1970 - 1975 psa 8's

tribeman

Is the market for 70 - 75 psa 8's dead or what? I don't know what would make it come around if anything. What I don't get is why anyone would still be sending in these cards unless they were really expecting nearly all 9's. WIth the exception of the few really low pop cards in each set, they can usually be found on ebay etc. for around 5 bucks each sometimes less. By the time you pay for shippping to and from PSA, you've got nearly 8 bucks in 70 - 74's and more than 6 bucks in the 75's when you submit your own. I'm not sure what the remedy is, but if they continue to be soft, I wonder if eventually a psa 8 set of 1975 topps or '74 or '73 for that matter will not sell for much of a premium over a nice MN-MT raw set. Have any complete '75 psa 8 sets ever sold for the 4000 grading costs? I've got 100's of nice cards from each of the sets of the 70's that would grade mostly 8's with some 9's and if I can buy them already graded for a few bucks, I may never send them in, instead just keep building very nice MN-MT raw sets. Where does everyone else see this market going?

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BBCexchange recently sold a group of (124) 1970 baseball psa 8 commons for $1245.00 on eBay.

mikeschmidt

It's a push, pull system. Right now there is much more supply than demand. As prices realized stay down, there are less submissions. Thus, supply will eventually go down, prices will go up, etc.

Classic efficent market action going on. Right now there is an oversupply, but it probably will not stay that way, unless there is another $5 special that causes populations to increase significantly again.

mcastaldi

Tribeman> A couple of points -

"What I don't get is why anyone would still be sending in these cards unless they were really expecting nearly all 9's."

Well, from the perspective of a dealer I would agree, you're going to have a tough go of selling them off. But. . . if I'm building a set, there are lots of reasons to submit these cards for the set you're collecting. 1) If you're good at screening your cards, you're going to get a certain percentage of 9s. These 9s from your own submission will almost always cost you less than if you were to get them on eBay. The savings will almost always make up for any cards that cost you a bit more to submit. These 9s can either be used to upgrade your set or be traded off for multiple PSA8s - which drops the overall cost of submitting. 2) If I have an example of a card in PSA8 that I'm not totally happy with, I can always find a better one and submit my own. This leaves you with a known quantity where something you get from eBay may or may not be an improvement. On the other hand, if you care only about the number on the holder then this won't matter to you. 3) Many collectors feel a certain degree of pride in knowing that they personally found a high percentage of the cards in my set as raw and are from their own submissions.

As for your questions about a 75T set. . .there's currently only one complete 1975 set with every card in PSA8 or better. Last time I talked to Frank, he wasn't interested in selling. Two other people have done a complete 75 set in all PSA8 or better, but have since sold off a card or two here and there. Both of these sets are still about 90% or better complete - so they weren't even sold as a partial set, just a card or two here and there. So in the way you ask it, it's impossible to provide an answer. But. . .as has been discussed quite frequently on the forum, if you're looking to maximize your return it's almost never a good idea to sell a graded set as a complete unit. You'll almost always get more money by breaking up the set and selling singles or smaller groups.

Mike

Vargha

A PSA 8 set from 1975 would definitely sell for over $4K. In fact, I will pay $5K right now to anyone who will sell just such a set to me.

helionaut

I can tell you there's a market for 318 particular 1975 Topps cards right here. I don't study all those years, but one rule I've found to hold true is that the more there is on offer, the stronger the market is. Offer things that most people don't have and you'll see some activity. Right now there are under 100 cards that come up on my 1975 ebay search, some of which are almost always available, and some of which are SSPC, so things seem down. At moments like this when there are relatively few cards on offer, the dross of the set naturally tends to be a higher percentage and gives a picture of a stagnant market. But a couple weeks ago when there were over 200 lots with many having pops in the teens, things seemed more active.

