Grading Styles and Preferences
FB
Posts: 1,684 ✭✭
Guys,
I've seen it mentioned as parts of other threads, but thought that it was an interesting enough topic that it deserved its own thread. I heard mention of the Dude and Dav philosohies and I figured that there had to be many, MANY more variations and strategies than that.
What sort of different collecting methods, strategies do you emply to build your collection?
Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Any other facets of your strategy?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Since I'm asking - I'll post my thought...
Right now, I'm working on 12 sets or so - from 64 to 72 Topps along with 64 Giants and 70 Kellogg's.
Of those, I'm most serious about the 72, 71, 67 and 64. The others I'll pick up cards on eBay if the price is low enough.
When I buy on eBay I will not purchase a card lower than PSA 8. But, I submit a lot of my own material to PSA. When I submit, I try to only submit cards that will get PSA 8 or better except 71 when I'll settle for PSA 7 since so many collectors include those in their sets. I try to submit enough at one time so that I can keep 20 - 25% of the submission and then sell of the rest to cover all grading fees and most of the raw card costs. I sell off all cards that I already have or didn't grade out to PSA 8.
I don't work on a budget generally, but I try to keep the costs under the household rader by making money on eBay sales. When cash is tight, I still always buy raw, but I will stop bidding on everything but 72's on eBay. I will NEVER pay whatever it takes to simply win a card. I WILL pay large dollars for cards that I want, but you'll never see a $10K snipe on even a tough 72 card that I need - there is still way too much raw available.
I would consider myself a hybrid collector/investor. I don't consider my card collection an investment, but I do try to minimize the downside by buying VALUE and not overpaying for cards that I need/want. I think the best part about this registry is the comraderie - sure, I may pick on some folks as I pass them or they pass me, but I've had so much fun meeting many of you dweebs from around the country that makes this a great hobby.
Oh... and EJGuru... You don't know how d@mned frustrating it is to be 55% complete on a nice 68 set and to be staring up at your #2 set for these last couple of months!!!!!
:
I've seen it mentioned as parts of other threads, but thought that it was an interesting enough topic that it deserved its own thread. I heard mention of the Dude and Dav philosohies and I figured that there had to be many, MANY more variations and strategies than that.
What sort of different collecting methods, strategies do you emply to build your collection?
Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Any other facets of your strategy?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Since I'm asking - I'll post my thought...
Right now, I'm working on 12 sets or so - from 64 to 72 Topps along with 64 Giants and 70 Kellogg's.
Of those, I'm most serious about the 72, 71, 67 and 64. The others I'll pick up cards on eBay if the price is low enough.
When I buy on eBay I will not purchase a card lower than PSA 8. But, I submit a lot of my own material to PSA. When I submit, I try to only submit cards that will get PSA 8 or better except 71 when I'll settle for PSA 7 since so many collectors include those in their sets. I try to submit enough at one time so that I can keep 20 - 25% of the submission and then sell of the rest to cover all grading fees and most of the raw card costs. I sell off all cards that I already have or didn't grade out to PSA 8.
I don't work on a budget generally, but I try to keep the costs under the household rader by making money on eBay sales. When cash is tight, I still always buy raw, but I will stop bidding on everything but 72's on eBay. I will NEVER pay whatever it takes to simply win a card. I WILL pay large dollars for cards that I want, but you'll never see a $10K snipe on even a tough 72 card that I need - there is still way too much raw available.
I would consider myself a hybrid collector/investor. I don't consider my card collection an investment, but I do try to minimize the downside by buying VALUE and not overpaying for cards that I need/want. I think the best part about this registry is the comraderie - sure, I may pick on some folks as I pass them or they pass me, but I've had so much fun meeting many of you dweebs from around the country that makes this a great hobby.
Oh... and EJGuru... You don't know how d@mned frustrating it is to be 55% complete on a nice 68 set and to be staring up at your #2 set for these last couple of months!!!!!
: Frank Bakka
Sets - 1970, 1971 and 1972
Always looking for 1972 O-PEE-CHEE Baseball in PSA 9 or 10!
lynnfrank@earthlink.net
outerbankyank on eBay!
Sets - 1970, 1971 and 1972
Always looking for 1972 O-PEE-CHEE Baseball in PSA 9 or 10!
lynnfrank@earthlink.net
outerbankyank on eBay!
0
Comments
<< <i>Right now, I'm working on 12 sets or so - from 64 to 72 Topps along with 64 Giants and 70 Kellogg's. >>
FB, you really are impressing me man.
I like to use the Don Zimmer approach to set collecting: Roll at my competition with a coc.ked fist in search of scoring a 10. Although I often get thrown to the ground with the prices I pay
My main squeeze has always and will always be the 1969 Baseball set. I have dabbled in a few others as a sideline without making any particular progress but recently have gotten myself finally entrenched in one; the 1966 Baseball set.
In both sets I shoot for a minimum grade. The 69' set I try to add 8's and look to achieve an 8 average when all is said and done. The 66' set I am building much like ACOWA is building his 64' set in PSA 7. I even call it "A Tribute to the NRMT Set Builder". I believe wholeheartedly that a NRMT card has always been a sweet example and have set out to assemble my 66' set to prove that. The rest of the reason goes to budget which I will cover below.
A great deal of my material comes from ebay. My weekly schedule does not afford me the time to hunt for raw as much as I would like. I do submit from time to time on registry specials with some of the raw I have been able to acquire. My sets are probably 60% ebay, 20% submit raw, and 20% Misc. such as trades or dealer purchases.
I work on a pretty strict budget. The good news is it forces me to be patient. About the only time I jump outside budget is if a lot comes up for the sets that I collect with an average card price inside budget guidelines, I will often look to layout the big chunk of cash to land that sort of thing and then lay low for a while thereafter to recoup.
Recently I have been spending my money on anything that comes available that I need on ebay. With the 69's I am at 90% complete so they dont come up often. The 66's (I'm at 20%) offer more opp's lately.
I consider myself a collector strictly on the 69's. I have been working on this set for 30+ years; 5 years in graded form and expect it to be with me in upgrade mode well into the future. With the 66's I am alot like Frank in that I am very conscious about getting the cards at a cut rate with a view towards future value.
PSA set building is the ultimate in comradery. I consider all of you on this board, who enjoy this great hobby, my Friends!
We cumulatively maintain the contents of the greatest sportscard museum known to man. We should all be proud to have been and continue to be the caretakers of this valued piece of Sports Americana.
Frank; Thanks for the thread. Will certainly enjoy the comments to come from my Friends.
RayB69Topps
Good thread!! This will make for some interesting reading. I know some people here like to believe they know how someones collecting habits are but unless they are of like mind there is no way they can see what go's on behind the scenes.
Myself I am currently building topps baseball from 52 to 84. I have not registered all my sets yet and will only do so when they are my main squeezes. My 68 set is my favorite with my 69 set second. Both sets are 100% and I always work on upgrades for these sets.I will never be 1 in 68 but that is ok as I dont need to be at the top for I enjoy just looking and reading the cards. I am currently trying to finish my 75 set(93%) and my 65 set(95%). After completion on these I will look towards 67 and 61 or 66. I know this, every time I seem to concentrate on a new set I get a chance to talk to new people who are building that issue.
