Options
Heritage 2004 FUN Lincolns...most important coin?
RELLA
Posts: 961 ✭✭✭
Some very tough grades, some very tough dates. Which coin is the most important among the top offerings?
RELLA
RELLA
Do not fall into the error of the artisan
who boasts of twenty years experience in his craft
while in fact he has had only one year of experience...
twenty times.
who boasts of twenty years experience in his craft
while in fact he has had only one year of experience...
twenty times.
0
Comments
My Complete PROOF Lincoln Cent with Major Varieties(1909-2015)Set Registry
RELLA
who boasts of twenty years experience in his craft
while in fact he has had only one year of experience...
twenty times.
We'll use our hands and hearts and if we must we'll use our heads.
I'm going with the 21-S. As far as sight unseen rarity, I think the 20-S is probably tougher. But the poll asked which one I would chase for my collection. Based on eye appeal, strike, etc., I think the 21-S is a nicer coin. Both the 20-S and 21-S will bring about $20,000-$25,000 each. Since they are both in that ultra-tough category, I'd go for the better looking coin (at least based on the Heritage imaging
But, I have a question for you - why did these coins not get placed in the Platinum sale, yet the 14(s) and svdb did? What is your read on that?
Wondercoin
Mitch: Good question. The 20-S and 21-S and probably several others will smoke the two Lincolns in the Platinum sale
Good question...
I think a far greater number of people would have been confused if KEY DATES in GEM CONDITION like the 09-S VDB and the 14-S were left out in favor of the 20-S and 21-S.
Maybe another thread/poll...true killer coins, but with less star power than the historic keys, when placed in a high profile auction slot such as the Platinum Night in place of the "keys"...does that hurt or help their selling price?...and whatever the price, does the presence (and hammer price) of such lesser known rarities help or hurt how others in the hobby might perceive the series?
The way it is right now...the real prizes are all together in the same session with the Sadler collection and its contribution to the lineup, and that isn't totally a bad thing.
One other thing...the 20-S is the easy choice just picking from the list, and the 21-S is a solid choice and just about as nasty to find nice as any other S-mint from....well really from about 1914-1928, but I really like the 1915 as a sneaky sleeper pick and if pressed just might pick it out of the pack.
RELLA
who boasts of twenty years experience in his craft
while in fact he has had only one year of experience...
twenty times.
Russ, NCNE
When is your auction company going to get a coin that I need?
I thought you worked for a first class coin company.
Jack the Knife - The 21 s is the nicest coin in the group.I use to own it.IMO it will cost you somewhere between 25,000 to $35,000 with the juice.
stewart
Stewart,
Don't bang on Rella, there isn't an auction company in the country that is going to get a Lincoln that you need. Of the four or five or whatever it is that you need for a perfect set, if one becomes available it will be traded privately I'm sure.
Now, on to the 21-S. You really think I'll have to go to $25,000-$35,000? I was hoping the 20-S would take off some of the heat and I would pick it up for the bargain price of $22,500
You want to know what will really happen? When all is said and done, I'll have chased all these lots, but will wind up with some $100 coin I need to fill a hole. I'll post which one it is after the auction.
Edited to add:
Actually, what will really happen is that Rella will find some way to snipe at a live auction and I'll wind up with nothing!!!
Jack the Knife -
The one Lincoln cent that I have been searching for in a PCGS first generation holder is the 1927 D is a 66 red holder.I have been looking for it for more than 15 years ! Noone I know has ever spoke of or seen the coin.
stewart
Stewart,
Interesting that you have never seen the coin. I went to my "Lincoln Cent Histories" file (compiled listing of all high grade Lincolns I've seen since 1990) and there is no mention of it there. We should put out a missing coin ad like they did for the 5th 1913 Liberty nickel! Let's find that coin!!
If you can get them for 2K or so, IMO the pieces to pick up are dates like the 83, 88, 94, 95, and 97. Pieces with a current pop of 15 to 25. The lower pop dates are great, but will go for way more, so they are riskier. In some of the years. production was very high quality. So the higher pop dates which can be bought cheaper might be too common in the future.
Greg
Typetone,
I have no intention of igniting the debate about "moderns v. classics", as I agree that the definition of either is vague at best. I just find it hard to believe that late date Memorial Proofs would warrant such spirited bidding as will be seen with the 20-S or 21-S Lincoln. Again, I realize that it is perspective about what constitutes rarity. It's just that I don't happen to share the perspective that late date Memorial Proofs are rare when compared to MS red S-mints from the early twenties.
