Great Rarity In Some 1932-1964 Brilliant Coins?

wondercoin

I posted this on the US Coin Forum as well.

This discussion is aimed at super high grade silver coins dated 1932-1964. Of course, most post-1965 coins in high grade are brilliant and many pre-1932 coins are brilliant as well. But, let's try to keep the discussion focused on the super high grade 1932-1964 coins for the purpose of this thread.

First, let me mention that I am a big fan of toned coins. My personal collection contains toned coin after toned coin - I love them. But, I also love and appreciate great rarities - and I have seen how in some coins, the greatest rarity is to locate a fully brilliant example of the particular coin in super high grade.

It appears there are many great brilliant rarities in this era, which price guides, for example do not pick up on at all. For example, take the Wash Quarter series. A coin like a 1957(p) in PCGS-MS67 is roughly a $100 coin. Every example I have ever encountered is toned. I do not believe I have ever come across a fully brilliant PCGS-MS67 1957(p) quarter - have you? I would happily pay 10x the going rate for a brilliant coin if I was offered one. The same is true for a coin such as the 1952(p) Wash quarter in PCGS-MS67. I have never heard of a fully brilliant coin existing in grades higher than PCGS-MS66 for that date.

The same is true for the Franklin series, although it has received a bit more "press" through the work of Rick T. For example, a coin like the 1957(p) Franklin in PCGS-MS66FBL is roughly a $150 coin, but a blast white one - well - I just conducted a 10 year search on Teletrade and a fully brilliant coin does not appear to have ever been offered in their auctions in the past 10 years!! I noticed Rick T. had one offered at nearly $4,000 on his site - at least 20x the price of a typical mint set toned coin. His analysis of the great rarity differences makes perfect sense to me.

In the Franklin series, a coin like the 55(p) has nearly 100 graded in the top grade of MS66FBL. I have never seen a fully brilliant 1955(p) Franklin offered in PCGS-MS66FBL - have you? Assuming a 1955(p) in PCGS-MS66FBL is say a $400 coin in MS66FBL, what would the blast white 1955(p) command? Since it gets no additional Registry points - perhaps less than it should?

Roosevelt Dimes in PCGS-MS68FB were also near impossible to locate in blast white for years, except a few have recently been graded. But, coins like the 49(p) Roosie in PCGS-MS67FB should continue to prove to be a very difficult coin to locate in blast white, to name just one.

Again, the great rarity of brilliant coins is seldom reflected in a price guide (and certainly not in the Registry points). For example, take that 1957(p) quarter I mentioned in PCGS-MS67 blast white vs. toned. The toned price might be $100 and the brilliant price might be $1000. Yet, the price guide will generally reflect only the typical mint set toned coin at $100.

Take the time to study the rarity differences between brilliant coins and toned silver coins from the 1932-64 era and you may be able to build a wonderful collection of a few MONSTER BLAST WHITE rarities to place side by side along with the MONSTER TONED beauties.

Have you also encountered some super scarce blast white silver coins from this era in high grade?

Wondercoin

wondercoin

Craig: I was really fortunate to slab (2) 51(d) brilliant Wash quarters in PCGS-MS67 since the time I started collecting. They are exceedingly difficult to obtain in brilliant - well, they are tough in any form!

The 39(s) is another great coin blast white. I presently own the R. Green blast white one, with his pedigree on it. It is a prize coin too

Wondercoin

Cocoinut

I completed the basic Washington silver set a year and a half ago, and prefer white coins in that series. Some of the dates that I've found to be elusive above MS65 in an undipped white state are the 1949-P, 1953-D, and 1956-D. All of the 1956-D coins that I've seen in PCGS MS66 have been not very attractively toned. White MS65's are easy enough, and I even bought an original roll of them, and found just 2 coins that might make MS66 if the graders are in a good mood. Ido have a white '56-D in an NGC MS66 holder, but my Registry set still holds an ugly splotchy gray coin in a PCGS MS66 holder.

The '49-P and '53-D can exhibit attractive colorful toning, but in my experience toned pieces far outnumber white ones in PCGS MS66 white.

Jim

Typetone

My question is why are white pieces so difficult to find for some dates. My guess is that most of the better quality 50s mint state silver pieces came in the cardboard govt holders which quickly toned the coins. To get a white coin, one had to dip a toned piece or hope for that rare high grade in a roll. Well, the dipped pieces usually don't get the high grades because some of the luster is lost. Thus the rarity. Is that the correct reason?

Should white coins be more valuable for the dates in question. Well, that is a supply and demand question. If there is a separate demand for white and toned coins, then the rare date white coins should trade at a big premium. If no one really cares if they get a nice toned piece or a whie piece, then the price should be comparable.

Greg

wondercoin

"Is that the correct reason?"


Greg: Perhaps that and the additional reason that toning tends to hide marks better than "bare" surfaces.

Wondercoin

oreville

Another aspect to investigate: PCGS was very hesitant to give very high mint state grades to toned coins of the 1932-64 era until the last few years. In fact, toned and brilliant coins were once equally scarce per the pop reports but now, brilliant coins are indeed much scarcer than toned coins in many (even most) of the dates/mm.

One more aspect to investigate: Take the 1950 year. No mint sets were issued. Yet, in the Franklin series, toned MS-66FBL coins remain more common than their brilliant uncirculated counterparts (once known as BU's :-) ) So in this case, where did all of the toned Frankies come from?