I have strayed into some very modern issues. I have a 89 score fb set now that is 100%(9.74). I am trying to make this in all 10's. I also have a 89 upper deck bb set I am trying to complete in 10(70%+). I believe to finish either of these in 10 is a challenge. Not because of the rareness of the issue but because of the mistake factor of submitting. I try to buy these from outside sources and have only submitted a handful. You could end up submitting thousands to complete and I would rather let others take the chance and pay the premium.
I am sure you all know I am a Kellogg collector. I just like the issues and think they are neat. I refuse to get into the debates on these but prefer to enjoy them in the privacy of my own home. I feel for the most part these are easy to complete with a few exceptions of individual cards. Certain years are tough but not impossible.
For my strategy on completion. I use about everything avalible to me. I buy on ebay and am aggresive when I reach the end to a set. I generaly buy 8's or better but will settle on a lower grade to finish the completion of a set. I feel you can always upgrade at a later date. I also buy from a number of websites and have a coulple favorites (natex and keppler). I submit raw also and have sent in over 2000 cards this year. I like to buy at shows cause this is were my roots are. I started doing shows in the late 70's in the Detroit area and finished doing them in the Grand rapids area in the early nineties. Now I am simply a buyer. I still have alot of raw from my dealer days and dig through it when time permits. I also am able to pick up deals from thie registry. My 65 set is a result of a big buy from Jay at Quality cards(FIRST CLASS ALL THE WAY) and my 67 set was a result of Acowa and Ejguru helping me also top nothe fellas. I trade with Davillilo. I feel he is a great asset to this board and hobby and have had numerous trades and buy/sells with him. I know some of you dont like him but you know what get over it he is what he is. He is not on this earth to please us. He has a great collection and is a wealth of knowledge. I think this board is made up of different personalities and thats what makes it what it is. I like this board and all the info on it and I thank psa for it. It plays a big part of my buying and selling and my strategy evolves from it.
I really dont have a budget and am a oportunistic buyer. I consider myself a collector and not an invester, I do watch what I pay for the most part and have a limit as to how far I will go. I try not to get into the emotion bidding and feel sniping is the best thing since sliced bread. I thank this board for the education on the snipe.
I will finish with I do appreciate each and everyone here and their knowledge in some or all areas of card collecting and investing. I have learned so much in the time I read these posts and know that if I have a question on certain issues one of you will have the anwser. I will say this I for one will concentrate on making this a better hobby and will give back every chance I get to make it better as it has given so much to me. I felt the rally around Carlos proved that this board is made up of some pretty special individuals. We are what we are in our own way,
Thanks to All
Dave
Thanks,
Steve
This post or my collecting goals will not be as extensive as some others. My main focus is on 1911 T-205 Golds. I am only at a modest 15% registered (with another 3-4% needed to be graded) and have been working on it for about 6-7 months.
I have also almost conquered the 1954 Topps mountain in raw/graded EX+ form, with just a couple of the biggies and 2-3 commons left until completion. 1960 and 1970 Topps are also sets that I have begun in raw form EXMT. But everything has taken a back seat to my little gold beauties.
Unfortunately or fortunately I don't like to pay the huge prices that these pieces of gold often command, so usually I am on the losing end of auctions. But I am patient and want to pay what I want to pay. My collection consists mostly of PSA 4-5, but I have picked up a few ultra cheap/nice looking PSA 3s and one super PSA 6 which I got caught up in emotion. I plan on picking up the variations in super low grade so I don't spend to much.
I think my collection is just that a collection. I display my cards to enjoy them. But I also know that they are an investment and can be sold some day.
Mostly I buy from wherever I can get good deals. I check out ebay but also have picked up a number of cards from other collectors. I have checked out just about every other on-line auction, but only purchased a couple cards from Teletrade.
I definitely don't build this set for competition. I could spend a heck of a lot more if I wanted to, but I just don't see the need to spend 5X the price for a card that's condition is only a tiny bit better in my view. A set of Pre-war tobacco cards in VG/EX condition is just
I think the largest factor in my collection is my patience. I am super disciplined on what I want to pay. Over the last few months the prices of the Gold Borders has gone up quite a bit so that has made new additions tougher to come by.
Lastly, the thing I try and stress most in my collecting, is enjoy what you own. You paid good money for your collection-- enjoy it. I have built a couple shelves that I hung in my home office. On it I have lined all my golds so I can view them. That is a luxury of my small collection.
I'm collecting 16 sets, but only 5 of those am I really active in, and only 2 of those are regular issue sets:
1962 Fleer Football
1989 Score Football
Marcus Allen Basic
Marcus Allen Master
All-time NFL Rushers
My answers to the rest of the questions depend on which set we're talking about.
I have a minimum grade for the '62 set (8) and '89 set (10). 8 is also the max for my '62 set right now, for budget reasons - I've "traded down" in the past to get closer to completing the set. I'm going for a top pop NFL rushers set, ultimately. I'm at the point now where I can't upgrade anything for less than $200, and the Jim Brown will cost me 50 times that
In my '62 set, I've bought most of them on eBay. I've bought a handful in stores and shows, traded for some, and bought a few from websites. I don't have a raw source here; I've perused some dealer binders with poor results. My '89 set was mostly bought from private purchases, except the stars which I bought on eBay. I have a good raw cache here, so as I get close I'll start submitting on my own. At the price I can get 10's, it makes no sense to submit my own yet. My rushers set was almost exclusively eBay. My Allen sets are 90%+ my own submissions, with a few of the early high grades bought on the bay.
I definitely have a budget. I have a price in mind for every card I want, and I won't go over it. I win way less than half of the snipes I queue up.
I decide how to spend my money based on my priorities. My Allen sets will always be my highest priority, and after that it shifts daily
I'm 99% collector. I'll never see the grading fees on my Marcus Allen sets again, and I don't see myself selling any of the cards I love. BUT, I try to get cards as cheaply as possible just to maximize how many I can get
Set building is for both competition and comraderie. Even with my raw Allen set where I often pay sick prices for tough cards, the best part is trading and talking with other Allen collectors. But I still want to have the finest set, at least in the ones I care about the most.
Joe
Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+? - 1 right now..until I get bored or the market is right...sell and start another.
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get? PSA 8 or better for me.
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own? Ebay/Other Collectors.....if find its not worth it to search at shows to get a mid-60's PSA 8s...unless of course the show is in my backyard...then I would go to meet other collectors. When you factor in time, the cost of traveling to a show, having to hunt through all of the non "lock PSA 8 or better" cards.....I would rather stick with already slabbed cards and buy from those dealers on eBay.
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget? Nope..cause I want to make break even or make a some bucks when I sell off. You guys should see what some of the PSA 9 stars sold for 3-4 years ago...glad I didnt buy them back then.
How do you decide what to spend your money on? Whatever is on eBay that day.
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor? Both...but I am not in love with cardboard sealed in plastic...so I will sell to try something else and to keep things fresh.
Is set building for competition or comraderie? Its both...but for me its all about comraderie.
Any other facets of your strategy? Study market trends ad nauseam. Read every major auction catalog and study prices realized....keep a library of said catalogs. Try to learn something everyday from other collectors out there. Learn from your mistakes and have fun!
