1969 Topps Brock

LuxuryWines · August 25, 2003 12:10AM

OK ,

I know this card is tough to find with a population of 22 in PSA 8 NQ and no PSA 9's.............. But ouch $366! Here is a link to the auction

1969 Topps Brock PSA 8

Are these bidders thinkingthis has a shot for a 9 on a resubmit or is this normal pricing for a Lou Brock?

Here is a copy of the scan (awesome card but....)

Thoughts?????

acowa · August 25, 2003 12:49AM

The centering on that card is outstanding compared to 99% of the 1969 Brocks. If a 1969 Shannon can go for $500...this seems reasonable.

Regards,

Alan

RayBShotz · August 25, 2003 12:51AM

LW - This is a very nice example of the Brock. A premier tough, tough card in the 69' set. Although this auction is big bucks I dont see prices coming down for this card any time soon.
Between off centering, diamond cutting, out of focus and print snow this card often shows one or more of those flaws as the norm. A clean decently centered Brock is truly a rarity in this issue. The POP would seem to argue differently but a lot of these cards are buried in sets of Cardinal collectors, Brock fans, HOF collectors and those of us caught up in the 69' chase.
For selfish reasons I would hope the price comes down...cause' I still still need this one :-)
RayB69Topps

acowa · August 25, 2003 1:08AM

It's probably not a 9. Look at the bottom rhs and upper lhs of the back. You can see the touch. There also appears to be a stain on the back near his 1967 stats (the N in NL).

DaveRead · August 25, 2003 1:09AM

My guess is we'll end up at $500+ this afternoon. I think this is only the second PSA 8 Brock to surface on ebay in the last 18 months. For a pop 22 card, it is definitely not highly traded. As Ray said, they must all be buried in the Brock and HOF registry sets. I went through several thousand raw 69's last year looking for just Brock and Melton cards, and couldn't find any with decent centering. I guess if a common PSA 10 Chuck Harrison #116 can sell for $711 with three bidders over $660 (8 PSA 9's out there), a tough HOF'er could go for $500+ in PSA 8.

spacktrack · August 25, 2003 1:40AM

I am building the 1969 set in raw form and have been surprised to see how there is a correalation between low pop cards and their availability in raw form. I know this is obvious, but I mean it in a way that I don't think is clear. I am down to my last 50 or so cards and I am not concerned about condition. I went to the East Coast National last week and sifted through thousands of cards looking for some of the last commons that I needed. I always thought that the low pops were low pops because of notoriously bad centering or printing defects that plagued that card. I didn't think it would be any problem to find them in bad condition in some dealer's commons box. At the last dealer's table I was able to nail down a Mike Shannon, with bad centering of course, and a Lee Elia. I still can't find a Brock in any condition. I guess that's what makes these sets so interesting.

gemint · August 25, 2003 1:44AM

The card's centering is astounding. I think it's better centered than mine which is the nicest '69 Brock I have come across to date. I agree with others that this card is not PSA 9 quality. The left edge appears to have some chipping, the corners have light touches and the reverse near the player profile box has black print smudges. I had one that appeared NM-MT quality that would not get an 8 on two attempts. I think it downgraded due to that print smudge (which was worse than this example).

I think the card will finish very stong. I'll guess $550. I've seen about five of the eights out there (aside from the one I own) and they were all barely 8s. They were all in the 65-35 to 70-30 centering range and most had a soft corner. A few I considered sliders (NM+). Good luck to all who may be bidding. Since it has exceeded my standing offer price for the card, I'll be sitting on the sidelines watching with interest.

gemint · August 25, 2003 1:44AM

By the way, does anyone know who is in the batting cage behind Brock on this card?

FB · August 25, 2003 1:51AM

I can tell you that I have one of the 8's and its actually a 6 in an 8 holder. It makes this one look like a 10!