Not making a proclamation, just expressing an opinion
Of course, my view is only an opinion as well. I'm sure the early MS key dates will get the highest prices and most spirited bidding. But, the survey seems to be asking what I would go for. If they can be bought right, I like the 70DCAM moderns. As long as I have been collecting, I have never seen quality, or best available being a bad buy. At current prices I just think some of these modern 70DCAMs dates are good purchases, even assuming future pop increases. Just look for the better lower pop dates. Of course, price is important. At some point I would give up chasing a piece. For example, on an 83 in 70DCAM, I would drop out over 3K for sure and maybe earlier. And, on the early mint state pieces, if bidding is lighter than expected, and prices are lower than expected, I might jump in. However, I am sure the pricing on the earlies will be above my levels.
Thank you for not getting into the modern/classic debate. There is no doubt that the pieces you cite will always be rarer the the modern 70DCAMs. They will also always be priced much higher. The question is, where is the best value? Its all a rarity/condition/price trade-off. The answers are not easy. But, I don't find it worthwhile to arbitrarily stay out of an area based on emotion rather than thought.
Greg
Typetone,
Not sure I agree with the value proposition, but if your desire is to cherrypick the BEST "perfect" PR70DCAM Lincolns, you should make an effort to inspect the FUN lots at length. Some of them are simply incredible, even compared to others of the same grade.
Stewart,
I'll rumble with you later...I'm not ignoring your attempt to start something, I'm just too busy right now.
RELLA
who boasts of twenty years experience in his craft
while in fact he has had only one year of experience...
twenty times.
Sorry, I didn't know you were interested in just discussing the 09 to 58 MS pieces. On those, I will defer to the more knowledgeable to pontificate.
On the 70DCAMs, I absolutely agree that you need to buy only those which are perfect under 5x. If you can find any flaw at all, DO NOT BUY IT! The 70DCAM prices I cited should only be paid for the truly perfect pieces. Otherwise you are buying a 69 in 70 clothing. Those will almost certainly not hold their value. The true 70s will be the big winners. If you are really good, buy 69s and look for coins to upgrade. But warning, at best you will find one out of a few hundred, you will get a huge headache trying to find the small flaws, and when you are finished you will have a roomful of 69 DCAMs and nothing to do with them.
Greg
<< <i> Again, I realize that it is perspective about what constitutes rarity. It's just that I don't happen to share the perspective that late date Memorial Proofs are rare when compared to MS red S-mints from the early twenties.
>>
In the long run most Lincoln collections will include the memorials. Of perhaps greater importance
is that due to their wide circulation and availability there will likely be many people who collect only
the memorial issues. Under these conditions you will see that where two coins are equally rare, it
will be the memorial with a higher price. There are some dates of these which are surprisingly diff-
icult to find in nice attractive condition and more that are extremely elusive in high grade gem.
Ignoring the later date coins has had a dramatic impact on their availability in higher grades and these
will merely trickle onto the market for many years simply because thre are so few collections and so
few set aside.
The 30-S is hot out of the gate!
So, wow... One could start quite a nice collection buying Legend's 65rd 19-s and 23-s, and then the 17-s,20-s,21-s,27-s from the auction!
Typetone or Cladking--- What do you know about high grade zinc cents? I bought about 50 rolls of them a few weeks ago with really just the purpose of putting together a nice looking (but technically ms67 better) raw set for my own collection. Interesting enough the 2 97-p rolls I had were the nicest overall, but in terms of pops it is the toughest. Do you know why 97-p is tough? What about 95-p? With over 1000 ms68rd DDO's graded, it can't seem that 95-p or any zinc Lincoln (at least mid 90's or later) should be tough in ms68? Would a pcgs ms68rd 1997-p be worth a lot? I have a few I may send in to see if they make it, but I hope to do more learning about grading and get some opinions about the coins first. Anyway, thanks!
I only collect the proofs, so I will have to defer on offering an opinion on which mint state pieces might be rarest and in most demand. I'm sure cladking will have some thoughts.
Greg
the same source will include the same few die pair. This makes an assortment
of rolls to be a very poor sample. It will easily be overrepresented with gems
or underrepresented.
I'm not extremely familiar with rolls but in my experience the zinc Lincolns are
easiest to find gem in the mint sets. This applies especially to the '85 to '95 is-
sues but probably to the later as well. Some of these are nearly flawless and
extremely Proof Like.
:-(
Dennis
Like VOC Numismatics on facebook
Too bad. A tough date gets even tougher.
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
David,
That was my point for not picking it. Roger asked which one I would chase for my collection. Even though the 20-S is probably a tougher coin in 65RD, the 21-S is nicer. That's the coin I would and will chase.
Jack
<< <i>Understand from someone who's seen it that the 20-S has some serious, visible spots on it, and is not good at all for the grade >>
Boy, just more reason to be annoyed with the grading industry. That is so unfair. Someone could pay many thousands for a coin that if it were in its proper lesser grade holder would be only worth 2 thousand. I hate that so much.
The 30-S is now nuclear, the 20-S and 21-S are clearly on fire and about to go nuclear, the 15-P has caught on fire as well. The 27-S is white hot. All this with 17 days to go. Is there an end to this madness? If so, it will not be at FUN.
09/07/2006