John
My collecting theory, is constantly changing, evolving, re-directing, or simply confused. I collect some coins, comics, and various other types of sports items, as well as the primary object, baseball cards. I have different approachs to each and different patterns or values for each card set also. My concepts on raw- slabbed- PSA only, vary somewhat on each individual set too.
52 Bowman BB, started in the 80s as collection of extinct teams to match the extinct card size, the Browns and Senators mainly, with some Giants and Dodgers also. now going for a mix of graded and raw from a 6 to 8 shape. 56 Topps BB, have two complete sets and many dupes, for some reason don't want it graded at all, will trade off my 5 or 6 slabs and upgrade one set to a 6-7 style minimum. 57 FB, will be about 1/3 graded when done with a 7 as minimum. 59 Fleer BB, Only getting some cards with picures of Ted I like, will accept other than PSA for this smaller group. 64 BB Giant set, done in raw about a NM+ or 7.5 average. 65 BB, lost interest, have sold some slabbed and some raw already. 73 BB, have 9s, 9OCs, 8s, and 7s, looking for a 7.5 or better average, will probably keep some SGC and GAI slabs. 79 BB, surprisingly tough, wish to get an 8.5 or better average. 80 BB, only keep 8s from my own submissions, buy just 9s, and only at lower prices, going for an 8.67 or better average ( two nines for every eight).
Pondering several BB sets from the 80s; 84 Topps, 87 Topps, and 89 Fleer. They would need a minimum of a 9 to be of any value of course, never can tell if or when they might become something like the 75 set ?? Perhaps now is the time to get em cheap or just throw money away ? Some people collect the 50 state quarters, they are probably not a good investment, only fun, like the hobby is mostly.
Also in my medley are about 7 or 8 reprints sets of BB from T-206 to 54 Topps ( 54s Gold and standard both, I may boast ). These are quite enjoyable to me and allow my spending into more affordable sets. I guess this might disbar me from being a purist collector though.
Purchases / trades are made via ebay, shows, mail order, some fellow board members, and other internet contacts. Money spent is flexible, however for a real bargain it's always available. Set building is almost entirely for personal accomplishment and comrarderie, who wouldn't wish to be number one in any set, or any endeavor for that matter, but being second or thirtysecond is okay if I enjoy the set and the pursuit attached.
<< <i>Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Any other facets of your strategy? >>
I collect under 10.
I collect old vintage in PSA-7 and more modern in PSA-9.
Yes.
When I start a set, I know how much it is going to cost to finish it. If it's going to cost more than I can afford, I don't start.
I buy the cool stuff.
I consider that every dollar I spend is gone forever.
I think that competitive set building is stupid.
When I start a set, I won't buy anything unless I can get it for the lowest price. When it gets hard to find more cards, I start paying in line with everyone else, and tip my hat to anyone who is willing to pay more. When I have a few to go, I pay what I have to to get the cards.
I am picky about stars in particular. There are lots of star cards, so there is not usually any need to panic and pay full market for one. If you don't get your price today, you'll probably get it next week.
I pay some attention to the PSA pop report -- if there are only a couple of cards extant in the grade that I want, I'll be aggressive, but populations tend to grow over time, so I am not as religious about this as some people. If someone tries to talk me into paying 10X SMR for a low pop, I will usually laugh and wait a year.
bruce
Website: http://www.brucemo.com
Email: brucemo@seanet.com
For instance, '67 is easier to find higher graded examples. I've also done much better with raw submissions in that year. Since many of those cards I busted from packs myself over 35 years ago, the less handled, later years held up better. A few years ago, there was such a rush toward '68, I had my best ones graded, sold them off and downgraded my set to NM+ to NM-MT raw. Made a killing. That set is one of my two least favorites anyway.
As I worked backward to earlier years, I bought complete sets and merged them. I also bought raw at very low prices as a former weekend warrior and apprentice to big time dealers. Sold off the lesser condition sets and cards to finance my grading fees.
Result is an investment of substantially less than SMR. Upgrading is clearly the most costly, and therefore, last step in the process. Without regard to which year, here is my cost basis in the sets I collect:
76%
61%
39%
31%
35%
GPA ranges from 7.0 to 8.0+, so I'm an investor in these, by definition.
Approximately half my collection is raw sets, Ex-Mt or better, still in the 9-pocket binder pages. I end up looking at those cards more than the graded ones, so these make me a collector more than an investor.
Almost everything in life is a competition, not the least of which is cards. Any other viewpoint is stupid (back atcha Brucemo).
Other facets of my strategy? Head games, can't you tell?
edited to correct typos.
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Any other facets of your strategy? >>
I collect 1963 Fleer - '64 Topps - '69 Topps and have a 1978 Topps Baseball sets , all complete in raw grade ! I like to buy mainly Psa 8s and 9's when I can afford them ! Will occasionally buy a Psa 7 if I feel that the Pop. of the card is low and difficult to find ! I purchase all my cards thru E-Bay auctions and upgrade my sets thru personal submissions ( planning on making a 100 card commoms submission soon ) ! I USUALLY try to obtain all my E-BAY cards for under the SMR price , but will pay full price if I think the card is exceptionally Nice + well Centered ! Also if its a difficult low Pop. card , I.m willing to go a little above the SMR ! Just recently purchased a 1964 Topps Hal Reniff #36 -N.Y. Yankees card for $78.00 - Pop. of only (7) cards in Psa 8 with none higher ! This card had near perfect centering , which is very difficult to find , and I think it is a High-end 8 ! Of course a week later the same card came up for auction and went for under $45 - but not centered as nice as the one I got ! AS for how I spend my money , MY strategy is to mainly work on up-grading my '64 set and get some good bargains on the other two sets as they come along ! IF I want something , I go after it ! Will usually research E-bay a week in advance to see whats coming up and what I REALL WANT TO HAVE ( I want it all but I've got to be reasonable ) ...... I consider myself a collector , but hope that its also a good investment ! I find it theraputic and challenging to collect baseball cards ! And thou Ive never met any of you , I find these boards to be fun and informative ! Maybe I'll attend a National someday ( never been ) and meet some of you ! Robbie
1963 Fleer
Lou Brock Master Set
<< <i>You guys should see what some of the PSA 9 stars sold for 3-4 years ago...glad I didnt buy them back then. >>
What did they sell for? I assume they were higher than now, so what caused the price decrease?
Frank,
Great Post!!!!
I collect mainly the 56 set in PSA 8 or better.I am contemplating getting into bottom feeding for PSA 8 cards from the 60's.I would like to eventually have a run from 48-79(lifetime project). From my shop owning and show days,I have a nice run of NRMT-MT sets from 74-79 in raw form.Also sets from most of the 80's.
I am trying to stay at PSA 8 grade or higher and don't like plugging in a lower grade but may reevaluate my stance on that position when I get into the newer sets with low pop cards.Right now with the 56 set, there are enough examples in 8 to get the set complete without going crazy with prices.
Buying mostly from e-bay but with the knowledge obtained on these boards,slowly buying from other sources.I have learned an invaluable amount of information about other auctions here.Buy some from other board members and after the national(met some great sources for raw)will start submitting raw again.Started that way at first from e-bay
I am starting to work within a budget more than in the past.I was so excited at first that I was paying crazy prices and making some dealers very happy.I am trying to compile a composite of sales for the 56 set and work at the deals.I am planning on hitting the lottery so that I can throw this budget thing out the window!!