I've thought about selling my set as a whole, or at least offering it as a whole with a good reserve, once complete, just to see what it would bring. While the consensus is that a relatively young set like 1975 wouldn't bring any premium at all, I have to wonder. Since it's never been offered before (to my knowlege), it could be very profitable. I know what I've paid down to the penny, but if time is money, as they say, my set must be worth $10,000 by now.

Synthsense

Well, what do all of you think should be the standard selling price for a PSA 8 card from a 70's set? Everybody on this board conveys the message that thier are plenty of 9's out there, so why should I buy a 8 when I can get a 9 for a little bit more. I am currently building a 1979 Topps baseball set in PSA 9 and when I first started out I was happy with a 8. Then the dealers that I bought the 8's from starting selling thier 9's to me for about 3-7 dollars more. They also conveyed the message that the 9's are nice and they are out there. Guess what? I have not bought a 8 for 6 months and I have started the set over in PSA 9 and further flooded the market on 79 PSA's 8 due to me listening to the dealers ramblings and listing the cards on Ebay. I was paying around $5 dollars for an 8 now I am paying $7 for 9's. If you want the prices to go up on the 8's or let alone have someone buy them, dealers need to make it sound like it is a desirable grade.

norty

I'm not sure I'd include 70 and 71 in with the other 70's sets. I've had nice returns on those. You could, however, stick 69's in with them.

Wabittwax

I emailed PSA about possibly changing their 1975-present $6 bulk rate to 1972-present becuase 1972's and later are not even getting grading fees for 8's anymore. I didn't get a response (but I didn't really expect to get one). I'm sitting on 300 1974's right now that will produce tons of 9's but if I have to take a loss on 8's, I'll just keep waiting.

helionaut

Synthsense:
I bought my first graded 1975 card in 2/02, at a time when it was fairly common to see 8s sell for $25 or more, and an baseline of $10-12, because the populations were so low, and there were a lot of cards that had pops of zero. Being a person of no deep pockets, I decided I'd pick up 7s, cheap 8s and save my bucks for HOFers and the like. But building a 600+ card 1970s set is a long haul; now there are many 9s that sell for only a little more than what 8s used to sell for. So, much like you experienced with the 1979s, if I had known that the amount of submissions would grow so fast and the pops of 8s and 9s with it, I wouldn't have bothered with the 7s to begin with.

I don't think there can be a "standard selling price" because each year is different, and especially since the capricious and fickle market on ebay is the main barometer. If slabbed cards were the standard in card shops and shows, then baseline prices would be easier to gauge. Even the bulk grading price is only a very rough rule for pricing. A 1970 8 will usually bring say $7, while a 1979 8 would be very lucky to get $7, simply because in the decade of the 70s there were many changes in the hobby that raise the expected condition standards. With the disappearance of series, there was equal population and equal production values for all cards, with a few well-known exceptions. Plus the card market grew (all those baby boomers having their own kids), meaning greater production. And by the late 70s there was a strengthening hobby infrastructure with dedicated card shops appearing in many cities, so many cards were handled by people who had a vested interest in maintaining condition, not flipping contests. By 1979, most of the pitfalls of collecting in the 1950s and 1960s were gone. So I would definitely expect the populations of 9s for 1974 and later sets to grow and become more affordable.

I guess the moral of the story is that, with the exception of the very toughest cards, no matter how many players might join the game, there will always be enough cards to go around. Eventually, you'll find the card you want at the price you want to pay.

mcastaldi

Helionaut> I started my 75 set just a bit earlier than you. I started picking up 75s around 12/01. Like you, my pockets aren't all that deep. Rather than accept 7s from eBay, I found that I could keep my prices down by submitting as much of my set as possible. At the time, this was an attractive thing to do because the market wasn't nearly so flooded and you could sell off your duplicates at a small profit. I still am a big fan of submitting your own cards. At the moment you won't make a profit on any duplicates you may get, but submitting your own cards is probably the best way to ensure you end up with an example you're happy with each and every time. If you care only about the number on the holder, then the only reason to submit on your own would be to try to get the low-pop stuff.

Mike