority vote in both... it's not just the President saying I want these things to happen and signs it into Law...
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<< <i>Kudos to jrgman.....There are a lot that don't get it or have an axe to grind...thanks.. >>
No axe to grind here with the President.. he has done many things right, and he will continue to do things right. However, you cannot make a statement such as "The president does nothing to affect the economy" based on a high school economics class is wrong. It's only looking at the issue from one side.
Any president, regardless of party, from George Washington to George Bush Jr. make policy decisions which affect the economy.
<< <i>"And the national debt is relevant to economic recovery because?"
Because the Gov has to borrow that money. >>
They don't "have" to, they "choose" to. The assets held by the federal government dwarf the national debt. If they were a private corporation, the balance sheet would be considered healthy.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>"And the national debt is relevant to economic recovery because?"
Because the Gov has to borrow that money. >>
They don't "have" to, they "choose" to. The assets held by the federal government dwarf the national debt. If they were a private corporation, the balance sheet would be considered healthy.
Russ, NCNE >>
Russ is correct. It is an accounting ratio called the Debt to Assets ratio. What is of concern to the original poster, if you want to draw a parallel to a corporation would be debt as a percentage of net income, or interest as a percentage of net income. However, keep in mind: The U.S. has never defaulted on it's debt. The U.S. has never devalued it's currency, and how many other countries can say the same?
<< <i>I beg to differ that Bush is the reason, or at least sole reason, for your so-called artifical rise... >>
Hmmm, does anyone see here, where I said that Bush was the reason for the recession or other Economic problems or that he has no effect on the Economy?
And you're mistaken in the statement that "The US has never devalued their currency." This latest recession was actually partially caused by the Fed tightening up on their Monetary Policy, lowering the value of the US$, to fight inflation... the Fed would rather have a recession than inflation, and has, on occasion, sent the nation into a recession on purpose to acheive their ends... fighting inflation...
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"Then, Congress also influences the economy, but not as much as the Fed, through Spending and Taxation."
SPENDING AND TAXATION. You mention nothing about policy. The Senate, House and the President all influence policy. However, the key in there is that the president can influence policy as well.
You are correct- the president does not unilaterally make policy. But he does have some part in it, which in turn affects the economy. All presidents have done this.
And you are also wrong- concerning trade tarrifs, the president operates those, outside of congressional mandates, at least in the short term.
Haven't you been reading the news lately?
<< <i>
<< <i>I beg to differ that Bush is the reason, or at least sole reason, for your so-called artifical rise... >>
And you're mistaken in the statement that "The US has never devalued their currency." This latest recession was actually partially caused by the Fed tightening up on their Monetary Policy, lowering the value of the US$, to fight inflation... the Fed would rather have a recession than inflation, and has, on occasion, sent the nation into a recession on purpose to acheive their ends... fighting inflation... >>
??? Do you know what currency devaluation is?
You're talking about something completely different. If you follow the thread, those statements are meant to support Russ' arguement...
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<< <i>I'm sorry, I got my thinking crossed, you are right that the US doesn't devalue their currency, my mistake, and I take my last statement back. >>
No problem, my friend..
I just wanted to present the whole picture when people make statements about the President, both the pros and the cons.
that 99.99999% of the population doesnt know 1% of what they act like they know....
It is good to try and understand. That is what more Americans need to do.
However, stating opinions as fact, without the education and economic, policy, political, social and civic experience to back it up is wrong.
V.r,
coinlt
siliconvalleycoins.com
<< <i>and there were no messes to be found... >>
Other than stained dresses.
Russ, NCNE
Things looked rosy for awhile under Clinton because he had about 2 years of windfall tax receipts because of all of the Roth IRA conversions.
"Because the Gov has to borrow that money. Right now it's not an issue because there isn't much demand in the private sector so rates are staying low. But if the economy is going to continue to recover, businesses are going to borrow as well, and as a result interest rates will sky-rocket. Then recovery goes bust."
Right now interest rates are low so the extra interest is not the burden that it will be in the future. When more than 100% of your tax receipts go to interest with none leftover for planned budget expenses then things could get interesting.
the day after thanksgiving when i got home n turned on tv after leaving work with my pink slip
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
I can think of a dozen reasons not to have high capacity magazines, but it's the reasons I haven't thought about that I need them.
If you read some of the offline and unofficial interviews with Greenspan and other fed members, as well as members of the CFR and Trilateral committees, you will come to understand that perception is everything and economic theories are useless if John Sixpack and ABC Housing Inc don't invest in bond markets and equities.
<< <i> Economy is Good, LOL, are americans blind?? >>
It depends on if you are working or not. If you are unemployed the economy is bad. If you are one of the 94+% of the workforce thing ain't so bad. It like so many things in perception.
90% of the media seems to be democratic or hold democratic views, so it is rare to see anything positive, and when something positive shows up a lot of people don't belive it anyway.
And what does this have to do with coins?
President, Racine Numismatic Society 2013-2014; Variety Resource Dimes; See 6/8/12 CDN for my article on Winged Liberty Dimes; Ebay
<< <i>
that 99.99999% of the population doesnt know 1% of what they act like they know....
>>
My guess is that the other .00001% realize they are almost completely ignorant.
My Thoughts Because at some point when we run off the rest of the world with a lower
dollar we'll have to fund our own us gov bonds
thus we'll have to raise interest rates to sell them in the volume needed to run this gov
which will stop the stock market dead in it's tracks
<< <i>However, stating opinions as fact, without the education and economic, policy, political, social and civic experience >>
<< <i>to back it up is wrong. >>
Last I checked we had a first amendment. You know freedom of speech. If you don't like the opinion of others, don't read it!
President, Racine Numismatic Society 2013-2014; Variety Resource Dimes; See 6/8/12 CDN for my article on Winged Liberty Dimes; Ebay
President, Racine Numismatic Society 2013-2014; Variety Resource Dimes; See 6/8/12 CDN for my article on Winged Liberty Dimes; Ebay
<< <i>This would be a good Open Forum thread. >>
Nah, it would die over there. Too intellectual.
Russ, NCNE
Bush also has to fight a war against Evil -- Evil and terrorists breeding in the Middle East. Another big problem that calls for some short-term painful solutions for the long-term benefit of getting the snowball rolling in a Standard that won't tolerate terrorism, evil, and anti-rights regimes the way they were being tolerated by the World before he came into office. Another thing that drives me nuts are the fools who think that fighting terrorism is not under the larger umbrella of fighting evil and how they are one and connected -- which is why it is so very important to not tolerate a Saddam who gives the finger as he disregards his original Surrender Treaty and actually be fully cooperative as it demanded.
I believe Bush, who is imperfect like all other Presidents, will go down in history as the President who got the ball rolling on getting real about seriously dealing with evil and setting a new world standard of toughness about it, freed millions, and put more personal financial control into the hands of individual citizens, and who played one of the worst economic hands dealt to a President notably well.
<< <i>
<< <i>This would be a good Open Forum thread. >>
Nah, it would die over there. Too intellectual.
Russ, NCNE >>
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