Right now,mostly just the 56's and not in any particular order as far as the cards go,whatever strikes my fancy.If I can buy 9's at a reasonable price,I will buy them first.
I am a collector first and foremost and an investor second because as an investor I will probably not get my money back or at least not make much of a return on my investment.I do look on my collection as a means to save money as I feel that this is money spent that I will always be able to recoup.While I may never get it all back,if you count the enjoyment that I get out of collecting and the time I spend checking out my cards,I am way ahead of the game.
While there certainly is a competitive nature to me,I would say that this hobby is 95% about the comraderie that is associated with collecting.I would like to thank PSA for this board.I look forward to coming here daily and have met some of the best people in the world through this board.It is amazing how diversified the lives of the collectors here are and yet we have the same love(or sickness).
Vic
Here are some examples of PSA 9s that have dropped in price:
1957 Topps 076 Roberto Clemente PSA 9 50/50 L-R, 55/45 T-B Baseball Graded 7/1/1999 $3,795.00
1957 Topps Bob Clemente #076 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $5,290.00
1957 Topps Bob Clemente #076 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $4,946.00
1957 Topps Roberto Clemente #76 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 12/5/2002 $2,185.00
1960 Topps Mickey Mantle All Star#563 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $1,898.00
1960 Topps Mickey Mantle All Star#563 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $1,961.00
1960 Topps Mickey Mantle All Star #563 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 10/5/2001 $909.00
1960 Topps Mickey Mantle AS #563 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 5/4/2003 $911.01
1960 Topps Mickey Mantle AS # 563 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 5/18/2003 $835.00
1960 TOPPS MICKEY MANTLE AS #563 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 6/5/2003 $1,325.00
1954 Bowman Ted Williams #066 PSA 8 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $10,350.00
1954 Bowman Ted Williams #66 PSA 8 Baseball Graded 12/5/2002 $5,291.00
1965 Topps 350 Mickey Mantle PSA 9 50/50 L-R, 45/55 T-B Baseball Graded 7/1/1999 $4,255.00
1965 Topps Mickey Mantle #350 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $6,325.00
1965 Topps #350 Mickey Mantle PSA 9! Baseball Graded 5/4/2003 $2,852.00
1968 Topps 150 Roberto Clemente PSA 9 Baseball Graded 7/1/1999 $2,128.00
1968 Topps Bob (Roberto) Clemente PSA 9 MINT Baseball Graded 9/12/2003 $920.00
1961 Topps Sandy Koufax #344 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $2,567.00
1961 Topps Sandy Koufax #344 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 12/5/2002 $891.00
1959 Topps Bob Clemente #478 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $3,854.00
1959 Topps Roberto Clemente #478 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 10/5/2001 $3,565.00
1959 59 TOPPS #478 CLEMENTE PSA 9 MINT NQ HOF Baseball Graded 8/28/2003 $1,499.99
1959 TOPPS #478 BOB CLEMENTE PSA 9 CENTERED Baseball Graded 8/28/2003 $1,280.00
1963 Topps Mickey Mantle #200 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 9/1/2000 $18,400.00
1963 Topps Mickey Mantle #200 PSA 9 Baseball Graded 12/5/2002 $6,038.00
John
Once upon a time, I got to 94% complete on the 1972 set and then sold it off to work on 1975T (which I completed). I've since sold that set off, and an back to working on 1972 and 1973 Topps. After the first go-round with the 72 set and completing the 1975 set, I've tried to apply some of the lessons learned and it's changed my approach some. When I started second 1972 set I definitely approached it differently than before.
For the second go-round on the 72s. . .
- I set a minimum acceptable grade of PSA8 - and every card must meet MY standards for grade. If I get a slacker PSA8, then it's immediately marked to be upgraded or it doesn't go in my set.
- I set a goal of 8.10 for the overall GPA - for the 72 set, this means about 100 PSA9s give-or-take.
- Quickly identify the "tough" or low-pop cards and be very aggressive on those from the very beginning. Would you rather your last 10% of the set be easy cards or the nearly-impossible ones?
- Don't worry so much about the HOFers - they'll always be available when you're ready for them.
- Bottom-feed the easily available stuff.
- Buy PSA9s when it makes sense and is cost-effective.
- Search for raw examples and submit my own stuff.
- Just as important as knowing what to pay for a card is knowing when to let a card go.
I definitely have to work within a budget, but to this point following this philosophy has worked well. I started the second 72 set on about March 1, 2003. I currently have 70% listed on the Registry - but I have deals completed which will take me to 82% @ about 8.16. That's 647 cards - and I'm currently in for an average of about $13.50 per card. I can say that's dramatically less than I had in the previous set - and the GPA on the first set was only about 7.94 or so.
I've only recently started the 1973 set, so I'm still learning its nuances. But the approach will be similar. What I've been finding so far with the 1973 set is that there's a HUGE variation in quality among PSA8 NQ cards. Some are beautiful and others I'd consider to be closer to a 6. I've also been finding PSA9s tend to be more plentiful than 72s and go for less money. With that set, I'm shooting for a GPA of around 8.20 or so.
Now. . .these may well be the only two sets I build in graded form. When completed, I'll upgrade them at my own pace but won't feel any pressure to do so. But. . .I'll also be assembling raw sets from 1978 to 1984 (covering my childhood) with the minimum condition as "best example possible". I'll just keep those sets raw since right now I don't see a lot of point in grading them out - and I'll upgrade those more on the fly. Who knows, I may well eventually start up a graded 1970 set (year of my birth), but I think I'll have plenty on my plate as it is.
Mike
C). So far most of my purchases have been on eBay. Not a lot of local sellers have the Refractors I need, and want full book and then some on the older cards.
D). I work within a budget, but pay whatever it takes withing the budget. For example: The week that I bought the Robinson Autograph for $240 I had to pass on some other cards I liked just as much just to make sure I had enough to bid whatever if took to get the card at the end of the auction.
E). See D.
F). Collector first.
<< <i>Guys,
What sort of different collecting methods, strategies do you emply to build your collection?
Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Any other facets of your strategy?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
I have minimum grades for what I'll submit, but at the right price, I'll buy any grade.
I buy from a wide mixture of sources, and seldom submit on my own.
I work on a budget. Heck, I bottom feed.
Few cards to me are "have to have it now". I look for the best deals.
I'm a collector.
To me, set building isn't about competing with others. It's about reaching a defined goal: completion.
I don't really have a strategy. I also buy far more raw than graded, and mix modern with vintage, and memorabilia with everything else. I buy what I like.
Nick
Reap the whirlwind.
Need to buy something for the wife or girlfriend? Check out Vintage Designer Clothing.
I love this post!!!!! Great inside look on some of the people on this board. Ok, so here I go.