Robby · August 25, 2003 2:19AM

I agree with Alan , this card has outstanding centering ! I,ve been noticing alot of strong demand for the 69's on E-Bay lately ! Must be alot of set builders going after the same cards ! A Brock in Psa 8 in the latest SMR HAS IT FOR $ 150.00 + ......... the '69 I have is s/o L-R and T-B - Would probably grade mine at a 6 ! Robby

acowa · August 25, 2003 2:35AM

What are the odds that this was cut from a sheet recently?

Regards,

Alan

Robby · August 25, 2003 5:44AM

LuxuryWine , This card did'nt go as high as the Brock , but at least you knew why . #512 - Cleo Jones Psa 8 sold for $370.00 a couple days ago on E-Bay - only pop of (4 ) 8's with none higher ! On the other hand , there was a Willie Horton #180 -Psa 8 that sold for $103.50 ....... pop. of ( 22 ) 8's and ( 2 ) 9's and ( 1 ) 10 ........ the 69's are going crazy ! Robby

AlanAllen · August 25, 2003 6:04AM

<< <i>What are the odds that this was cut from a sheet recently?

Regards,

Alan >>

I doubt it. The chipping on the lower left front border and the one weak back corner make it look legit. Of course, it could just be a very very good job

Joe

acowa · August 25, 2003 6:30AM

Where was Dave Jacobs? I kept waiting/hoping for him to take this one over.

Regards,

Alan

dude · August 25, 2003 6:40AM

$585.03

gemint · August 25, 2003 6:47AM

I was pretty close. This is more than 2x the highest I've ever seen one sell for. It makes mine look like a steal at $230.

4 different bidders over $400!!! The market is definitely strong for low pop 1969s.

DaveRead · August 25, 2003 6:48AM

Ok, you're down to that last card to complete a 69 set in 8+, and it's Brock that you need. Do you put in that carte blanche $1,000 snipe bid to ensure that you get it? $2 insurance, guess the seller had no clue what the card would sell for.

gemint · August 25, 2003 8:29AM

I remember WIWAG sold a Brock 8 a few years back for $75. They sold it off their website and I just missed getting it. Based on future events, I'm glad I didn't get it. So some people actually don't know how tough this card is. The SMR update occured within the last few months. Maybe it's time to bump the price up already?

Buy the way, what do you think a 9 would sell for? I have a few 1st series cellos sitting around that I look at from time to time wondering if there's a perfectly centered Brock hiding inside. Of course, I got zero 9s on the cello I did open.

OhioTaz · August 25, 2003 9:06AM

Just a stab in the dark but a PSA 9 Brock would have to be worth an Aaron in PSA 9 given the scarcity of the card and Lou's "star status". $2K is SMR for a PSA 9 Aaron. I think that sounds about right for Lou.

Sandy

FB · August 25, 2003 9:30AM

Especially if Gaspipe is bidding!

Virtualizard · August 25, 2003 9:37AM

<< <i>...Buy the way, what do you think a 9 would sell for? I have a few 1st series cellos sitting around that I look at from time to time wondering if there's a perfectly centered Brock hiding inside. Of course, I got zero 9s on the cello I did open.

>>

OPEN IT ... OPEN IT ... OPEN IT ... OPEN IT ... OPEN IT ... OPEN IT ... OPEN IT ... OPEN IT ...

I guarantee you that you will pull a Brock PSA 9 quality card.

I couldn't sit on unopened '60s material. How do you do it?

JEB.

gemint · August 25, 2003 11:42AM

I just tell myself all the cards are OC and I'm better off leaving it sealed. Based on past results, I'm usually right. The more unopened material that's opened, the less incentive there is to open the rest of it as the opened packs will result in increased high grade populations and will also result in less legitimate unopened surviving, thus enhancing its value. eventually the equation will no longer work out in that it will be nearly impossible to recoup your money by breaking vintage packs.

downgoesfrazier · August 25, 2003 12:11PM

Have to chime in here. While not a '69 collector, this Brock is a stunner and worth every penny. I did read something with great interest here and thought you guys might find this humbling moment humerous...

