Is this is shill bidding by B&M?

clackamas

I bid on 1 coin, and only bid once. I get a notice that I have been outbid and think "oh well I did not really want it it was just cheap". Then I get a notice that I actually won. How could I have won if I had been outbid? Should I not get a notice of a bid retraction?


I bid on a coin here are the details:

********************************
Email I rcvd:
Local time: September 25, 2003 6:33 PM PST.

Thank you for bidding in auction # 11533 - Kingswood Coin Auctions " The
Orleans Sale"

This message is a confirmation that your bid has been received. There is no
need to reply.

The details of your bid are included below for your reference.


*****************************************

Local Time: September 25, 2003 6:34 PM PST.

Dear Brian Maguire,

YOU HAVE JUST BEEN OUTBID! Your item information is below.
Please verify that the information is correct. If you want to bid again,
use the speed link at the bottom of this message.

Auction #: 11533
Auction Closes: Thursday, September 25, 2003 7:00 PM PST.

**************************************
I never bid again.

***************************************

Subject: ACU - Auction Results from Kingswood Coin Auctions " The Orleans
Sale"

Local time: September, 26, 2003 02:41 PM

Congratulations! You have won the following lots in Auction # 11533 which
ended
September, 25, 2003 07:00 PM Pacific time.

Stuart

Brian: What was the coin and the price that you bid for it?

eagle7

I dont know about B&M but Heritage will revert to the next lower bidder if someone retracts a bid. At least you got the coin for your bid. Look at the bright side!

jacktheknife

I'm not so sure there wasn't shill bidding last night, given the prices of some of the Lincolns.

clackamas

>>>Brian: What was the coin and the price that you bid for it?

Lot# 107 - 1972-S Lincoln Cent MS-66 RD (PCGS)

It was a cheap coin, actually a decent deal, so I am not upset. I get the coin for my bid but they asked me to bid again when it was not needed.

Russ

Probably just a bid retraction.

Russ, NCNE

LAWMAN

In California, if the seller, without notice to the buyers secretly bids on his own goods, Cal. Com. Code § 2328(4) permits the buyer to do the following: (1) avoid the sale, or (2) take the goods at the last good faith bid. (Since it is a provision of the Commercial Code enacted in most other states, many states may have the same law). Are you saying this is what you think happened?

coinguy1

Clackamas,

Regarding your Kingswood situation - my guess is that one of the following occcurred:

1) A legitimate bidder bid (intentionally or in error) and later retracted his bid.

2) A consignor put in a reserve bid, saw that the coin wasn't going to sell and withdrew his reserve bid.

3) The bid that temporarily topped yours was somehow entered in error by Kingswood.

Under the circumstances, I would not feel comfortable being the winning bidder, without a suitable explanation from Kingswood. They have always been very friendly and helpful when I have spoken with them - I'd recommend that you call them to discuss your situation.

Mark

15 or so months ago, I won a 1918-S MS66FB dime from Kingswood in exactly the same way: I bid, was outbid, and then got an invoice telling me to submit the amount of my winning bid (which was my maximum bid). I was very surprised when the invoice showed up in my email! But I was also pleased. I never questioned the invoice for fear that perhaps I actually was outbid!!

Mark

fountainheadgold

How do you retract a bid at heritage, i tried and could not do it???

EVillageProwler

I agree with Mark Feld that you should withhold judgement until you make a sincere effort to contact the Kingswood folks with your concern. I think the Kingswood folks are reasonable, and I wish you the best!

EVP

jdimmick

Fountain head,

Since your PM is not on, Ill post it.

Once I bidded on an item in the heritage sale, and recieved some additional info about the coin in question. At that Point I wish I had not bidded. I simply called them and ask to have my bid retracted, which they had no problem with. I have only done that once, and its been a year or so ago. I wouldnt recommend doing it often though, you may be not allowed to bid!!

northcoin

Check out my prior thread on the same topic with the same experience in the recent B&M Rarities Sale. Just put in the phrase "weird auction" in search.