I collect 5 sets right now. The '86 topps football, '63 topps football, team of the 80's set, and my reggie white basic and master set. I love all of these sets for different reasons. The '86 set I collect for the reason of reggie white's rookie being in there on top of that it's one of the key sets from my kid years. Being born in 1982 doesn't leave alot of "vintage" cards to collect that I've been alive for. lol The '63 set is because it has my second favorite player, Ray Nitschke. I also like the design of the cards. I collect the team of the 80's set because these are the players I grew up watching so it only felt right. Now, the reggie white sets are because he is by far my favorite player and I have always loved watching him play. I don't really set a limit because of a limited funding, being in college and all. But I do try to collect 7's or above. So far so good with that. I typically buy on ebay because of a) the best deals and b) there are no quality shops around me. I choose what to spend by how much I have left over in my pocket after paying bills and eating.
I hope I shed a little light on myself for all of the others that want to read this post.
Josh
To my surprise, I have 21 sets registered. I would say I actively work on about half. 9 of the sets are Saints team sets - 1967 through 1975. I also have the Archie Manning Master and Basic sets. I'm working on 55 Bowman, 61 Topps, 61 Nu Card and 70 Topps Football sets, 64 Giants Baseball, and several oddball Saints sets. I also have some non sport sets - 44 American Beauties, 56 and 72 Topps Presidents, and 59 Fleer Indians.
2. Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
It depends on the set. For 55 Bowman I'm trying for 7s and will not buy or register anything less. When I submit and it comes back less, I sell it. The same is true for 61 Topps, NuCard, and 70 Topps football and 64 Giants, though the minimum grade is 8. For my saints sets I am continously submitting and looking for upgrades, but I will register whatever I have until I can upgrade. In my Archie Manning sets I have several oddball cards in which I have all of the examples that have been graded - because I submitted them. For the non sport sets I just try to finish the set in whatever grade I can- usually by my own submission.
3. Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
All of the above. I usually have at least one submission every month, though they are sometiomes small. I buy on ebay and from a variety of dealers, both raw and graded.
4. Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
Depends on the card and set. For most of my sets I have a budget in mind for what I am willing to pay. Sometimes I get caught up in the chase and ignore the budget, but usually I stick to it. For low pop. high grade Saints cards I will often overspend, and sometimes still get outbid.
5. Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
I am a collector. Unless dissaster strikes, my kids will be selling my cards after I die. I collect for fun and to keep. I sell excess on ebay, but I do not intend to sell any of these sets or my raw sets. (I have raw football sets from 1955 to present and baseball from 1958 to present). The same is true of my Saints memorabilia collection.
6. Is set building for competition or comraderie?
I was putting together sets long before the set registry existed and I'll be doing it when the set registry is gone. I enjoy having the best Archie Manning collection on the resitry, but I know collectors with Archie collections that put mine to shame. The registry is just a fun way to keep track and learn about other sets, not a competition.
Currently working on three sets. 1934 Goudey Baseball, 1981 Fleer Baseball and Gaylord Perry Master Set. Haven't done much with the latter two. There are alot of 34 Goudey Baseball on Ebay and I wanted to collect it since Mel Harder was a player from that year. He lived in my town and I wanted to have a set showing the players that he played with. I have numerous autographs from him plus pictures taken with him and my son when my son was about 2 years old. He is now 15. The 1981 Fleer Baseball set was one of my favorites. It is relatively cheap to buy vending and unopened wax. My initial goal is a complete set in 9 and 10, but in the long run a complete 10 set. I currently have about 148 PSA 10 cards in my set. There are cards that are extremely hard to find in 9 or 10 condition. The three hardest (and I think I'm beginning to be an expert on this set after going through 60,000 cards) is Charlie Spikes, Brian Kingman and Steve Carlton (#660). The last set is the Gaylord Perry Master Set. Gaylord Perry was my favorite player. I believe he was the last Indian's Pitcher to have a 20 game winner. I remember writing him a letter after that year (1972 or 75?) and got a post card back from him signed in a black flair marker. I still have the post card.
2. Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
My goal when sending them in is to get at least a 9, to make the grading costs worth it. I've had some troubles with some cards coming back 8's and in some cases 4's and 5's. Everyone should invest in a desk lamp where you can really see creases, etc. There seems to be alot of cards that have creases, printing lines, and printing flaws in the 81 Set. As far as the Goudey goes, I look for at least 3's and only can afford to go up to 5's. As far as the Gaylord Perry Set, I've only started, but that would be 8's for the older cards (60's) and 9's for the 70's and later.
3. Do you buy from dealers, Ebay, other sources or submit your own?
Mostly submit my own. I bought some cards for the 81 Fleer Set off various sites and when they came back (they were described as mint/near mint) they were off centered, some of the checklist cards had been checked off in pen, etc. So, I like to collect raw and submit them.
4. Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
As far as the 81 Set goes, I work within a budget. I saw one Harold Baines PSA 10 card sell for over $300.00. Several days later, one sold for under $10.00. I figure there enough cards out there that I can wait. The only cards that I would actively pursue at all costs is the Pete Rose #1 PSA 10. It is a hard card to find in 10. I have all the other star cards in 10, with the exception of the #660 Steve Carlton. For the Goudey set, I look at the raw on the ebay and bid accordingly and then send in for grading. Not actively looking for the Perry Cards, but look for bargains on ebay.
5. Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Both. I'd like to put the 81 Fleer Set away for my kids, especially if I can complete it in all 10's. In 40 years it may be worth something. The Goudey Set is just for collecting purposes and the Perry Set is a collector set.
6. Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Both. I like to see that I have the finest #1 Set for 81 Fleer Baseball. I've traded and have made some friendships with trading some high end 81 Cards. I like to read the PSA Board, but don't have the knowledge that alot of you have.
1st Finest Set - 1981 Baseball Fleer Master - Retired
1st Finest Set - 1955 Baseball Golden Stamps - Cleveland Indians - Retired
1st Finest Set - Mel Harder Baseball Master - Active
Mel Harder Showcase Set - Active
#15 on Current Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
#23 on All Time Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Any other facets of your strategy?
Nice topic. I'm working on a run of Topps baseball sets from 1952-1980 with the late 70s remaining in raw form. My main focus has been on the 1968-75 sets which are complete in raw/partially graded form. My 1969 set is 100% graded and just shy of 8.10 GPA.
My minimum grade is PSA 8. If I get 7s, they are from my own submissions and I usually sell them off or register them in my sets until I can upgrade.
I mostly purchase raw cards and grade them myself. I initially built the 1968-80 sets in raw form. For the early 50s sets, I'll most likely have to settle for already graded cards.
I try to work within a budget. I typically don't buy 9s or 10s which saves me quite a bit of money. I'm willing to be patient and wait for the big fish to nab a rare common at record prices before I make a play for it.
I consider myself a collector first but I also try to purchase cards at prices that I think the market can support long term. I also incorporate the Frank Bakka model whereby I grade out multiples of the same card and sell off dupicates to cover the majority of my grading fees. My 1973 set is complete and over 25% graded at 8.44 and I actually made more on selling duplicates than I paid for my own set, including superstar 9s that I graded from raw. I'd love to repeat this model but it's getting tougher to find mint raw cards.
Set building is for my own enjoyment and for the comraderie in discussing collecting with others on these forums.
