Should the VF 35 grade be used ?

Merc

How many of you have coins graded VF35? Do you feel this grade should be used? I can see coins as VF20 or Ef40. Some coins are nice VF but not quite Ef40 so I see the VF30 grade as being valid. Is the VF35 grade splitting hairs? The ANA grading book doesn't define this grade. How can you define a coin that is better than a strong VF VF30 but not good enough to make Ef40?

If you have VF35 coins, do you crack them out to try for a EF40?

wingedliberty

There are some series that are exceedingly prone to being on the cusp between VF-XF. These include Bust , Seated , and Barber halves in particular. I think its perfectly justifiable to use this grade, as for resubmissions, the individual merits of the coin have to be examined and your reason for the resub.

longtimecollector

I think 35 is valid..... and the difference between 35 and 40 is IMHO much more defineable than the difference between 66 and 67

Placid

VF-20
This is for "Very Fine" (the grade) and "20" (the numerical designation of the grade). Wing feathers show most of their detail, lettering is readable but sometimes indistinct and some minor detail is sometimes separate but usually blended.

VF-25
This is for "Very Fine" (the grade) and "25" (the numerical designation of the grade). In this grade about 60% of the original detail is evident, with the major devices being clear and distinct.

VF-30
This is for "Very Fine" (the grade) and "30" (the numerical designation of the grade). The devices are sharp with only a small amount of blending. Up to 75% of the original detail is evident.

VF-35
This is for "Very Fine" (the grade) and "35" (the numerical designation of the grade). This grade used to be called VF/EF (or VF/XF) before numerical grading was accepted throughout the hobby. Devices are sharp and clear and up to 80% of the detail is in evidence.

EF-40
This is for "Extremely Fine' (the grade) and "40" (the numerical designation of the grade). Also called XF-40. About 90% of the original detail is still evident and the devices are sharp and clear.

DennisH

With Morgan dollars, VF35 is absolutely an appropriate grade!

ANACS doesn't know how to use it correctly -- to them anything that doesn't have lustre but is mostly white is VF35 -- but a PCGS VF35 Morgan is very often a dandy coin that makes your brain wonder, "XF????"

-- Dennis

ARCO

Absolutey it is useful. The VF grades constitute the biggest spread in the 0-70 scale. That is twenty grading points. Surely a VF20 is vastly less than A XF40. Barber halves in particular seem to be either VF20 or XF40. Check Ebay and you will see this is so. For me a VF35 looks like a XF40, but may technically be missing a key grading element of the higher XF40, such as the complete band under LIBERTY. VF is the most abused grade in the scale.

Tyler

fcloud

Yes the 35 grade should be used. A coin that just misses 40, should not be bumped all the way down to 30 or 20.

ARCO

Here is a good example. It is a 1900-O Barber half that I have graded VF35. Overall it looks almost XF, with complete reverse wing feather detail, but the band under LIBERTY is not complete. This date comes often with a weaker strike...so maybe it really is XF40!! LOL





Actually I just needed an excuse to post a barber photo!

Merc

ARCO,
I love your barber half. I'm trying to finish a circulated set myself.

The Barber series is one I can see the difference between a EF40 and a VF35. I would say your coin is an Ef40. I look for the feathers in the wing tips. The wing tips will be complete on an EF40 and will be worn at the tips on a VF35. I can't define a VF35, but I know it when I see it for a Barber. Still, I have seen ANACS graded Barbers with Ef 40 on the holder but the wing tips are worn so it is only a VF35. For other series, it is really hard to see why is it a VF35 and not a 40.

Has anyone had a VF35 upgraded?

DennisH

Merc:

I hope your question wasn't limited to Barbers...

I had a rare Morgan variety go up from PCGS-35 to PCGS-40 through Presidential Review. Also, I currently own an 1889-CC Morgan that I bought after it went up from PCGS-35 to PCGS-40. The silly thing looks like XF45... the person who originally got the VF35 grade was probably PO'd to the max!!!

-- Dennis

originalisbest

Beautiful half ARCO! Were you selling that to me I could accept it as an XF based on overall impressions, especially given the strike characteristics of the date. But whatever its technical grade, a beautiful coin.

Merc

Thanks Dennis. I was hoping to hear that others had upgraded VF35 coins to Ef40. I do not think it is a good grade to use in many series. It is almost like a high end MS64. Is it really a 64 or was it misgraded and it is really a 65? I think with the price jump, many coins graded VF35 will be cracked out to get an EF40.

clw54

Here's a PCGS VF35

ARCO

I bought the 1900-O from Steve Estes as a VF30! I also picked up this fantastic looking 1899-O also graded VF30 By Steve. I grade the 1899-O as an XF40.

I purchased 25 Barber halves from Steve Estes and his grading was either right on or he erred on the conservative side. It was a very happy day for me!

Tyler





CLW - I really dig the 1909-S VDB. Great chocolate color.

clw54

Thanks, ARCO.

Dave99B

Arco, I'll pay top dollar F12 money for that 1899-O! Send it!

Dave

grip

The 1899-0 looks to be graded correct.Al

Coin Finder

It seems to me that if you are a dealer or a buyer, VF 35 is in most cases a vf 20 or just VF no more no less.

Tbig

Robgetty

If you don't like VF35 (a legitimate grade with the large spread between
VF and XF condition), why aren't you going for AU 53 and AU 58?

BAJJERFAN

Actually I beleive the ef aka xf should extend to 53 and the au range include only 55 and 58 numbers. 53's really have too much wear to be considered almost uncirculated when you think about it.

jonesy

I just wish PCGS would show all circulated grades on their population report!!

nwcs

Sure it should be used, when appropriate.

jdimmick

Damn Tyler, ease up with those nice original Barber Half's. Just kiddin, Its nice to look at them.

I think the Vf-35 grade is well merited. I call it the very finest of the very fine! I like the look of a lot of original Vf-35 Coins, they have the appearance of an XF, but just may be missing a tad of something.

I dont currently own a VF-35 coin as graded, but I did own a 16-d merc Vf-35, wasnt a 40, but a nice super high end Vf !


jim d

I think Tyler's halves and the 09-s are both good examples! Way solid highend VF's, but just not quite XF-40

Baley

I'm a big fan of VF30 and 35 coins, often the coin can be acquired for a VF20 price.
A VF 35 coin has most of the detail and can be very eye appealing, if the coin is old and/or very rare.

coinkat

Yes it should be used and I also have some Morgans that fall into the VF35 range. While this discussion has primarily focused on Barbers and Morgans (and that is okay...) but it is needed as grade with Seated Dollars, half dollars and quarters and not to mention earlier type coins. VF35 is perhaps one of the most misunderstood grades with respect to circulated coin coins.

mgoodm3

I have a 1911 Barber half ICG VF35. It seems pretty accurate to me. Just about but not quite EF.

berylcoin

This Capped Bust Half Dime is a PCGS VF35. I'm not sure I could find an XF40 I'd trade it for. If I cared I would try for an upgrade. Maybe if I conserved it first...



BC

hookooekoo

I frequently assign VF35 grades to the circulated Merc's we've been collecting. I have come across several that have looked much better than the ANA description for VF30, but they just don't meet the exact qualifications for EF-40.