I read that a Cleon sold for 370 in NM/MT 8 recently. I'm thinking, I've got a raw Mint 9 sitting in a CS1 that's perfectly centered and vending fresh with unimproveable image and surfaces...part of my AS Rookie collection (first clue for you '69 guys that I was confused)... So as I'm half-way through my stack of '69s and get to my Koosman...I realize then that I'm thinking of my '67 Cleon...talk about going from the penthouse to the $hitter in a hurry! I've been so wrapped up the 70's this past 18 months I'm out of touch with the pops...but I sure did scurry when I read that 370...maybe it's time to holder that '67 anyway...

Gemint, here's one for you...
I had four '77 wax boxes on my closet floor. I paid 800 bucks for ALL of them in the early 90's. That's when I started building my '77 set. One night I broke down and cracked a box ... Five. Five stinkin' mint cards (and not exactly blazers, either) lurked within'. I've kept the others sealed (I've dipped a pack here-pack there-yielding notta!). My kids and I will enjoy breaking them when they get a little older. A sealed wax box today sells for roughly 800 bucks...that's roughly 170 bucks per low-end 9...boo-yah!

dude · August 25, 2003 12:16PM

This '69 Brock PSA 8 was truly an exceptional example. I did have a very competitive bid on this card and it obviously fell short. The agonizing thing about auctions like this is that I knew it would go extremely high and it would take a very competitive bid to win it. Looking back on it now, I wish I had put in a $650+ bid. I guess only time will tell if this is the best example ever. And who knows, maybe the winning bidder will sell it in a year or two. The "lifers" (people who hold on to their cards indefinitely) are definitely a minority in this hobby.

gemint · August 25, 2003 12:30PM

Don't get discouraged Dan. I'm sure there will be more strong PSA 8 Brocks in the future. There's still a fair amount of unopened out there which may yield a few 8s and maybe (gasp) a 9. Mark Murphy broke a 1st series cello box a few years ago which is where I purchased my three packs. I think Ron Sanders owns a handful of rack packs. And I see 1st series wax packs from time to time. I wouldn't be surprised if a 1st series wax box appears on Mastro in the future. A first series vending box was opened a few years back and it yielded the PSA 10 Aaron and the first PSA 10 Clemente. But apparently no MINT Brock.

I bought my Brock in December of 2000 from an eBayer that had a feedback of about 30. After I sent payment I saw the dreaded "no longer a registered user" message next to his name. Fortunately the card arrived a few days later. The seller disappeared, never to be seen again.

Perhaps the higher book price will encourage more submissions of that card.

ABBAdad · August 25, 2003 1:05PM

I was the seller on that '69 Cleon Jones that went for $370. I must say that I was a bit surprised at the price. I knew it was a low pop, but I figured it would top out in the $125 to $150 range. I haven't heard a peep from the buyer yet, but he has good feedback so it should transact soon.

David

gemint · August 25, 2003 1:27PM

I believe the last '69 Cleon Jones sold for around $225-$250. I'm sure the buyer will come through.

gaspipe26 · August 25, 2003 8:07PM

The 1969 Yaz #130 in which there are 2 was sold for over $2000 on 2 separate occasions. If a Brock 9 popped up at auction I wouldnt hesitate to bid over $2500.

FB · August 26, 2003 2:29AM

See what I mean????

rw2win · August 26, 2003 3:07AM

I'm not an expert in the 69 area...

....but here is another.
GAI 1969 Brock
Centering is not near as nice as the PSA example that just sold.

SportscardAdvocate · August 26, 2003 5:34AM

By the way, does anyone know who is in the batting cage behind Brock on this card?

I'm going to guess either Phil Gagliano, Dal Maxvill, or Ed Spiezio.

Tried to figure it out assuming the picture was from the 68 campaign (potentially flawed logic) and the right handed batters (non-pitchers).

My best bet is Gagliano.

1969 Topps Brock

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