Just to further explain my set building strategy, I'll take my 1969 set as an example. I first completed it in raw form. Then I graded out the star cards. I then replaced the few stars that graded below 8 with other 8s bought on eBay or through duplicate submissions. I then graded out blocks of commons over a two year period until the set was completely graded. I didn't submit the fillers which were a handful of EX to EX-MT cards, but I did grade out any that were at least NM. I ended up with about 75 cards that graded NM or less. During this process I searched for cards on eBay to upgrade the 7s and also continued to pursue more raw material. I'm currently down to needing 16 cards to be all NM-MT or better (counting two upgrades from my recent submission). Part of the "buying wisely" strategy is to not overpay for a card just because I'm getting close to completion. For example, if someone were to notice that I need a #53 Sonny Jackson and they list one on eBay with a $30 minimum price, they won't get a bid from me. The card is easy to find but I just haven't seen one lately with a reasonable starting bid. I also grade out multiple copies of the same card to continue upgrading my set. For some cards, I have handled a half dozen 8s and picked the best for my set. So many of the 8s end up being very high end. I even get the bonus of an occassional 9. I've also been fortunate to grade out multiples of some real tough cards like the Tom Satriano which goes a long way in offsetting the costs of grading the set out.
When I'm done building the set (well, I'll never be fully finished with it), I'll go through and figure out what I've spent. With all the duplicates I've sold during the process, I think I will end up building it for a very reasonable amount.
Presently, I am actively working on two sets in graded form. A George Brett (both Basic and Master) Player Set and the 1973 Topps Set (I am at 10%, but have not yet registered it). In addition to completing my George Brett collection, my goal is to nail a run of 1973-77 Topps sets, one set at a time, in PSA 8 or better. I bought my first wax pack in 1973 and quit collecting in 1978 (only to become hooked again in 1986). I also have a complete run of Topps sets from 1978-present, in raw form, ranging from Near Mint to Mint in condition, which I upgrade from time to time. I also collect, as time and funds permit, 2001 Topps Archives autographs, 2003 Topps Fan Favorites autographs, and baseballs autographed by Hall of Famers.
2. Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
My goal for the Bretts is to snag the best card I can within reason (or whatever I can rationalize). My goal for the '73s is a GPA between 8.10 and 8.20. My minimum acceptable card is PSA 8, but each card must also meet my requirements for centering and clarity. I let the grade dictate the corners. I would rather have a well-centered, nicely focused PSA 8 with NM-MT corners than a razor sharp PSA 9 that is off center or out of focus.
3. Do you buy from dealers, e-Bay, other sources, or submit on your own?
I buy almost exclusively on e-Bay. I have out of necessity submitted a number of my own Bretts (mostly odd-ball stuff that I have gathered over the years).
4. Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
I work loosely within a budget. On the '73s I shoot for 75% of SMR on PSA 8s that I like and for 50% of SMR for PSA 9s that I like. Then, if I get a good score like a PSA 9 for 25%, then I will up the ante on a PSA 9 I really want to 75% of SMR. I use the same philosophy for PSA 8s. However, I will occasionally treat myself to a card I just have to have at or above SMR. With the Bretts, except for the occasional wild card, I generally know what will win the card and bid accordingly. I get less than 50% of the '73s that I bid on, but I get more than 75% of the Bretts that I bid on.
The Bretts take precedence. However, as I have hit 85% on the Brett basic registry and 60% on the master registry, Brett cards I need appear with lesser frequency on e-Bay. Consequently, I find my focus slowly gravitating toward the '73s.
5. Do you consider yourself a collector or an investor?
I am a collector, period. Having collected for over 20 years, I just recently sold my first card EVER (as a condition of my wife's approval for my jump into the '73, I am required to liquidate some of my excess). My kids can have or sell my cards when I'm gone.
6. Is set building for competition or for camaraderie?
I collect neither for the purposes of competition nor for camaraderie. I collect because I collect.
Thanks
Randy
pebblyjack
___________________________________
Always buying George Brett PSA Gem Mint cards!!
Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Any other facets of your strategy?***
This is a cool post, I get to do some reading now.
Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
I collect about 10 sets.
Currently registred on PSA is my 1959 PSA 8 Fleer Ted set, T206 White Border set, Hall of Fame Autograph set, Hall of fame set, and 1999 Sports Illustrated Autograph set.
Currently not registred in PSA:
Hall of Fame Football Autograph set
Hall of Fame Basketball Autograph set
Hall of Fame Hockey Autograph set
2003 Yankees Signature set
Nonsports- Lord of the Rings Autograph set
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
I basically plug in what ever I can get my hands on. I do submit alot of autographs cards to PSA/DNA and when I get a higher grade I replace and plug in the holes in my set.
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
I do all of the above, I find I can find better stuff on ebay. Since ebays the worlds larges garage sale!
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
I have a budget, but if I ever win Super Lotto, who knows what damage I can do...
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
I'm currently working on plugging in holes in my set, if I see a card I don't have, I usually watch the auction until the last minute, and then snipe it. (I don't like using my auto snipe because there were alot of times I put in a max bid and then at the last minute I decided I didn't want the item or someone e-mailed me saying thats a forged autograph and theres no way you can get out of it.) So I stopped using my sniper, it's safer. That saved my butt many times from making a BIG mistake.
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
I consider myself both, sports cards always going be in demand, there are cards I like and when I need the money I have no problem getting what I can. For example, recently I sold of my collection of PSA graded T206 cards I picked up many cards for $30 & $40. PSA 4's and 5's and a few 6's and 7's I was ranked number 6 in the registry, I spend about $4,500. when my son was born on May 6th I needed so diaper cash, so I decided to sell my collection of 166 PSA cards I broke them up and put them on ebay. I quickly was getting $60. to $100. per card and I made almost $9000. which blew me away. Now I'm back to collecting them again. Why not, if I got that much, why try for it again.
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
I build my set as an enjoyment, it makes me feel like a kid again. Story "when I was a child, my dad took me and my brother to a yardsale and I remember buying my 1st unopened box of Baseball cards, I was very young and my dad bought the whole box for me for less than a dollar. It was the 1963 Topps unopened box. I remember opening them and they looked so cool, I was playing with them and trading them with my brother and we were putting them on our Bicycle spokes because they made it sound cool. My dad saw this and got mad, and said give me those cards. He took them from us and put them all in a photo album and we never got to touch them, we saw them from time to time, but we were allowed to take them out of the album or we'd get a spanking. Some years late as my brothers and I went into college, we were cleaning out our attic to have a Giant Yard sale, and low and behold we found all our old Baseball cards in Near Mint condition. Those I kept and I remember some years back when PSA just started I think it was like in 1992 and I sent in alot of cards for grading, I recieved alot of 7's and 8's it was really something. But like an idiot, I took them to a card show and sold them. My brother still has a few cards stashed in his collection somewhere. Thats how I started collecting again for my enjoyment and memories of my childhood days.
Any other facets of your strategy?
I say collect what you enjoy, who cares what other say about your collection, if you like a certain player go get it. It doesn't matter what your collection is worth, just have fun.
Jery
1. I collect 3-4 sets: 1950 Bowman baseball, 1959 Topps 'thrills' subset #461-470, T206 HOFers with rarer backs, and my 1973s off and on.
2. Pre war grade: 5 (I'll only go higher if I think it's a good deal- after which, I usually don't hold onto for more than a few months before I resell it, hopefully for a profit!)
3. No major shows down here in San Diego. Even the ones up in LA were starting to get stale when I left recently. That leaves me with mainly getting things off of eBay. Occasionally, I'll submit cards from my own collections. I've still got quite a bit of 1950 Bowman and 1973 Topps waiting to be graded.
(Some of you know that I recently bought my first house so my top collections - 1953 '73 Topps Reprints, 1950 Bowman Football PSA 8s, etc. have all been sold!)
4. I usually stick to a budget when bidding on eBay or on a dealer's auction (ie. Superior, Mile High, etc.) Especially when it's higher end stuff. I'm mainly investing in it to make a profit later. Only with my 50 Bowman baseballs and 59 Thrills do I really look for lower end, well centered copies for my own collection (and to pass on to my grand kids!)
5. Set building should be for comraderie, but competition is a fact of life.
Go Cubs! Go Sox!
1. Jacques Plante master set
2. 1979 Topps HK
3. HOF hockey
4. 1990 UD HK (cause it was the first set i collected as a kid)
Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
I think I will be working on the set from 1960-1971 (that's 12). I started building sets when I was teenager back in the 1970s and was heavily involved in the business/hobby throughout much of the 1980s. I got the 1960 set over halfway and completed (or close to completing) 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971 (plus 1973, 1974, 1976, 1977). Add to that 1969 and 1970 football. All in raw form obviously. I would like to have all of the Topps cards from 1960-1971 at least, and probably all the way to 1977.
I am also intrigued by the player sets and can easily work on and complete a Tony Gwynn basic/master set (if I can stomach all of the 1990s releases) plus a Johnny Bench basic/master set.
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
No minimum right now. I take a look at the effort and cost involved in compiling a graded set (let alone 12) and I get very intimidated.
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
Right now, it's all eBay for raw cards. I just back into this recently and I've been having fun getting raw lots for the years 1960-1971. It reminds me of the old days. But I have been learning the lesson that Ex-NrMt really means VG-Ex. In the meantime, I have been going through every card of my collection and building a database so I can figure out what to submit and eventually sell (if I can find the courage).
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
In the past 7 years, my hobby has been computers and computer games. The money that I have been using to buy eBay lots came out the money I had earmarked for yet another do-it-yourself PC upgrade (MB, CPU and RAM). My wife doesn't know how many $100s I have spent in the past 2 weeks but I will hopefully get all of that back in sales so I can keep the buy/sell chain going.
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
I haven't yet. All I know how to do is to build raw sets.
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Both. My collection had been sitting in a dark closet for 15 years, waiting for them to get old enough to be worth some money. But during that time, the whole business changed. I want to sell to make money because that's fun but for now, just continuing where I had left off in the 1980s is all I know and can do.
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
The journey is the reward.
Thanks for the kind words. The recent thread that characterized the way I collect is ridiculous and meant to be insulting. We will continue to do business I am sure. I am only concerned what serious collectors or dealers say--people who post under numerous identities or who appear on the boards only to attack someone I could care less about.
Congrats on your 1968 set. It is simply unbelievable how quickly you have gotten to the 9.00 set rating. A great accomplishment.
I will try to post a response here when I have a little more time.
Davalillo
Currently I have 4 graded sets that I'm working on, each from a different decade. Not that I started out to do this, but it just worked out that way. First is my baby, 1953 Topps. This is my main set and gets the majority of my attention and funds. When items are slow on ebay I'll keep the other sets in mind, here they are: 1941 PlayBall, 1964 Topps Giants, and 1973 Topps 53 Reprints. The Reprints set just kind of ties into my 53 addiction. And I don't really have the stomach to attack a 600-700 card set from the 60's, so I thought the Giants gave me a great collection of stars in an attainable 60 card set.
Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
I set 8's as my standard, even in the 41 PlayBalls, even though that is not very realistic. But I don't have a timeframe for finishing it, so anything is possible. The 1964 Giants I try to get the stars in 9 and the commons in 8. Because the average grade seems to be higher for this issue and 9's don't cost you an arm and a leg.
Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
All 3, I have submitted a bunch of my raw cards from years of collecting and still have a bunch to go in the 60's and 70's. The majority comes from EBAY, but I have made friendships with many dealers who are willing to work with me because I keep coming back for more purchases. And the prices being paid on EBAY for many 53's are so far fetched, a dealer with a 20% markup over SMR is the better deal. Plus I like the old fashion route of going to shows and digging for the cards I need.
Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget? Budget, I usually have a percentage over or under SMR I won't exceed. It's based on the issue. I am willing to go a little higher if I have seen proof of the toughness of a card. But if it is going to take $1000's to by a common for my 53 set, I'm dropping to a 6 or 7 or searching one out to submit for myself. Perfect example, 1953 Topps Willie Jones PSA 8, one of the hardest cards to find in the set, POP 6. It's an $85 card, I can't ever remember it appearing on EBAY, I know a dealer with one for $2500. And believe it or not if he put it on Ebay he would probably get that price, easy! I found one at the national raw for $15, nice looking an very well centered. Submitted and got a 6, and I'm proud to have it as the only 6 in my set!
How do you decide what to spend your money on?
53's always come first.
Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Definitely a collector since I've been doing this for 30 of my 36 years. But also I realize I don't have huge wads of cash to just throw away. So I try to buy isssues and grades I feel will hold their value and at least get me my money back. And believe it or not this is usually the case. Granted I have 100 Juan Gonzalez rookies that I can't get 25% of my purchase price for, but these are offset by the 85 Topps McGwire I know I got from a pack in 85 that graded a 10 last year.
Is set building for competition or comraderie?
For my personal enjoyment, but I like the comraderie at shows and on these boards. And I do like passing someone and moving up a rank, even if I don't brag about it.
Any other facets of your strategy?
Just trying to figure out when my son will be old enough to attend his first show and not ransack a dealers table!
Thanks,
Bruce
1953 Topps in PSA 8
1941 Playball in PSA 8.
1952-1955 Red Man cards in 7 and 8
1950 Bowman in PSA 8
I paid book prices for the 8s--maybe an average of a $50 premium for the 9s and when they then rolled out a couple of prewar 10s and wanted an additional $25 premium over the 9s I said you have got to be kidding. Ten years later both are still active in the business.
In ensuing years I had my stars graded and eventually had raw cards I bought from 52 and 53 Topps graded. I couldn't believe it when I got on the registry and saw that collectors were trying to put together graded sets from the 1960s. Over the next year I spent megadollars on grading fees and now have some 20,000 graded cards.
Currently I have 144 sets up on the registry(114 sets and 30 sets that are either player sets or hall of fame sets or something like that).
Every set I have I am attempting to collect in psa 8 or better. I have never bought a card graded less than an 8. The fact that many of my sets have an average grade of less than 8 reflects that cards that I submitted that I thought had a chance of an 8 came back less.
A central part of my strategy has been to submit raw cards that I thought had a chance of an 8--given the volume of cards I have submitted, I do not look at my cards carefully--thus, I do get some 5s and 6s. I treat replacing anything less than an 8 and adding a missing card with equal priority. On a small number of sets that appear plentiful in 9, I try to complete in psa 9.
I also have a couple hundred or more raw sets and am submitting before year-end and will submit 13 new baseball sets, 5 new football sets, 3 basketball sets and i hockey set that I will attempt to complete in psa 8 or better.
Currently, I think I have completed about 10 sets in psa 8 or better. I tend not to pay up for low pop cards--in fact I will even sell low pop cards at a huge premium to free up more funds with the hope they will come down as examples become more plentiful. This explains why I have not completed more sets. I am less than 10 cards away from completing a large number of sets and have made one of my collecting goals for 2003 the completion of more sets.
I have set a goal of completing over 100 sets in psa 8 or better. I do not see most sets from the 1960s being difficult to accomplish. The 50s and pre-war is another matter. While I will never have the highest set rating in every set, I hope to make my mark on the hobby by having by far the most complete high quality graded sets of anyone out there.
My collecting focus is as follows.
Baseball prewar--while I have a large number of sets partially complete, my focus is on 33 Goudey Sports Kings, 34 goudey, 36 S&S, 34-36 Diamond Stars, 38 Goudey and 39,40 and 41 Play Ball.
Baseball Post war-Every major and specialty set 1948-68 and selected ones post 1968.
Football-Every major and specialty set through the mid 1960s.
Basketball--every major and specialty set through mid 70s
Hockey--Lot of raw sets in here but currently taking selected approach
Non-Sports-40 raw sets but holding off on getting graded.
I do work within a budget. Whereas I used to buy almost entirely from major dealers, more and more I buy from collectors on the registry including several people who post on this board. I also authorize different dealers to buy cards on my behalf at predetermined prices. Certain of those dealers also put my duplicates up on ebay or buy them outright.
I am a collector first and an investor second.
I do not build sets for the camaraderie--more self-satisfaction with an element of competition. I would probably be much more into the competitive aspect of it if I was not working on so many sets.
The thrill to me is not in the chase or in the journey as it is for many others. I want to own the cards and complete sets.
Lastly, I love the hobby as much as anyone.
Davalillo(named of course for that superstar outfielder of the 1960s and 1970s Vic Davalillo)
Being a lifelong collector of the 69' set I feel it contains some unique challenges even for an advanced set collector like yourself. There are nuances about this set that make it, in my estimation, more difficult overall than some of the other 60's issues to complete in an 8 plus grade.
Your comments about the set would be appreciated and perhaps insightful. Thanks.
Regards
RayB69Topps
1. Do you collect one set, 10 sets or 100+?
My focus at the moment is on 1934 Goudey and Hockey HOF. Secondary collections are Baseball HOF, Baseball Managers HOF, Football HOF, and Basketball HOF. I have a lot of these in raw form and will grade them at a later date. I also upgrade some of these occasionally if the mood strikes me or a good opportunity comes around. I dabble in Lou Gehrig Set, 1933-34 Lou Gehrig Goudey Set, Gretzky Master Set, HOF Red Sox, and HOF Yankees. I also have over 340 complete sets in raw form from 1968 up. I will never grade any of these sets, just the key cards.
2. Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
It depends on the set or era of the card. Because I only really buy pre-war cards I tend to buy what I can get and then upgrade as I go. For Hall of Famers from 1960's and up I go for high grade rookies.
3. Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
I do it all as log as I trust the source.
4. Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
I go with my heart for the most part. However, we all have a line we won't cross. I think that line changes from day-to-day and card-to-card.
5. How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Availability of the card. If I can find the card I need at a price I can deal with...I pull the trigger.
6. Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
Collector all the way. I only sell cards I've upgraded.
7. Is set building for competition or comraderie?
My first reaction was to say the comraderie. During my 27 years of collecting I've never really had "friends" that were "serious" collectors before I joined PSA and the set registry. But I'd be lying if I didn't ackowledge my ego comes into play as well.
8. Any other facets of your strategy?
For the vintage cards my goal has always been to complete the set in mid-grade and then upgrade later. That's worked well for the '34 Goudeys. For the Hockey HOF'ers it seems I may be stuck on mid-grade cards for the pre-war stuff because there are rarely any high grade examples existing.
I am a Topps only collector that is working on just 1 graded set, 1969. I have found that there is a lot that I have to learn about collecting graded cards so, for now, it's best if I stick to one set. In raw format I am trying to complete sets from 1965 to 1968 and 1970 through 1972. I have complete raw sets from 1969 and 1973 through 2003.
2. Do you set a minimum grade for your sets or plug in whatever you get?
I have set a minimum grade of 7 for my 1969 set but a few of the stars I submitted recently were a 6. Upgrading them now is not a priority, I'd rather work on the completion % first.
3. Do you buy from dealers, eBay, other sources or submit on your own?
I buy almost all of my cards from eBay. One dealer that I trust is Mickey's sportscards and I have bought some nice raw cards from his website.
4. Do you pay whatever it takes or do you work with a budget?
I am the classic bottom feeder. Since I only have a little over 100 cards graded, if I can pick up a card for less than the cost of grading, I'll buy it. I will then put the ungraded card in my backup set. Eventually I will go through the second set to see if any are better than the cards in the graded set. If a difficult card comes up with a reasonable BIN price, I will spend the money. I got a great deal on a tough to get 1969 Carl Yastrzemski in a PSA 8 by reacting quickly.
5. How do you decide what to spend your money on?
Right now the only cards I have been buying are 69s. I recently completed one set and I am 16 cards away from completing the backup set. I'll buy inexpensive graded ones now.
6. Do you consider yourself a collector or investor?
I have been buying baseball cards for almost 30 years with absolutely no thought of resale. I become very attached to my cards and I won't part with any of them until I have an upgraded version. I would be a lousy baseball card investor.
7. Is set building for competition or comraderie?
Neither. Set building has always been about self-satisfaction. The sense of accomplishment when the last card is plugged into the set is awesome. If it were about competition, I couldn't buy 7s. Camaraderie, if it is acheived during the course of building a set, is a welcome bonus.
8. Any other facets of your strategy?
Since I don't consider my cards to be an investment and I don't have the desire to be #1 on the list, my strategy can be simply considered "the most for the least".
I have the 1969 set raw complete in nrmt-mt but there are cards with centering issues. I think it is a great set. The only reason I have not had it graded is these sets over 600 cards are big time users to try to complete. With so many other sets to complete, I would rather try to knock off some sets(especially some larger 1960s set before adding another. On the other hand, having a graded set collection that goes through the 60s seems much more logical than just bending it in 1968 so probably I will submit the well centered cards in 2004. Thanks for asking.
Davalillo
For what it's worth,
Doug
This is exactly the kind of things I've been trying to learn about different strategies.
Plus, it makes me realize that my original post had some holes in it.
After reading some of the posts and talking to some folks on the subject I realize that there is a whole nother group of folks that I would categorize as "builders". These are folks who are in this more for the thrill of the chase and then sell off their sets in the end.
Doug - I like your strategy and I used to employ it by buying multiple raw sets and combining them before starting to grade. Thats how I started the 72 set.
I'm also finding that I don't mind selling off 1/1 PSA 9's for sets that I wouldn't consider "primary". This has helped me raise money to further the addiction!
Sets - 1970, 1971 and 1972
Always looking for 1972 O-PEE-CHEE Baseball in PSA 9 or 10!
lynnfrank@earthlink.net
outerbankyank on eBay!